MaxLife - a sleeper oil, and a decent additive
03-09-2004, 06:04 PM
#1
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MaxLife - a sleeper oil, and a decent additive
Been meaning to "out" this product.
There have been a bunch of "high-mileage" products - is this just marketing BS? And are they the same?
No, and no.
Valvoline's MaxLife is a very sophisticated lubricant, and a killer deal when bought on sale. It is a very good choice for higher mileage cars of any manufacturer, but certainly for S2000's with 50K or more. I use it in my Outback.
It is between 12 and 22% synthetic! Not just a Group III hydrocracked synthetic, but the real deal. A sizeable portion of the synthetic is likely an ester, which is the "seal conditioning" agent. ML also is high in zinc anti-wear compounds for an SL-rated oil. It also has higher amounts of friction modifiers and detergents.
They also make an additive that is of interest to S2000 owners, especially if you are considering changing out the "break-in" oil. The additive has much higher levels of moly than found in motor oils, around 5% by weight. It also has higher levels of zinc than found in the SL-rated oils Honda recommends. It seems logical to me that Honda wants those compounds in the oil during break-in, but wants to "protect" its catalytic converters over the long haul, which SL-rated oils do by limiting the zinc/phosphorous anti-wear components. The MaxLife additive also has high levels of detergents which would be a benefit in a new engine to suspend the assembly materials that often get into the inititial fill. That is one reason why some of us would like to change out the oil at 1K miles.
I looked at Pennzoil's High Mileage product and it is not in the same league. It is just a forified version of their regular 10w30.
There have been a bunch of "high-mileage" products - is this just marketing BS? And are they the same?
No, and no.
Valvoline's MaxLife is a very sophisticated lubricant, and a killer deal when bought on sale. It is a very good choice for higher mileage cars of any manufacturer, but certainly for S2000's with 50K or more. I use it in my Outback.
It is between 12 and 22% synthetic! Not just a Group III hydrocracked synthetic, but the real deal. A sizeable portion of the synthetic is likely an ester, which is the "seal conditioning" agent. ML also is high in zinc anti-wear compounds for an SL-rated oil. It also has higher amounts of friction modifiers and detergents.
They also make an additive that is of interest to S2000 owners, especially if you are considering changing out the "break-in" oil. The additive has much higher levels of moly than found in motor oils, around 5% by weight. It also has higher levels of zinc than found in the SL-rated oils Honda recommends. It seems logical to me that Honda wants those compounds in the oil during break-in, but wants to "protect" its catalytic converters over the long haul, which SL-rated oils do by limiting the zinc/phosphorous anti-wear components. The MaxLife additive also has high levels of detergents which would be a benefit in a new engine to suspend the assembly materials that often get into the inititial fill. That is one reason why some of us would like to change out the oil at 1K miles.
I looked at Pennzoil's High Mileage product and it is not in the same league. It is just a forified version of their regular 10w30.
03-09-2004, 09:03 PM
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Very interesting facts...
I've been using Valvoline Durablend 10w30 the last couple of oil changes i have done. Now, i currently have about 60,000 miles on my S2000. Do you think it would be a good idea for my to switch to the Valvoline Maxlife oil rather than their Durablend oil?
I've been using Valvoline Durablend 10w30 the last couple of oil changes i have done. Now, i currently have about 60,000 miles on my S2000. Do you think it would be a good idea for my to switch to the Valvoline Maxlife oil rather than their Durablend oil?
03-10-2004, 06:22 AM
#5
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It is a special and separate product.
Durablend vs MaxLife? - MaxLife is the better product by far. Durablend is like Pennzoil's product - a fortified regular oil with Group III components. ML gas GIV/GV.
Durablend vs MaxLife? - MaxLife is the better product by far. Durablend is like Pennzoil's product - a fortified regular oil with Group III components. ML gas GIV/GV.
03-11-2004, 12:42 PM
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just use Mobil1, which is a Group IV Synthetic oil (PAO) based "polyalphaolefins" oil with Esters (group V) as it's additives.. at Wallyworld, you can find it between 20 and 23 dollars for 5 quarts in the 5 qt jug..
03-11-2004, 03:16 PM
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Well, I went to my local automotive shop today and picked up a case of Valvoline MaxLife 10w30. I first used Mobil 1 when i did oil changes, but after reading everyone's opinion about using a synthetic oil and then changing it out after 3,000 miles is kind of a waste...I decided to switch to Valvoline Durablned the last two oil changes.
Today i got each bottle on sale for $1.89, which is half the cost of Mobil 1. Since my car is about to hit 60,000 miles I think it's a good idea for me to try out this new oil and see if it makes a difference...
Today i got each bottle on sale for $1.89, which is half the cost of Mobil 1. Since my car is about to hit 60,000 miles I think it's a good idea for me to try out this new oil and see if it makes a difference...
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03-11-2004, 03:47 PM
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Originally posted by dundonr
just use Mobil1, which is a Group IV Synthetic oil (PAO) based "polyalphaolefins" oil with Esters (group V) as it's additives.. at Wallyworld, you can find it between 20 and 23 dollars for 5 quarts in the 5 qt jug..
just use Mobil1, which is a Group IV Synthetic oil (PAO) based "polyalphaolefins" oil with Esters (group V) as it's additives.. at Wallyworld, you can find it between 20 and 23 dollars for 5 quarts in the 5 qt jug..
Coupla points:
1) M1 does not have the finest wear rates I have seen. It is consistently good across a wide range of engines. It plays ball with the mfrs by being an SL API oil, but has the lower amounts of AW compounds, and tries to get by on the its base stocks and a phosphorous "replacement" compound. The analyses show that they are not as good as we had hoped. Some companies are keeping Zn, Phos levels high and occasionally including moly. Red Line, Lubrication engineers, and Amsoil are examples.
2) M1 does not make a hi-mileage product, or do they? older cars do have special needs.
3) Oil products vary in effectivity from engine to engine. The Subaru 2.5L is known as a very low wear engine - the WRX even more so. So one would want an oil that perhaps is more shear resistant. Different engines, different needs. I need to study the UOA's of the S2000 more. (I will probably wear oput before my car does).
4) Wallyworld or not, the cost of M1 vs, ML will be 2:1. That is nothing to sneeze at.
5) It really is a waste to have an oil capable of 5-8K regularly (like M1) and then dump it at 5K.
EVERYBODY: I cannot stress the value of UOA; first to get a baseline VOA (virgin oil analysis), then to determine if your OCI (oil change interval) is approrpiate for your car and driving style. The VOA will help any tribologist or talented amateur understand what he or she is getting for their investment.
For example, if the VOA shows >1200 PPM for phos, a coupla hundred PPM for moly, and > 1100 PPM for zinc, high magnesium/calcium levels (detergents, acid buffers), then you have an oil which is likely low wear and capable of going in the 7-12k range OCI.
Some UOA's I have seen:
1) M1 is consistently good, but never spectacularly good
2) Royal Purple is also good, but tends to lose its viscosity very fast. It does not appear to be an EDI (extended drain interval) product, its claims notwithstanding.
3) The 0w40 oils will shear down,. no matter what their base stocks are. Keep your viscosity spread as narrow as conditions permit.
4) GM engines have high copper wear rates.
5) Subaru and Honda seem to make the best engines. Surprise!!!
6) Red Line is above average or higher in nearly all testing, including some cars run very hard. It is always a solid choice.
7) It is always a good idea to change the oil filter at the middle of your OCI, with makeup oil. The insolubles in the oil will be reduced significantly.
8) "Performance" aire filters nearly always produce higher silicon levels in the oil.
9) At about 130k miles, either replace your injectors, or be prepared to lower your OCI. Dirt will eventually damage the pintles, reducing volumetric efficiency and raising fuel dilution of the oil. Even the extended drain oils will become thin.
10) The Camry V6 is the toughest engine on oil i have seen except for...
11) ...the BMW E46!!! This engine is not BMW's finest design.
12) If your car is one those European wonders where they will only change the oil when the computer says so, do your own oil changes. I saw a UOA on a Mercedes at 8843 where the TBN was .43 - it had depleted all its additives, leaving the engine bare naked. Even though the computer did finally catch it, had something one awry (like a bad batch of gas) this engine was set up for some high wear conditions.
13) Although base stocks are important, the additives are more so. UOA's show that using an ester (as much as I like them) but forgoing some AW compounds (like moly) in the process is not giving the protection that the base stocks + the best additives (and forget the API) can offer.
