Tuner options for AP1
01-19-2015, 01:28 PM
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Tuner options for AP1
Hi folks,
I'm trying to learn more about the S2000 platform (got my AP1 this past August) and is looking on the topic of tunes. From reading on forums, it seems like the Flashpro from Hondata is only for AP2 05+. For the AP1, the options are more limited with the biggest being the AEM EMS. When reading how to tune the AEM EMS, I don't see many available "maps" that people can just download and use. It seems almost like half science and half art to tuning the AEM (https://www.s2ki.com/s2000/topic/946...ems-series-ii/).
Some questions I have:
1. Are there other tuning solutions for AP1?
2. Are there available maps for the AEM EMS or should I go to a tuner?
3. Any good tuners around the area?
Thanks,
-Michael
I'm trying to learn more about the S2000 platform (got my AP1 this past August) and is looking on the topic of tunes. From reading on forums, it seems like the Flashpro from Hondata is only for AP2 05+. For the AP1, the options are more limited with the biggest being the AEM EMS. When reading how to tune the AEM EMS, I don't see many available "maps" that people can just download and use. It seems almost like half science and half art to tuning the AEM (https://www.s2ki.com/s2000/topic/946...ems-series-ii/).
Some questions I have:
1. Are there other tuning solutions for AP1?
2. Are there available maps for the AEM EMS or should I go to a tuner?
3. Any good tuners around the area?
Thanks,
-Michael
01-30-2015, 03:16 PM
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i went with hondata k-pro. kinda pricy but the best for ap1 in my opinion. it uses a k series ecu chipped by hondata. you send it in to hondata. they send it 2 you back with a wiring harness and bracket. then you need a buy a list of items from the ap2 platform. its pricy but the best in my opinion.
pros- temp gauge works, obd2 sensors work, CEL lights work, pass emisions, boost by gear, launch control...
cons- PRICY!!! and alot of sensors and valve cover needed to make it work. but all parts are oem honda.
if you want aem you will need after market temp guage. so you will need to mount an extra gauage some where, not sure if it will pass emmisions or your obd2 senors work???
aem has options for boost by gear and launch control but you might need extra parts.
as far as tunning in the pacific north west. there is only 2 shops i would trust to tune my car. PSI in portland or SPEED FACTORY in tacoma. SPEED FACTORY is what i went with. they mainly work on hondas but will work on other cars too.
what kinda mods are you planing on throwing on the car? N/A or BOOSTED????
pros- temp gauge works, obd2 sensors work, CEL lights work, pass emisions, boost by gear, launch control...
cons- PRICY!!! and alot of sensors and valve cover needed to make it work. but all parts are oem honda.
if you want aem you will need after market temp guage. so you will need to mount an extra gauage some where, not sure if it will pass emmisions or your obd2 senors work???
aem has options for boost by gear and launch control but you might need extra parts.
as far as tunning in the pacific north west. there is only 2 shops i would trust to tune my car. PSI in portland or SPEED FACTORY in tacoma. SPEED FACTORY is what i went with. they mainly work on hondas but will work on other cars too.
what kinda mods are you planing on throwing on the car? N/A or BOOSTED????
02-05-2015, 12:01 AM
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Thanks for the detailed explanation! For now, I want to stay N/A. I've always had turbo cars in the past (and currently too) and a tune was always the best bag for the buck if I wanted more power. However, my goal for the s2k is to be well rounded without the turbo lag. I'm mainly looking to fill the torque that it currently lacks. I've read a test pipe is the best idea but I also autocross so that's a no go. I can get a high flow cat I guess...(was thinking a berk header back exhaust with gernby midpipe) but I think to extract the most out of the bolt on would require a tune.
What are other ideas for increasing torque? It sounds like if I don't go FI, a tune is mostly a waist of money.
What are other ideas for increasing torque? It sounds like if I don't go FI, a tune is mostly a waist of money.
02-05-2015, 07:40 AM
#4
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I've had the VAFC for quite sometime and loved it, however it was quite limited on what you could do. Do you have an early ap1 or later? The 00-01s were running pretty rich. The other option is to run the greddy e manage ultimate. A lot of success stories there as well. Of course you got your full standalone systems, AEM, Haltech, K-pro and a few more. As for tunners, everyone has their favorite, Rich Tunning, Drift Office, Speedfactory, Track Fordged, Evans Tunning, etc.
02-07-2015, 07:39 PM
#6
Lowering vtec offers the most substantial improvement in power on this motor. The mid range is the best bang for buck improvement on this motor. On a F20 you typically pick up 8-10tq and 15whp at 4500-5.5k rpm. But gains range are made from about 3500rpm up to stock 5900rpm engagement point. A Test pipe is required to allow for the pick up in power at that low of rpm. A high flow cat may offer similar results but probably not quite as good. With a stock cat, you won't pick up any more power under about 5300rpm.
The most cost effective device to achieve lowering vtec is the vafc/neo line up. Some minor improvements in correction points/resolution have been made through the series, but one most significantly is with the Neo, which allows for a throttle percentage avenue to control vtec rather then just rpm dependant as the previous units had limit to. I would recommend the NEO highly for that reason alone.
One of the drawbacks of these units though is that they can only cut fuel and not add it, due to how they intercept the map signal on this car and what the stock ecu does with that information. Typically the 00-01 ecu doesn't need any fuel enrichment becuase they run so rich anyway, but later and especially the ap2, this will be needed. The way around this is to simply add a adjustable rate fuel pressure regulator and turn up the pressure. The stock ecu "self calibrates" the added fuel in closed loop IE idle and partial throttle under 50%) above this, open loop takes over and mechanical fuel enrichment is allowed.
This is the most simple and cost effective solution to extract more from a NA s2k that anyone with some basic understanding can learn to self street tune. A wideband to monitor afr is of course a must to do this properly and safely.
The most cost effective device to achieve lowering vtec is the vafc/neo line up. Some minor improvements in correction points/resolution have been made through the series, but one most significantly is with the Neo, which allows for a throttle percentage avenue to control vtec rather then just rpm dependant as the previous units had limit to. I would recommend the NEO highly for that reason alone.
One of the drawbacks of these units though is that they can only cut fuel and not add it, due to how they intercept the map signal on this car and what the stock ecu does with that information. Typically the 00-01 ecu doesn't need any fuel enrichment becuase they run so rich anyway, but later and especially the ap2, this will be needed. The way around this is to simply add a adjustable rate fuel pressure regulator and turn up the pressure. The stock ecu "self calibrates" the added fuel in closed loop IE idle and partial throttle under 50%) above this, open loop takes over and mechanical fuel enrichment is allowed.
This is the most simple and cost effective solution to extract more from a NA s2k that anyone with some basic understanding can learn to self street tune. A wideband to monitor afr is of course a must to do this properly and safely.
02-07-2015, 11:28 PM
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I cant believe no ones corrected the assumption with AEM ecu. I have AEM series 2 and don't need an aftermarket temp gauge the series 1 was the one with that issue. Hondata is somewhat the better option for emission stuff and its easier to tune. both AEm series 2 and hondata are about the same price after its all said and done.
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02-08-2015, 04:41 PM
#8
When you factor in the $3k cost of a Full EMS and tune, I dont see where the value is when pertaining to a bolt on NA car when you can yield 90% of the benefit in a much cheaper piggyback. There is something to be said for retaining the reliable factory Honda ECU/CEL function and OBD2 when possible as well. Most of the issue I see pertaining to piggybacks in general from people, is either the wrong expectations from the device and or lack of knowledge in tuning them appropriately to work most effectively with the stock ECU.
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02-10-2015, 12:04 PM
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Lowering vtec offers the most substantial improvement in power on this motor. The mid range is the best bang for buck improvement on this motor. On a F20 you typically pick up 8-10tq and 15whp at 4500-5k rpm. But gains range are made from about 3500rpm up to stock 5900rpm engagement point. A Test pipe is required to allow for the pick up in power at that low of rpm. A high flow cat may offer similar results but probably not quite as good. With a stock cat, you won't pick up any more power under about 5300rpm.
The most cost effective device to achieve lowering vtec is the vafc/neo line up. Some minor improvements in correction points/resolution have been made through the series, but one most significantly is with the Neo, which allows for a throttle percentage avenue to control vtec rather then just rpm dependant as the previous units had limit to. I would recommend the NEO highly for that reason alone.
One of the drawbacks of these units though is that they can only cut fuel and not add it, due to how they intercept the map signal on this car and what the stock ecu does with that information. Typically the 00-01 ecu doesn't need any fuel enrichment becuase they run so rich anyway, but later and especially the ap2, this will be needed. The way around this is to simply add a adjustable rate fuel pressure regulator and turn up the pressure. The stock ecu "self calibrates" the added fuel in closed loop IE idle and partial throttle under 50%) above this, open loop takes over and mechanical fuel enrichment is allowed.
This is the most simple and cost effective solution to extract more from a NA s2k that anyone with some basic understanding can learn to self street tune. A wideband to monitor afr is of course a must to do this properly and safely.
The most cost effective device to achieve lowering vtec is the vafc/neo line up. Some minor improvements in correction points/resolution have been made through the series, but one most significantly is with the Neo, which allows for a throttle percentage avenue to control vtec rather then just rpm dependant as the previous units had limit to. I would recommend the NEO highly for that reason alone.
One of the drawbacks of these units though is that they can only cut fuel and not add it, due to how they intercept the map signal on this car and what the stock ecu does with that information. Typically the 00-01 ecu doesn't need any fuel enrichment becuase they run so rich anyway, but later and especially the ap2, this will be needed. The way around this is to simply add a adjustable rate fuel pressure regulator and turn up the pressure. The stock ecu "self calibrates" the added fuel in closed loop IE idle and partial throttle under 50%) above this, open loop takes over and mechanical fuel enrichment is allowed.
This is the most simple and cost effective solution to extract more from a NA s2k that anyone with some basic understanding can learn to self street tune. A wideband to monitor afr is of course a must to do this properly and safely.