loserwill

Because I bought one (ABP) in great condition with average mileage for 22.5k a year ago. This car just isn't a European thoroughbred classic like a lot of Honda fans want it to be. Be glad it hasn't depreciated much at all, but don't get crazy thinking this is an E30 M3 or 993 911.

Vanishing Point

So sell your CR for what you paid for it and buy a massed produced less reliable German car. You seem to have settled for less than you wanted, so sell it.

loserwill

I think you misunderstand my point. The fact that this car is rare does not change the fact that, as a Honda, it does not have the provenance that European cars do. We are talking about value here, not about the merits of the car. A Japanese car broke the $1MM mark for the first time 2 years ago. That doesn't even register on the list of most valuable cars ever sold at auction. This car, at this moment, is not worth what the original owner paid for it. A lot of the talk here is driven be emotion and speculation. The cars do not sell for as much as people like to believe. This is why a couple of college kids in Irvine decided that buying a 5 owner car with a checkered accident history in very rough conditions was a good idea. They put it up for sale for 32k. It didn't sell for that. It didn't sell when it was priced at 30k. Or 28k. Or 26k. Those kids sold the car to a dealership where it sits for 29k where it won't sell. There are plenty of CRs with stories like that one. At the end of the day, when a good example of the car comes up they are listed at low 30s or high 20s and then sell very quickly at a much more reasonable 23-25k by people who are waiting to buy at that price point. Right where the blue book has them valued. I settled for nothing, I got exactly the car I wanted for exactly what it's worth and at a price point that is much much more approachable than a European classic. Plus, I don't feel guilty putting the mileage on it and driving it hard at the race track.

nibble

I think Vanishing Point had understood you right after reading your second post..

A collectable car's value does not depends on which country it came from. It's how much people desire to own. No one will say "I will pay for this 944 for $30K just because it's Porsche." Just like CR, people will look at mileage and how it was kept in every aspect to determine how much they are willing to pay for. Some CR will be sold less but some CR will be sold well beyond nada is suggesting. It's all depends on how you keep it.

Even F*g Esurance insurance company valued by '00 S2000 were shocked how much it'd cost them when they decided to total it in 2014. Their exact words were "I didn't realize how much this car costs."

Biff_Malibu

I'm with Vanishing Point and Nibble. There's a difference between a clean, quality example, and a driven CR. Just because two cars have 10,000 miles for example, it doesn't mean they're the same. There is very different ways 10,000 miles can be put on a car.

I know based on what I've offered people for clean examples, and the reactions I've gotten, those NADA values don't mean anything.

loserwill

[quote name='nibble' timestamp='1476536770' post='24084677'
A collectable car's value does not depends on which country it came from. It's how much people desire to own. No one will say "I will pay for this 944 for $30K just because it's Porsche." Just like CR, people will look at mileage and how it was kept in every aspect to determine how much they are willing to pay for. Some CR will be sold less but some CR will be sold well beyond nada is suggesting. It's all depends on how you keep it.
[/quote]

I think a cars value very much does depend on where it comes from, although I wont go so far as to say that country of origin is the demarcation. Like I said previously, it's about provenance. Japanese cars have never had the lineage to justify the jaw dropping prices being commanded by classic Italian or American historical cars. I do agree that the condition of the car is a major factor as well. Take the Guam CR that is allegedly parked in a dealership basement with as close to as makes no difference 0 miles on it. What's that car worth? Certainly more than the $36k sticker price. $40k gets you to the sticker price with inflation. How about $45k? I don't think that car has any takers at $50k+. Anyway, I'm certainly not going to die on this hill over an opinion. I love the car and I'm going to continue to love the car. I'm just not going to plan on retiring with it's appreciation though.

nibble

look up Toyota 2000GT - original sticker price ~$7,000.

ropmike:

loserwill

I literally mentioned that car in my first post on this subject. List price for a 62 Ferrari 250 GTO was $18k. Now it's worth 30 million. Porsche 550s: $6800 now 5 million. 67 Ford GT40: $18k. Now 7 million. The list goes on and on; Japanese cars don't command the same prices that European and North American cars do.

Vanishing Point

First off Japanese cars are a recent development, following WW2. So their cars have lagged behind cars of longer lineage, so one has to take that into account. Some of the bias against Japanese cars is carryover from the days when Japan first imported cars into the U.S., only now are Japanese cars like the Toyota 2000 GT, Datsun GT-R, Datsun Sport 800, Mazda Cosmo and Honda S series cars being appreciated. Appreciated for their engineering, styling, durability and performance.

Will these cars reach the inflated values you listed, time will tell, most are sold private treaty so their sale prices are never disclosed publicly. The NSX is a good example of a car with an appreciating value. Pristine, low mileage examples are selling for well over 100K, not bad for a car which ceased being available in 2005. The same early model that forced Enzo Ferrari to come out of their design malaise in order to make better cars. The CR is another car on the cusp of being truly appreciated, I've been offered very good money for my entire CR collection, and had a gentleman from overseas offer 60k per car if I would let him pick out the three delete models he truly wanted. Not bad for a car which ceased production in 2009.

So, when you compare the value of recent German, Italian, etc marque cars, do so against comparable year Japanese cars and you will see the pricing trend. Had Japan been making cars for as long as other companies they might be simialarly priced today. In any case, when it comes to collector cars, it's always better to be ahead of the pricing curve than riding the pricing wave.


Well, we are way off the posted topic. We've established it's best to sell your car private treaty versus taking what the dealer wants to give you based on NADA. Besides, with sites like S2KI why would you want to sell to a dealer when you have a built in purchasing group here. For those CR's with a "storied past" or the "Pristine" examples let the market determine their value. "Ride the Curve".

~ Steven

iamxpl

I will be keeping my CR for a long time. I know for sure I paid more than what the car is valued by NADA or KBB. Mine had a previous history, the first owner his a deer with it at slow speeds. She was very forth coming with the info. I know the car had an easy life through its mileage and was serviced as it was her 2nd s2000 and had all the records. I wanted one that was not a showroom condition since I would be racing mine.