jeffbrig

The thread about the GT3 getting a manual got me to thinking... we all know a PDK is faster, and the manual is more engaging. But I've been debating which one I'd prefer in my next car...

As much as I'll likely be tarred and feathered for saying it, I'm seriously considering a PDK in my next Porsche...when I eventually replace the Cayman. I've long been a member of the "save the manuals" club, and have had a manual in my primary car since I first learned how to drive. But my Cayman is making me start to rethink whether I want to try a PDK. It's not traffic and shifting hassles either. I'm have 25 years experience driving manuals pretty much every day without issue. If I want to drive so smoothly that you won't know I shifted, I can do that.

But what I'm finding more and more in a high hp car (for those that don't know, my Cayman is turbocharged) is that I struggle at shifting smoothly when driving the car in anger. The problem is that in everyday driving, you're pretty much loafing around at 3 or 4/10ths. Then you go to an autox or track day where you're going to drive at 9/10ths. You engage sport mode (which changes the throttle sensitivity), put PASM to sport mode, and now you're shifting from full throttle. This is different enough from my everyday driving that my day to day shifting experience simply doesn't carry over. I'm talking about my inability to consistently nail smooth, crisp, quick shifts between 2-3-4 when driving at full throttle. My feet just aren't quite in sync to do this as smoothly as I expect to be. Sure, I nail some of my shifts perfectly. But I also miss often enough that it's not rewarding like you would want it to be. I'm not banging/grinding gears, just not engaging/disengaging as smoothly as I should be. I don't have this problem in a lower hp car like the S2000, because you there isn't the same massive gap between how you can drive it on the street vs how you drive on the track.

It's a bit frustrating, to be perfectly honest. Just not enough practice driving the car hard to stay good at it. And practicing with full throttle shifts and sport mode engaged on public roads isn't exactly a bright idea in a powerful car. Contrast that to a PDK, which is going to shift better and faster than any human. Drive casually when you want, or beat on it when you want, the PDK is going to do whatever you ask of it.

I suppose part of this might be my admission that a 3000lb car doesn't really need 450hp on the street. I think my ideal car in a few years will be a Cayman/Boxster GTS with ~370hp and a PDK. I have no doubt Porsche is bringing it...and it would probably be just as fast as the one I'm driving today - straight line or on the track.

white98ls

I'm still die-hard manual. Taking that away is taking away part of the enjoyment and challenge of driving for me. It's like a golf club that automatically rotates the club face or violin that auto-tunes its pitch - sure it's easier to have a good time, but it's less satisfying to pursue and ultimately reach that goal of a perfect swing, note, or shift. Furthermore, I simply get bored with two pedals in daily driving, plain and simple. I start driving like a deranged a-hole because I don't have enough to keep me entertained and busy.

I will admit that there is a certain point in performance where it probably makes sense - it would be silly for instance to think an F1 car would be manageable, let alone enjoyable, with a manual. But where that point lies for me, I have yet to discover as I haven't driven anything faster than a mid-12 1/4 mile car and that didn't make me feel like I couldn't manage a manual.

QUIKAG

My next Porsche will be PDK. That said, I hope to ALWAYS have a manual car in the household for that fix. Keeping the ZR1 for those duties at this time.

The PDK is just too good IMHO to pass up for me. If I have the option with the 991.2 GT3, I'll be one of the losers getting the PDK. I'm sure it'll hurt my resale value, but whatever. Same thing with my 18 way sport seats in the GT4. Since I don't have the vaunted buckets, some people think the car is un-driveable. It cracks me up. The 18 ways are incredibly comfy seats that do have a lot of support when you inflate all the bolsters.

rogue3092

I drive my Cayman S primarily on the street, including some blasts along curvy mountain roads, with some occasional auto-x use. I don't think I could ever give up a manual for such situations - it's so much more engaging and rewarding than even a dual clutch gearbox. That said, if you do serious track work, a PDK makes a TON of sense. If I had room in the garage for another, purely track oriented car, I would definitely choose a PDK.

CosmosMpower

PDK/DCT bores me to tears. After having it in my GT-R and E90 M3 I don't think I'll ever get a sporty car with one again. Maybe for a family car, commuter sure. I love my 6MT GT3, M3 and M2, so much fun to drive on the street and on the track. Driving consists of only steering, brakes/throttle application and shifting. Take away shifting/operating a clutch and that's 25% of the driving experience gone.

mosesbotbol

PDK is neat. I dig the kick down feature and being able shift on either side of steering wheel, but I am not out to win races so I'd rather have the manual...

adrs2k

I love DSG in a daily because it offers a lot of flexibility and is still somewhat fun, but I dont think I would want it in my sports car. I get a big grin when I jump back in the S2000 and do a couple heel toe downshifts.

hirev

As much as I love shifting myself i see your point. My point is that in the right car... the car being designed as an automatic only.......meaning this: I just got and brought back from the dead a jaguar Xk8 convertible, a 99, this car is an automatic and it suits the car just perfectly, I cannot imagine a touring car like this with a manual and because it's an automatic and a jag I drive it differently than my S2000 or any other car I have with a manual. It's old tech and only a 5 speed, but it's silky smooth married to a silky smooth 4.0 v8....and it weights in at maybe 4000 lbs, again not agile, so a manual was never offered.

Now I had a 2013 335i m sport, in manual , that car is not designed to have a manual any longer, and when driving it you get rev hang and other weird stuff ....I also drove the pdk, right trans for that car.

so a car properly laid out with a manual by design, or an automatic by design is perfect...keeping in mind that PDK trans requires some expensive maintenance eventually.

I also see your point about street hp....I also have a f80 425 plus hp m3, can't use that power under 40 mph as there is too much torque and you just spin the wheels, however on a track or highway it's the bomb. No such things as a perfect car, but the m3 with a properly designed from the start manual is heaven, even on the street....

cdelena

I love shifting the S2000 but have been in many nice cars where the shifter is not a joy. I will probably buy PDK or similar from now on.

vader1

My Cayman is a manual, on purpose. I have driven PDK, and also my Bimmer's 8spd is a very fast (but not quite PDK fast) transmission with paddles.

When I got my bimmer, I thought the auto would be fun enough with the paddles and I really appreciated it in stop and go traffic. It is pretty smooth shifting and quick and has plenty of gears.

That was three years ago. I feel myself fairly bored in the car even though it is very pleasant to drive. It just is not as engaging as a manual. I think about replacing it as a daily often and for a car with a manual.

I don't care that the PDK version of the Cayman I bought is quicker, it is less "fun" to me and that is what counts. Besides if I were to keep the car for 20 years (as I think I will) and it stumbles into being collectable, it would probably be more sought after as one of the few manuals sold and the last of the long since disappeared transmission.

I have in my head several scenarios for when I pay off the Cayman and re-arrange the stable. Most include getting a daily that is a manual be it GTi, Golf R, M2, 240i or whatever even though in every case the auto will now be faster. There is one scenario I get a daily that is auto and that is if I pick up a second Porsche, but then the bad weather/Home Depot third car would probably be a GTi hatch with a manual. In all cases, two out of the three cars I would own would be a stick. I am 47, and can't remember the last time I raced somebody so the performance gain does nothing for me.

Now I may start getting into the track situation on occasion. I am signing up for my track's school this summer and my first time out. A PDK is supposedly always in the right gear and would improve my lap times. But on the other hand, I am not going to go to the track to compete or beat people, only to enjoy the drive and improve my skills and "oneness" with the machine so I can say for sure until I try it, but I think even for the track I would still want the manual even if it were slower. I want to learn to heel and toe properly, and always be in the right gear. That is part of the fun instead of having PDK do it for me. My $.02.