Stock class SCCA autocross rules/class changes 2014 & 2015 - S2KI Honda S2000 Forums



Stock class SCCA autocross rules/class changes 2014 & 2015

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Old 10-30-2013, 07:29 PM   #1
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Default Stock class SCCA autocross rules/class changes 2014 & 2015

Not sure if you all have heard this yet, but if you're into autocrossing your S2k, you probably know already. That being said, I'll just outline some key things:
1. Tire allowances are changing so that by 2015 you will have to use 200+ UTQG treadwear rated tires
2. Swaybars are basically free!! stock, removed, totally completely modified, it's all legal in 2015 (2014?).
3. Rules about shocks are changing, but not until 2015. Double adjustable, yes. External reservoir, NO!
4. Other rule changes, but you can look that up for yourselves now that your interest is sparked (but the CR's will now be in A-stock, which will be changed to A-street, but still called 'AS').


With # 3 in mind (the shock changes), what are the major non-external double adjustable shocks out there? Currently the big names are JRZ, Ohlins, Penske, Moton, and Koni (others?). Obviously valving is everything for autocross, but it sounds like if you run Ohlins, Penskes, or Motons then you will have to change by 2015, or switch classes due to the reservoir rule. Does this mean the JRZ's or Koni's will be the way to go?

I am in the market for shocks for 2014. Not wanting to get something that will be useless for me in one year, I plan to go with the Konis (but I'm open to others). I am planning to do some pro solo events, GA and Colorado to be specific, maybe more if all goes well. Knowing all of this, where does one acquire a set of Konis valved specifically for Stock class autocross and a 2002 S2000? I am looking for a company/group that already has the knowledge about how to valve the shocks for autocross, not a company that is going to require me to supply a lot of information that I don't have access to. This is the last 'big' modification for the car being that I have the big front bar (though that may change with the new rules), tires, and aggressive brake pads.



Thank you in advance!


P.S. Are there any other manufacturers to offer double adjustable non-external shocks that are/can be valved for autocross? I have seen a little bit about Motion Suspension, anyone have experience? They seem kind of pricey, is the performance worth it, are we talking 0.100 or less seconds improvement or is it more like 0.500 seconds improvement?
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Old 10-30-2013, 08:15 PM   #2
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Dunno if you're seeing something I'm not.

Last I heard, shock rules didn't change from stock. There was a proposal earlier about external reservoirs, but I didn't think that went through (was retracted fairly early on).

Swaybars are not free. You still only get one choice. Either front or rear modification.

Also you're missing the other two key changes.

+1/-1 wheels and no turn-down/ cutoff exhausts.
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Old 10-30-2013, 10:55 PM   #3
 
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Sounds like you're looking at a six month-old version of the proposal that eventually became the Street classes.

The actual official 2014 rules can be viewed here: http://scca.cdn.racersites.com/prod/...ck-nov-BoD.pdf. 2 and 3 from your list above didn't make the final cut.

The thread on this forum where the changes are being discussed is here: http://www.s2ki.com/s2000/topic/1039...info-on-street.
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Old 10-31-2013, 09:24 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PedalFaster View Post
Sounds like you're looking at a six month-old version of the proposal that eventually became the Street classes.

The actual official 2014 rules can be viewed here: http://scca.cdn.racersites.com/prod/...ck-nov-BoD.pdf. 2 and 3 from your list above didn't make the final cut.

The thread on this forum where the changes are being discussed is here: http://www.s2ki.com/s2000/topic/1039...info-on-street.
Thanks for the update, I didn't realize the changes were still pending review. So what I am seeing and understanding is that the only real changes are now going to be +-1" tire DIAMETER (width cannot change, which sucks for people driving AP1's as 6.5" front wheels are hard to find usually) and the treadwear/tire issue: 140 in 2014, 200 in 2015. Guess I will be sticking with stock shocks until I can constitute spending $4000 on a set.

Does anyone else not understand why 'stock (street)' class means you can spend $4000 on shocks, but not do small changes like a strut bar? I thought part of the reason we even had 'stock' class was so that people who were new to autocross or who didn't want to spend a great deal of money on modifying their cars could run and compete. Now it seems that you need to spend a large portion of your yearly salary just to compete in a class that is considered 'stock'!!!

Maybe I'll just skip the autocrossing and go straight to the track. It's only a little bit more expensive to get all the safety items anyway!


(sorry for the rant)
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Old 10-31-2013, 10:22 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by austincrx View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by PedalFaster' timestamp='1383198924' post='22854860
Sounds like you're looking at a six month-old version of the proposal that eventually became the Street classes.

The actual official 2014 rules can be viewed here: http://scca.cdn.racersites.com/prod/...ck-nov-BoD.pdf. 2 and 3 from your list above didn't make the final cut.

The thread on this forum where the changes are being discussed is here: http://www.s2ki.com/s2000/topic/1039...info-on-street.
Thanks for the update, I didn't realize the changes were still pending review. So what I am seeing and understanding is that the only real changes are now going to be +-1" tire DIAMETER (width cannot change, which sucks for people driving AP1's as 6.5" front wheels are hard to find usually) and the treadwear/tire issue: 140 in 2014, 200 in 2015. Guess I will be sticking with stock shocks until I can constitute spending $4000 on a set.

Does anyone else not understand why 'stock (street)' class means you can spend $4000 on shocks, but not do small changes like a strut bar? I thought part of the reason we even had 'stock' class was so that people who were new to autocross or who didn't want to spend a great deal of money on modifying their cars could run and compete. Now it seems that you need to spend a large portion of your yearly salary just to compete in a class that is considered 'stock'!!!

Maybe I'll just skip the autocrossing and go straight to the track. It's only a little bit more expensive to get all the safety items anyway!


(sorry for the rant)
You don't need to spend $4000 on shocks. Not to mention if you did the $4000 you could sell down the line for most of what you paid for it so the $4000 is more an investment than a cost, but even if you don't have $4000...you don't need to do it. People have been close to winning national championships on stock shocks. That means at the bare minimum you should be able to win anything outside of a national championship.

The reason they don't allow strut bars is that every allowance you get means you have to do that allowance. On one hand you're complaining about too many costs but then you want more allowances? If you allowed a strut bar then you'd have to buy a strut bar too (although maybe not because it doesn't do anything on an s2k but that's beside the point). There's no good reason to allow strut bars.

Shocks wear out, so they have to allow shock replacement. If your beef is that the shock rule changed back to stock rules instead of the proposed early one you read, then you must understand canisters are irrelevant. You can get shocks that are just as good without canisters as the ones with canisters, except they're usually more expensive without canisters. There's no good way to write a shock rule unfortunately while not allowing the super serious people to spend gobs of money on shocks.
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Old 10-31-2013, 10:29 AM   #6
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you dont necessarily need 4000 shocks to be competitive in street class stock. or RT. revlaved koni's have proven themselves and some have stuck with stock shocks or upgraded to the CR bodies. and regarding a bar, you can easily go with a 300 dollar bar and not have to spend 1k plus on a gendron or ARE sway bars. but most will since they might want the adjust-ability for when they move up to a different class that might require more bar. some people spent money on penske shocks because they had the money and want best of the best. but thats on a totally different level where you are chasing tenths. it seems you are rather new to the sport like i am. this is my first year. you can get a lot more improvement just with seat time. i ran stock shocks in RT class for a year and i was not far off from the podium winners (in my local region).

as for the wheel size i agree AP1 guys still have it hard.

IMHO i think road course track days will ultimately be more expensive. youll burn more fuel, pads and rotors will take a beating etc.

i drive an ap2v2. the softest of the 3 models. 4 if you count the CR by itself.

edited ***
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Old 10-31-2013, 11:15 AM   #7
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The thing about swaybars is that if you can adjust both sways, you can fake spring rate and get crazy stiff front and rear bars that would make cars undrivable and unlivable.

By only doing one, you are limiting what you can do without totally screwing stuff up. If you want to do both, just go STR.
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Old 10-31-2013, 06:51 PM   #8
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FYI 2008 national champion Greg Hahn won on stock shocks and $200 saner bar!

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Old 10-31-2013, 07:05 PM   #9
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How many jackets has he won since then? Times have changed a lot since.
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Old 11-01-2013, 05:44 AM   #10
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competition has definitely gotten stiffer and the tuning of the s2000 has progressed quite a bit. in no way am i discrediting the man im sure he is a talented driver. but you dont wanna go into a gun fight with a knife.

to the op, autocross can be as competitive as you want it to be or as fun as you want it to be. you just need to decide how much you want to participate.
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