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apories neou katoxou

#26 User is offline   energetic 


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Posted 08 November 2005 - 10:04 AM

O VAG exei miata giauto ta kserei. :thumbup:
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#27 User is offline   D_S2000 

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Posted 08 November 2005 - 07:57 PM

Moy epitrepete na pw ki egw thn gnvmh moy? Loipon, gia na xekinhsw apo thn arxh kai lambanvntas yp' opsi oles tis dynates epiloges opws poly analytika periegrapse o Socrates tha elega kat' arxas symfvnvntas me ton filo moy ton VAG oti to S2000 exei ftiaxthei oxi gia na kanei ekinhseis apo stash kai na tromazei me tis epidoseis tou alla na prosferei ston odhgo toy oles ekeines tis aisthiseis poy enas pragmatikos odhgos tha epithymoyse apo ena tetoio aytokinhto. Aisthish eleytherias logv roadster, aisthish poiothtas kataskeys (oso ayto toylaxiston to epitrepei ena aytokinhto cabrio), alla to kyriotero prosferei adrenalinh logw odikhs symperiforas (ki ayto o kalyteros tropos gia na to diapistwseis einai se pista) poy synistatai ston tropo poy mporei kai plassaretai kai mpainei stis strofes, ston thorybo poy paragetai apo tis 8.800 pragmatikes strofes sto orio, kai fysika ston entypwsiako tropo poy bgazei thn dynamh apo to V-tec point kai mexri ton kofth. Einai ena katharoaimo pistato roadster kai ayto akribvs eixan oi Iapwnes sxediastes toy sto myalo toys otan to sxediazan. Kai gia toy logoy to alithes mporeis na rvthseis se kapoia mas synanthsh tis entypwseis merikwn apo osoys to exoyn balei sthn pista sta Megara. Rwthse toys gia thn aisthish meta apo mia grhgorh bolta alla kai gia toys xronoys poy ekanan.
Mhn perimeneis omws oti tha skizeis kosmo sta fanaria me ta 240 aloga kai ta 1250 kila toy aytokinhtoy. Kineisai men poly grhgora den kineisai omvs opws ena turbato ki elafrytero aytokinhto opws einai merika apo ta MX5 poy aneferes. Prin proxvrhsw tha soy proteina na apanthseis sthn exhs erwthsh... Protimas ena turbismeno elafry aytokinhto poy xyrizei se mia aplh kontra oti kineitai gyrv toy kai meta perimenei kana tetarto mexri na krywsei h turbina h ena S2000 me ta proterhmata poy proanefera? An protimas to prwto tote isws ki ena kala ftiagmeno UNO turbo na htan h kalyterh epilogh gia sena.
An par' ola ayta theleis na to beltivseis tha soy proteina na xexaseis to turbo kai toys compressores (wraia ellhnika e?) kai na proxvrhseis se atmosfairikh beltiwsh. Ki ayto giati mia lysh me xrhsh turbo h compressor pera toy oti xalaei ek themeliwn ton xarakthra toy aytokinhtoy -thymisoy oti einai to monadiko aytokinhto ston kosmo poy bgazei 120 atmosfairika aloga sto litro - rixnei poly xamhla ton bathmo axiopistias toy moter kai fysika ton xrono zvhs toy. Ki ayto giati poly apla h sxesh sympieshs poy doyleyei to aytokinhto den dinei polla perithwria sto moter gia n' antexei thn piesh enos turbo kit - oso kai xamhlh na einai h piesh yperplhrvshs- m' apotelesma to moter se ligo kairo na paradidei to pneyma. Plhroforiaka soy lew oti mexri twra exoyn spasei arketa moter me compressor se diasthma apo ligoys mhnes mexri kai kati parapanw apo xrono. Opote mallon h epilogh toy turbo an kai soy prosferei aploxera aloga se sxesh me mia atmosfairikh beltiwsh kai malista me arketa ligotera xrhmata mallon kata ta fainomena apodyknyetai anaxiopisth ki epikindynh. Gia to Nitro oyte na to skeftesai. Ektos ki an eisai diatethimenos na pareis se 5-6 mhnes kainoyrio moter. Exaloy eimai ths gnvmhs oti an kapoios einai opados toy turbo den yparxei kanenas logos na parei ena S2000. As parei ena EVO h ena Sti kai me ta idia xrhmata poy dinei gia na turbisei to S pairnei poly perissotera aloga kai me safws kalyterh axiopistia.
Opote an akoma epimeneis na to beltiwseis soy menei mallon mono h lysh ths atmosfairas. Ki epeidh hdh to moter einai tabani apo 'mama' gia na pareis pragmatika dynamh kai na deis diafora poy tha einai aisthith ston dromo se sxesh me ta alla S2000 alla kai me aytokinhta poy twra ta blepeis me to kyali tha prepei na exantlhseis oti afora to prvto stadio beltiwshs kai sthn synexeia na mpeis kai mesa sto moter.
ekei ontws tha deis diafores megales alla kai ta xrhmata poy tha dwseis den einai katholoy eykatafronhta. Se liges hmeres pairnw to diko moy apo to synergeio opoy tha exei oloklhrvthei sto 100% kai to deytero stadio beltiwshs ki afoy to strwsw tha mporoysa na se paw mia bolta gia na deis pragmatika ti kanei to aytokinhto ston dromo. Gia na pareis mia idea pisteyw oti oi M3 E46 den tha exoyn kamia tyxh pleon ston dromo.
kai panta milame gia atmosfaira.
Gia na ginv twra ligo pio analytikos oson afora ta pragmata poy perilambanei to 1o kai 2o stadio beltiwshs tha paretheta ton akoloytho katalogo proiontwn

1oSTADIO

a) EISAGWGH
1a) Carbon skoypa prosagwghs aera.
2a) filtro aera
3a) petaloyda megalyterh
4a) Flantza eisagwghs
b) EXAGWGH
1b) xtapodi
2b) exatmish (kata protimhsh D-cat)
c) METADOSH
1c) Disko (enisxymeno organiko h metalliko)
2c) Plato (poy synodeyei aparaithta ton disko poy tha epilexeis)
3c) royleman (einai ki ayta meros toy oloy set)
4c) Elafrvmeno bolan (Gia kalytero strofarisma)
5c) Koronopinio (Proteinw kapoio epwnymo opws ths "J'S" ki oxi oti
tairiazei apo alla "vanakia" ki aytokinhta paragvghs gia logoys poy
mporw na soy exhghsw allh stigmh)
e) PSYXH
Para poly shmantikh se kathe aytokinhto alla poly perissotero sto
S2000 poy exei ena aneparkestato psygeio gia tis thermokrasies poy
anaptysei o kinhthras. H psyxh loipon einai to prwto pragma poy
proswpika tha beltiwna sto S2000 giati poly apla ap' oti
ekana ws prwto stadio beltiwshs apo thn psyxh eida thn megalyterh
diafora! oso ki an sas fainetai periergo (O logos einai oti o egefalos
otan katalabainei megalh thermokrasia sto moter rixnei to avance
prokeimenoy na prostatepsei ton kinhthra m' apotelesma na xaneis
akoma kai 15-20 aloga!!! kati poy den symbainei otan to moter
psyxetai eparkws kai to avance diathreitai apo to egefalo se pshles
moires).
Exoyme kai leme loipon gia thn psyxh
1e) Megalytero psygeio neroy
2e) Psygeio Ladioy (Proairetiko..Kalo tha toy kanei)
3e) Thermostath poy anoigei se xamhloterh thermokrasia
4e) Baldida Vendilater

EGEFALO
Mporeis na baleis enan egefalo ths "Spoon" h ths "Mugen"
o opoios erxetai rythmismenos kai topotheteitai ap' eytheias
xemprizvnontas ton palio kai mprizvnontas ton kainoyrio.

KOSTOS 1ou STADIOY: Peripoy 10.000 Euro.


2o STADIO

To deytero stadio perilambanei oti afora sto moter.
Exoyme kai leme:

1) Ekkentroforoi 1oy h 2oy stadioy (Protimhse opws leei ki o Socrates
toy 1oy giati oso proxvras stadia toso pio agvnistiko to kaneis kai
syskoloodhghto mesa sthn polh)
2) Flantza kaysews
3) Stroker Kit 2,2lit h allo me perissotera cc. (Perilambanei embola,
mpieles kai strofaloforo)
4) Balbides epinitrwmenes gia megalyterh antoxh sthn thermokrasikh
kataponhsh.
5) Elathria balbidwn (Den leei na karfwsei kamia balbida)
6) Kapelwta titanioy (Gia na koimasai hsyxos)
7) EGEFALOS
Oi prohgoymenoi egefaloi poy anefera (Spoon, Mugen) otan allazeis
kybismo den doyleyoyn pleon kai tha prepei na katafygeis sthn
epilogh enos agrafoy egefaloy. H kalyterh epilogh kata thn gnvmh
moy einai aytou ths "HKS" me typo "FCON V-PRO". Ola ta agwnistika
S2000 sthn Iapwnia forane ayton ton egefalo.
Isws ki o "mama" egefalos se kapoia kit na kanei alla einai sigoyro oti
den einai se thesh na ekmetaleytei sto epakro tis dynatothtes toy
stroker kit kai tha xaseis poly apo thn polypothith dynamh poy enas
"full programming" egefalos tha mporoyse na soy dwsei.

KOSTOS 2oy STADIOY: Alla 10.000 Euro (Dystyxvs...snif, snif...)

An twra prostheseis ki oti gia na stamataei kai na stribei to aytokinhto beltiwnontas to s' ena tetoio bathmo tha prepei na baleis ki ena kalo set anarthseis (P.x. "Tein" h "KW" me kostos peripou 2.000 Euro) ki ena set Frena (toylaxiston mprosta) me tetrapistones daganes kai tryphtoys h xaraktoys diploys aerizomenoys diskoys (Kostos alla 3.000 Euro) tote katalhgoyme oti mallon soy ekana thn kardia periboli para se boithisa m' ola ayta poy soy egrapsa.
H apofash par'ola ayta einai dikh soy.
Soy eyxomai loipon mia kalh kai poly ma poly prosextikh epilogh.
Ante kai mas phre to xhmerwma me toyta kai me keina...
H synexeia sto epomeno epeisodio....
Elpizv na exw parei to aytokinhto kai na einai sto meeting point ayths ths Deyteras...
See you...





opoio tha
d)

#28 User is offline   agisd 

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Posted 08 November 2005 - 09:16 PM

πόσους ιππους εκτιμας οτι θα εχει το αυτοκινητο σου;

οι τιμες που γραφεις ειναι μαλλον υπερβολικες...πιστευω οτι γινεται με τα μισα αν πχ αγορασεις ανταλλακτικα απο Αμερικη η κατευθειαν απο Ιαπωνια.

π.χ. εχω την εντυπωση οτι 4πιστονες Σπουν δαγκανες ειναι κατω απο 1500 ευρα κοστος, ασε που καποιος τις πουλαγε σχεδον αχρησιμοποιητες για 1100 ευρα.

επισης ενας τροπος να ριξεις το κοστος ειναι να παρεις ελαφρως μεταχειρισμενα ανταλλακτικα.

#29 User is offline   VAG 

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Posted 09 November 2005 - 04:34 AM

O DS me kalypse apolyta :D Kai dystyxws opws exw mathei o monos tropos na ektimiseis swsta to kostos mias metatropis einai na ypovlitheis se afto. PANTA einai ypsilotero apo oti exeis proypologisei. Kai to simantikotero apaitei periodo prosarmogis, arketes episkeceiw se synergeio kai ypsila apothemata psyhikis antoxiw (gia ta xrimatika apothemata to ethixa parapanw). Ara loipon ti exoume?

Perneis ena aftokinito pou sou kostizei 30 xiliades E (TOYLAXISTON) kai einai tumbano (120hp/liter einia koryfaio afou gia na epiteyxthei afksisi ippodynamis apaiteitai afksisi strofwn peristrofiw kai/i yperkivismos!!) mama kai aksiopisto kai dapanas alles 25 me 30 xiliades E (balte ergatika, ladia, xydia kai 1002 extra pou apaitei kathe metatropi) syn wres dokimwn, agwnias klp gia na pareis kati pou pernaei aftokinita pou pleon kostizoun ligotero na ta apoktiseis apo oti dapanises!!! An to kaneis giati a)den mporeis na ziseis xwris S kai b) exeis to mikrovio tis metatropis paw paso! Se kathe alli periptwsi nomizw exeiw epileksei lathos vasi. Min trefete aftapates gia ftines kai aksiopistes lyseis se ena toso teza moter! Apla den yparxoun! Min elpizete episis oti i ypertrofodotisi einai panakeia! Exw dei aftokinita me poly xamiloteres epidoseis, sympiesis kai pieseis yperplirwsis na spane apla logw stigmiaias astoxias migmatos venzinis !!! Pistepste me den thelete na sas spasei to moter!! Oute vevaia thelete na mathete tous kwdikous allwn perifereiakwn exartimatwn tis HONDA afoy diskoi, hmiaxonia, endexomenos kivwtia klp then antexoun tetoio ksylo diarkws.

Pou thelw na kataliksw? Oi monta thelei prosoxi, vathia tsepi kai oloklirwmenes lyseis (rwtiste ton NPart einai isws o pio katallilos na sas systisei mia oloklirwmeni lysi :D ) gia kapoio skopo. Ean o skopos sas einai na patate ta turbismena MIATA nomizw oti pirate lathos amaksi!! Ean o skopos sas einai na dynamwsete/veltiwsete to aftokinito sas se kapoia simeia pou thewreite oti ysterei tote go ahead and have a nice journey!! For it will be a long journey indeed!! :thumbup: :thumbup:
VAG


HOW FAST IS FAST ENOUGH????

ΠΟΙΟ ΜΑΜΑ ΔΕΝ ΓΙΝΕΤΑΙ!!! ΠΩΣ ΛΕΜΕ ΜΑΜΑΕΙ !!!

#30 User is offline   energetic 


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Posted 09 November 2005 - 04:51 AM

Ego pantos dino to BMC mou 300Euro, kainourgio kanei 600Euro. :thumbup:

:thumbup:

#31 User is offline   D_S2000 

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Posted 09 November 2005 - 07:47 AM

Aqisd
Ypologizw oti to aytokinhto tha prepei na exei gyrw stoys 300HP. Ligo panw ligo katw alla pantws oxi makria apo ayto to orio.
Oso gia ta xrhmata symfvnv apolyta oti oi times tha einai diaforetikes an ta parei kaneis apo Amerikh (Apo Iapwnia den nomizw oti einai to idio fthna me Amerikh) alla pios exei ayth thn dynatothta na parei ta pragmata ap' eytheias apo exvteriko kai malista xvris na phrwsei kai telwneio to opoio epibarynei kata poly tis times? Giati h agora mesw toy diadiktyoy me pistwtikh karta as poyme se parapempei ap' eytheias sto telwneio gia tis nomimes epibarynseis. Opote den nomizw oti kerdizeis kai polla se telikh analysh.
Apo thn allh sigoyra mporeis na breis kapoia metaxeirismena antallaktika alla ki ayth h epilogh periorizetai afenos apo thh poly periorismenh prosfora tetoiwn antallaktikvn edw sthn Ellada (blepeis den einai kai to kat' exoxhn aytokinhto gia beltiwsh) alla kai apo to eidos toy antallaktikoy aytoy kath' aytoy. Giati an prokeitai gia paradeigma na baleis mia metaxeirismenh exatmish einai O.K. An omws psaxneis gia pragmata poy aforoyn sto moter (P.x embola) tote den nomizw oti tha riskare kaneis thn agora kapoiwn metaxeirismenvn gia eynohtoys logoys. Oso gia ta frena den nomizw oti yparxei toso xamhmh timh poythena. Ta "brembo" poy exw egw ta phra 2.650 filikh timh xvris topothethsh kai tis sxetikes metatropes gia na mpoyn. Mazi m' ayta phge 3.000 akribvs. Ta "Spoon" exoyn agora mono (xvris topothethsh) 3.000 euro sthn Ellada. Opote ta 1.500 Euro poy les den nomizw na antapokrinontai sthn pragmatikothta.
Akoma ki an ypotethei oti kapoios brei mia trypa kai ta agorasei ftinotera poso tha mporoyse na einai h diafora? 200? 300 euro? Parapanw den nomizw. Opote ti syzhtame? Epanalambanw loipon gia allh mia fora aki egw ayto poy eipe o VAG prohgoymenvs...
"Mhn psaxnete gia fthines kai kales lyseis giati apla den yparxoyn.."
Kai opoios katafygei se proionta mh Iapwnika (gia pio fthina) to pithanotero einai na xasei se dynamh (Opws exei symbei polles fores) kai na petaxei etsi ta lefta toy.
Oi Iapwnes xeroyn thn atmosfaira ki exoyn exelixei to sygkekrimeno aytokinhto toso oso kaneis allos. Empisteyteite toys.

#32 User is offline   agisd 

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Posted 09 November 2005 - 08:05 AM

Ok, eimai sto Toronto kai sas lew oti ta Spoon kanoun kainouria apo retail magazi C$1900+tax (prepei na to koita3w)., mallon me topo8etisi mazi. Ypopsin oti 1 euro=1.4Cdn$. Prin merikes meres ena melos tou Toronto S2k ta poulage (6 minwn gia $1600 CAD). An koita3eis tis aggelies se auto to forum 8a deis. Agorazontas elafrws metaxeirismena antallaktika sigoura einai kalytera.

Px enas allos poulaei to turbo kit tou poy exei sto F20C. Na to PM pou mou esteile:

QUOTE
what is the best 1/4 mile time you got with the turbo S?

how much did it cost you to build and did you open the engine?

is the car back in stock?

how much for the turbo kit and the engine mods?



best time I did was a 12.2..

never built the motor...it was all stock..just turbo kit and management and a ton of tuning.

if you want the full blown kit I am asking 5500CAD...

let me know

#33 User is offline   energetic 


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Posted 09 November 2005 - 08:07 AM

@ D_S2000

Tha simfoniso mazi sou. Kai ego gia peripou ena xrono skeftomoun ti na protokano sto S. Meta apo poli psaksimo kai xrono kateliksa kai ego na paro ton iaponiko dromo pros J's Racing. Ta exoume sizitisi kai mazi ola auta.

Pisteuo oti ta iaponika proionta einai ta kalitera gia beltiosi sto S2000. Episis tha ithela na prostheso oti kai se FI exoun empeiria oi iapones. Alla an thelei kapoios aksiopistia kai isixo to kefali tou as paei atmosfairika.

#34 User is offline   SocratesDTC 

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Posted 09 November 2005 - 11:51 AM

Pedia opos ta leei o VAG einai. To aftokinhto den einai gia eftheia, kai ta kala noumera einai apotelesma tis pisw kinhshs, xamilou varous (sxetika milame pada) kai kodou kivotiou.

Opos poly kala sou eipan ta paidia, me 920 kila CRX, kai ena turbo motor (mazi me internals kai ta ola tou) sta 500+ aloga, pernas OTI KINHTAI. kane tin analogia kila ana ippo kai tha deis.

AgisD, fysika h Comptech/Vortech den tha katsei na sou pei oti to moter se liga xronia tha spasei, alla aksiopistia idia me mama den ginete na exeis. Exw akousei kai gia polla spasmena me cobresora alla epeidi den kanoume radio arvila, apla menoume sto oti xaneis tin mama aksiopistia.

An thes na exeis to S2000 gia ta ypoloipa 20 xronia TOULAXISTON, simvivazese me proto stadio.

Kai min koroidevomaste, sthn ellada eimaste GTP. Poios na sou ftiaksei agwnistiko F20C? Afta einai gia alles xores, 'H gia enan pou exei k@vl@ kai parei ta ergaleia kai to kanei monos tou. giati ean o ellhnas mhxanikos exei to dynamoklido apo to 1985 ta measurements tha einai + - 20% off. Paradeigma efera. + alla xilia pragmata pou stin ellada ligoi kseroun otan denoun ena moter.

Good luck again!

This post has been edited by SocratesDTC: 09 November 2005 - 11:54 AM

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#35 User is offline   panagiotispa 

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Posted 09 November 2005 - 11:53 AM

Re den to poulate na parete ena FD RX-7 (23-24K euro) kai me liga akoma europoula 6-7K na to kanete 400 atia kai na eiste omorfoi kai oraioi kai me polla resta stin tsepi sas.

Ego eimai tis apopsis se kathe amaksi ante na balei F.P.E apo ekei kai pera ta lefta einai polla kai to ofelos disanaloga mikro, opote to poulas kai pairneis ena allo amaksi na kaneis to kefi sou. IMO panta

:thumbup: :thumbup:
380 whp and we go on......

#36 User is offline   SocratesDTC 

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Posted 09 November 2005 - 12:12 PM

D S2000 fysika den thelw na pistepseis oti "sou kanw eipodikseis" apla sizitame! :thumbup:

To na valeis Spoon h Mugen programmatismeno egefalo einai misodouleia, proton giati edw exoume allo klima, allh ygrasia, alles thermokrasies, kai pada kaneis misodoulies... skepsou oti ENA kai mono pragmataki na allakseis sto moter, allazei to AF ratio, kai oti allo mporeis na fadasteis. Opote ta 1200+ euro gia ena EMS den ta glhtoneis me tipota, oute gia proto stadio..

Epishs to kako me tous F20C einai oti ligoi exoun katsei na asxolithoun sovara (se sxesi me Bsereis pou ta kseroume sxedon ola pleon) kai epeidi ta pragmata kinoude panw katw sto orio, kathe epilogh einai poly dyskolh.

menodas se 2.000cc mporeis na PLHSIASEIS poly koda sta 300hp (diladi 290sxedon) me xrish tetrapetaloudou, Vtec killer ekkedroforwn, roiki stin kefali klp klp klp. Dystixos einai dyskola ta pragmata.

Kai gia na min leme misologa, oriste ti mou apadise o ALANIZ:

(fysika prospoih8hka oti exw agwnistiko S2000, giati allios mallon den tha mou apadouse :D )

h seira einai as follows:

Hallo Alaniz,

My name is Bill. I have some questions to ask:

1) In case I decide to purchase a fully built motor for my S2000 (lets say street master engine package) what cams and intake manifold do I have to use? I think 11.5 Compression Ratio is not enough for TODA Spec B or C cams. Can I order the same package, but with higher compression pistons? Or I should find a thinner gasker or mill the head.

2) For the reason I mentioned above, is it possible to order a Street Master Engine Package BUT with competition head work + higher compression pistons? (So I will be able to throw Spec B or C cam with ITB's.

3) i live in Europe (Greece). I have to send you my motor, pay you and then pay for the rebuilt motor to come back. Im not sure but i think that I will pay a lot of euro's for the shipping. Do you have any idea on this one? IF the cost is too much, can i do this ? --> Send you only the head for a competition work, buy the pistons and connecting rods etc from you, and then I will assembly the motor myself (im an engineer). In that case I will have to keep the OEM FRM Sleeves and oem bore.. not a problem..

Please reply!
Thanks


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Thanks for writing. The sky is the limit. We can build or provide you with what ever you would like. We have cores here if you would like a complete engine so you dont spend on shipping a core here. We can also sell you the parts and you can build the engine yourself.

The main question I need is pump gas or race gas and is the car a street car or trailer queen? Let me know and we can go from there.

Joe Alaniz

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Thank you very much for the quick response.

Well let me answer you the questions.

About the Fuel:
Im an engineer my name is Bill. Next summer I will participate in some kind of "club races", trackdays etc. I decided to transform my S2000 in a racecar (so yes you can say its a trailer queen) BUT I wont be able to use any kind of super-duper racing gas. We have 100octane Unleaded Fuel in any gas station. So this is the fuel that I will use. I dont know if there's a diffrence between the American Fuel and the European Fuel, but some say that 100 oct in european fuel is something like 95oct in America. I really dont know, but in order to help you a little bit, with that kind of fuel you are able to run a 13+:1 compression ratio motor without detonation. Think that helps!

About the Shipping Costs:
I think i got it but what exactly is a core? You mean that you have stock motors availiable so i wont have to send you mine? If that is, then its great, but then I will have to sell my motor (to balance the cost a little bit, and I dont know if thats easy.) Anyway I will think about it.

About the Items Im gonna use:
I have not decide which specific items to use, yet. Maybe you will help me to decide, relying on your huge experience with F20C motors! My plan for now is to go with Individual Throttle Bodies and High Lift/Duration Cams. As for the ITB's a friend of mine who's a TODA dealer, told me that Toda ITB is HARD to find (maybe the company dont want to sell it) so i think a Jenvey ITB should be good. What do you think about it? Any experience? Regarding the pipe diametre that jenvey gives, do you think its good? ..As for the cams, i think i will go with Toda Racing Spec B or C or even Vtec Killer Camshafts. Be sure that I will tell you exactly what im gonna use, to help you with the head work, but your opinion is very much appreciated.

About the block:

Well I dont know if i should go with iron sleeves with bigger bore, or stay with the Carbon Reinforceded Sleeves and 87mm.. Whats your opinion? Can the Arias pistons work in OEM sleeves or they need Iron sleeves? If they work with both materials, then whats your opinion, should i stay 87mm or go bigger bore. As for the bearing size etc, keep in mind that, OK its a race motor, but Im not THAT rich to diss/assembly the motor every 5.000km so the clearences must be pretty close to stock (or whatever you think is good for realibility without sacrificing the performance)

Sorry for the huge post, but if you reply to my questions I will be able to tell you exactly what I want from you, because you have the experience in Air Flow :thumbup:


Thanks alot BILL


----------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ok let me biggin by saying........to amke good power out of an all motor S2K engine is tuff. You need a bigger bore size to compliment the chamber work that will help the head breath better. A good all motor set up would be.....

89mm pistons with low tention rings
You need to go with iron sleeves 89mm
12.5:1 compression ratio with the fuel you mentioned "pump gas" 13:1 might be too high
Ultra light rods to help lighten things up and help prolong rod bearing life
Adjustable cam gears to squeeze out every last drop of power
ITB's are good but only with a well developed air box/filter.
AEM EMS engine management
Toda header or custom header
Camshafts are tricky. We have tested camshafts from all manufactures and the results have not been all that well. 2-7 hp gain. Keep in mind we were still using the stock manifold reworked just a bit. You will have to play with a few grinds and see what works best for you. This can be expensive. Believe me, we know.

We have seen about 30-40 hp gains with all the above tuned to the max and its tuff making N/A power. So how can we be od service? Write back and let me know you think.

Joe Alaniz



------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Thanks for the detailed reply.

Ok it seems that I will go 89mm bore for the reasons you mentioned. I agree with the pistons and rods.
As for the cam gears (only toda makes cam gears?? Thats why they re SOO expensive? Do you know of any other company making cam gears?
As for the compresion. 12.5 is what I was thinking as well. I asked a guy whos a toda dealer and told me 12.5 is fine for the Toda B,C and Killer cams. You said camshafts are tricky. Well, in that point I really dont know what to do. I think i should buy the most "extreme" camshaft, such as the Vtec Killer. Have you tested those? As for the ZERO gains (yes for me 7 hp is zero gain) this really surprises me. Maybe the oem exhaust (even a reworked one) is not so good for all motor? I really dont know what to say.
As for the ITB's... I have read your site about "S2000 exclusive tuning" thousands of times. In the "competition engine package" you say that an aftermarket manifold OR ITBS is necessary. I think there are only 2 ITBs on the market. The TWM one, and the Jenvey one. Do you have any experience on that? You said about the airbox. Well TWM says that the box doesnt fit the s2000 engine bay. Jenvey doesnt have any box. So I thought a classic "colander" filter will be ok for racing use (I dont know the correct term. I mean that iron thing that most racecars use. take a look at the pic I sent you) Why you say that ITBs are good only with a good intake box? What do you say I should do? If I dont go ITBs and stay with an intake manifold, is there an aftermarket one?


PS1: I see your name is Elias. Joe is your brother or sth?
PS2: Those numbers you mentioned are flywheel hp or whp?

Thanks Again,


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

My name is Jose Elias Alaniz AKA....... "Joe Alaniz"

The TB's are something you will have to reaserch more on your own. I usually custom fabricate/machine my own stuff. One off pieces. HP gains are to the wheels.

Best bang for the $$$ is a supercharger. Thats the truth. For the $$$ you will spend an a N/A set up there is no way you will make big gains. This engine is already hot rodded from the factory. They dont leave much for us to play with. Thats why I charge a lot for the N/A stuff because I know what has worked for us. Lets me know whats up. Thanks.

Joe Alaniz

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Posted 09 November 2005 - 01:17 PM

SocratesDTC, on Nov 9 2005, 08:51 AM, said:

An thes na exeis to S2000 gia ta ypoloipa 20 xronia TOULAXISTON, simvivazese me proto stadio.

Σοκ, ο περισσοτερος κοσμος κραταει το αυτοκινητο για 3-4 χρονια μαξιμουμ. Ακομα πιστευεις οτι ενδιαφερονται γιατι θα γινει μετα απο 20 χρονια; Μεχρι τοτε θα εχουν αλλαξει 5 αυτοκινητα.

Αλλα και παλι αν σπασει το μπλοκ περνεις ενα αλλο με 2-3 χιλιαδες και θα ειναι ποιο καινουριο και καλυτερο απο το παλιο.

#38 User is offline   SocratesDTC 

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Posted 09 November 2005 - 02:46 PM

Dikio exeis agisd. Apla min leme oti h mama aksiopistia kratietai... Kai o kosmos pou tha kratisei to S mono gia 5 xronia den aksizei na to ftiaksei!

#39 User is offline   D_S2000 

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Posted 09 November 2005 - 06:11 PM

Socrates
den diafwnw oti enas Spoon h Mugen egefalos mporei gia tis klimatologikes synthikes ths elladas na mhn einai ki oti kalytero alla tha elega oti to poso ephreazoyn oi exvterikes synthikes thn apodosh toy kinhthra se syndyasmo me tis rytmiseis toy egefaloy einai thema kathara tyxhs. dhl einai thema tvn dedomenwn synthikvn kapoia xronikh stigmh. O kairos einai kati to eymetablhto oxi mono gia diaforetikes xvres alla kai gia thn idia thn perioxh poy meneis kai zeis. Etsi den exei nomizv kai poly nohma na milame gia synthikes kales h kakes kai gia kales kai kakes rytmiseis se sxesh me parametroys toy periballontos afoy allote o kairos mporei na boithaei to moter kai ton egefalo na dwsei ayto poy einai programmatismenos ki allote oxi eite zeis sthn ellada eite sthn Iapwnia.
Epishs epeidh blepw oti se apasxolei para poly to ti einai kalytero kai ti oxi gia to moter tha soy proteina an theleis na mpeis sthn diadikasia ths beltiwshs na kaneis ayto poy ekana ki egw... anti na xanesai me to plithos tvn proiontvn poy kykloforoyn sthn agora epelexe 1-2 kataxiwmenes ston xvro iapwnikes etairies exelixhs (TODA, SPOON, J'S, MUGEN) ki apla epelexe to stadio exelixhs poy theleis na ftaseis to aytokinhto analoga kai me ta xrhmata poy theleis na diatheseis. Me dedomeno oti sthn kalyterh tvn periptwsewn to aytokinhto den mporei na xeperasei ta 300 - 305 aloga atmosfaira proxwra xwris na polyskeftesai... Ayto to exoyn kanei alloi me apeirh doyleia kai gnvsh sto aytokinhto prin apo sena. To thema gia opoion mpei sta batheia me to thema ths beltivshs einai to poios tha to ftiaxei...Ki omvs...yparxei. Kai den einai mono kalos....Einai exairetikos. O Npart xerei...
O Allaniz eipe ayto poy xeroyme oloi mas...oti to moter einai tabani ki oti poly dyskola pairnei aloga... Omws gia osoys ta 300 atmosfairika aloga fainontai liga nomizw oti mia bolta tha arkoyse na peisei kai ton pio dyspisto oti to aytokinhto apla xyrizei kai den exei kamia sxesh me ta 'mama'...kai xyrizei synexomena ki akoyrasta... Opoios thelei se ligo kairo (afoy to strwsw) mporw na ton paw mia bolta gia toy logoy to alithes... twra prin pareis dokimazeis... kai xvris eisithrio....
Ayth thn Deytera an exw to aytokinhto tha ta poyme ki apo konta. Alliws thn epomenh..
See you...

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Posted 09 November 2005 - 08:21 PM

VAG, on Nov 9 2005, 01:34 AM, said:

O DS me kalypse apolyta :D Kai dystyxws opws exw mathei o monos tropos na ektimiseis swsta to kostos mias metatropis einai na ypovlitheis se afto. PANTA einai ypsilotero apo oti exeis proypologisei. Kai to simantikotero apaitei periodo prosarmogis, arketes episkeceiw se synergeio kai ypsila apothemata psyhikis antoxiw (gia ta xrimatika apothemata to ethixa parapanw). Ara loipon ti exoume?

Perneis ena aftokinito pou sou kostizei 30 xiliades E (TOYLAXISTON) kai einai tumbano (120hp/liter einia koryfaio afou gia na epiteyxthei afksisi ippodynamis apaiteitai afksisi strofwn peristrofiw kai/i yperkivismos!!) mama kai aksiopisto kai dapanas alles 25 me 30 xiliades E (balte ergatika, ladia, xydia kai 1002 extra pou apaitei kathe metatropi) syn wres dokimwn, agwnias klp gia na pareis kati pou pernaei aftokinita pou pleon kostizoun ligotero na ta apoktiseis apo oti dapanises!!! An to kaneis giati a)den mporeis na ziseis xwris S kai b) exeis to mikrovio tis metatropis paw paso! Se kathe alli periptwsi nomizw exeiw epileksei lathos vasi. Min trefete aftapates gia ftines kai aksiopistes lyseis se ena toso teza moter! Apla den yparxoun! Min elpizete episis oti i ypertrofodotisi einai panakeia! Exw dei aftokinita me poly xamiloteres epidoseis, sympiesis kai pieseis yperplirwsis na spane apla logw stigmiaias astoxias migmatos venzinis !!! Pistepste me den thelete na sas spasei to moter!! Oute vevaia thelete na mathete tous kwdikous allwn perifereiakwn exartimatwn tis HONDA afoy diskoi, hmiaxonia, endexomenos kivwtia klp then antexoun tetoio ksylo diarkws.

Pou thelw na kataliksw? Oi monta thelei prosoxi, vathia tsepi kai oloklirwmenes lyseis (rwtiste ton NPart einai isws o pio katallilos na sas systisei mia oloklirwmeni lysi :D ) gia kapoio skopo. Ean o skopos sas einai na patate ta turbismena MIATA nomizw oti pirate lathos amaksi!! Ean o skopos sas einai na dynamwsete/veltiwsete to aftokinito sas se kapoia simeia pou thewreite oti ysterei tote go ahead and have a nice journey!! For it will be a long journey indeed!! :thumbup: :thumbup:

nomizo oti o vag ine to katalilo atomo gia na pisi kapion na min piraksi to amaksi tou :D :D :thumbdn: emena pantos me erikse psixologika :) :) :D :D :hello:

#41 User is offline   SocratesDTC 

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Posted 10 November 2005 - 01:23 AM

counter, fysika o kairos allazei kathe mera, kai fysika otan tha exei xionia eksw h apodosh tha einai +10% se sxesh me to kalokairi, alla me ena full programmable egefalo tin paramikri allagh sto moter mporeis na tin ekmetalefteis. As poume o egefalos ths amuse, einai gia proto stadio moter. PROFANOS amuse Vs AEM EMS gia proto stadio na min deis trelles diafores. Alla ean meta apo ligo kairo valeis kana ekedroforo as poume, me to amuse tha kerdiseis poly ligotera apoti me EMS h motec etc.. giati apla tha to ksanarithmiseis...

Kai edw diafwnw file counter.. Sto civic (paradeigma) sxedon oles oi kales eteries exoun proioda gia Bseries.. opote dialegeis afthn pou sou aresei kai perneis tous CAMS ths, ta ELTHRIA THS, tis valvides ths, to xtapodi tis klp klp klp, gia na eisai kai sigouros oti tha synergazode teleia. me to S omos, pros to parwn, mono h TODA exei asxolithei sovara me to moter. Oloi oi alloi apla kanoun reprofile tous OEM ekkedroforous, 'H den tous poulane kan! epishs h toda exei kalo tetrapetaloudo, alla den to poulaei!! opote tha pas se TWM h Jenvey. Epishs roikh isos na kanoun kai stin iaponia kalh (sigoura) alla epeidi den kseroume iaponika kai ine dyskolo na milisoume, pame ston alaniz h stin portflow. Opote kataligeis na exeis ena bastardo moter, POU AFTO EINAI KAI O KALYTERO IMHO!!

To N1 moter ths JsRacing, tha exei poly kalh apokrish, exei kaielafrwmena eswterika merh, exei parapanw sibiesi, exei kai "doulemeno" kapaki, alla to kako ine oti den mas lene ti akrivos kanoun, oute ti proioda vazoun... Kai kapou den mou aresei afto...

Filika!

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Posted 10 November 2005 - 02:23 AM

Pantos apo ti pleura mou pisteuo oti an kaneis kati sto amaksi tha prepei na to ftiakseis eks'olokoirou apo ena beltioti. Diladi, na baleis eisagogi, xtapodi, eksatmisi, egefalo ola apo ena beltioti px.Mugen i J's Racing. Kai to leo auto dioti o stoxos tou enos beltioti einai na epikentronetai sto keno ropis/dinamis prin tis 6000rpm tou v-tec (blepe Mugen). Eno kapoios allos diaforetika.

O koinos problimatismos olon einai ta $$$$ pou tha prepei na ksodepsei oste na parei ta perissotera aloga me to ligotero kostos, kai giauto poli epilegoun tin pio eukoli lisi tou Comptech i Vortech. To thema einai i aksipistia tou.

Tora gia kapoious trelamenous (me ti kali ennoia) i atmosfairiki beltiosi einai i kaliteri lisi gia aksiopistia kinitira. Ego basika imoun metaksi Mugen kai J's Racing. To dromo tis Mugen ton exei dialeksei o stauros kai epeidi kanenas den exei beltiosei to S2000 stin Ellada me tin J's Racing, apofasisa na to ksekiniso ego. Tora to apotelesma tha deiksei poio tha einai sto telos tou project. Stin ipografi mou exo ksekinisei kai sxetiko link opou tha katagrafo kathe proodo san imerologio, entiposeis ktl. Otidipote apories exete sxetika me to sigkekrimeno J's Racing project mporeite na tis ekfrasete kai sto sxetiko topic pou leo, alla sta agglika parakalo. Bebaia ola tha ginoun se oxi toso grigoro rithmo alla sigoura tha diaskedaso me tin oli ekseliksi tou eos tin oloklirosi tou.

#43 User is offline   VAG 

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Posted 10 November 2005 - 04:25 AM

XAXAXAXAXA kalo vre counter! :thumbup: Exw akousei kai poly xeirotera :D To thema einai oti exw dokimasei kai tin atmosfairiki veltivsi kai tin ypertrofodotisi kai pera apo ta lefta poy edwsa ematha kai pola (ws gnwston ama den plirwseis den matheneis). Telika katalava oti to aftokinito metamorfwnete kai o arxikos xaraktiras tou kai oi kaloi toy tropoi exafanizontai. Twra epeidi apo mama to S den einai oute to pio filiko, oute to pio adynato aftokinito (ara exeis polla na xaseis paizontas se aftous tous tomeis) apopsi mou meinete se perifereiakes veltiwsis (yparxei kai to konto diaforiko vre paidia!!) kai xareite to aftokinito se afto pou einai to kalytero : Sfixtes diadromes kai pista!!! Ta alla theloun gero stomaxi kai poly psaksimo!! :thumbup:

#44 User is offline   SocratesDTC 

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Posted 10 November 2005 - 06:52 AM

Energetic afto einai swsto pou les alla isxyei mono gia proto ,ade kai deftero stadio. meta arxizei to trelo psaksimo. Padws merika proioda ths jsracing ligoi tha ta paroun (egw eimai mesa) oxi epeidi egw eimai magas, apla epeidi ligoi tha dosoun lefta gia na paroun Camber Joints, Rear Control Arm, Tie Rods klp. Epishs ligoi tha dosoun 3.500euro gia ta amortiser ths JsRacing pou einai apo tis kalyteres epiloges! Ligoi tha theloun na exoun to super duper JDM setup, diladi idio megethos elastikou bros pisw, 17 x 9 me 255/40 17 bros pisw! Afta einai pou kanoun tis treles diafores ths jsracing h ths amuse, kai oxi to carbon hood klp! Den mporw na perimenw na parw to S kai na efarmoso afta pou skeftome toso kairo! AMAN! Kalh tyxh padws!

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Posted 10 November 2005 - 06:56 AM

@SocratesDTC

To ksero... brika akribo hobby distixos... :thumbup::D

#46 User is offline   SocratesDTC 

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Posted 10 November 2005 - 07:27 AM

me berdeveis :thumbup: diladi to s sou tha einai etsi?

Posted Image


den se peirazei na valw mia mikrh skinoula eksw apo to spiti sou na koimamai?? :thumbup:

#47 User is offline   agisd 

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Posted 10 November 2005 - 07:58 AM

Soc,

an endiaferesai pwleitei AP1 race car gia $16000:

http://www.s2ki.com/...howtopic=335301

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Posted 10 November 2005 - 08:09 AM

1093 kila! Mia xara einai. :thumbup:

#49 User is offline   SocratesDTC 

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Posted 10 November 2005 - 08:25 AM

JESUS CHRIST. POLY XAMILI TIMI.. to kako einai oti einai amerikh... DAMN. exei kai cage (2.000euro tha mou kostize) pragmatika efkeria...

Tha me tsakisoun ta eksoda apostolis apo amerikh + oi pinakides.. Poso lete na paei re peida? :thumbup:

#50 User is offline   agisd 

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Posted 10 November 2005 - 08:43 AM

Καλη τιμη αλλα μαλλον θελει κιβωτιο ταχυτητων.

Επηδει ειναι γυμνο πιστευω οτι το τελωνειο θα το δεχθει στα $16000 ή 13500 ευρώ. Οποτε προσθεσε 69% φορους δηλ 9500 ευρώ για εκτελωνισμο συν 1200 για μεταφορα. Ακριβο βγαινει στο τελος...

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