SocratesDTC

Loipon oloi kai egw se genikes grammes symfwnw me ton filo DS2k, alla mhn eimaste kai thymata tou internet.. Prepei na sigoureftoume poly prin paroume sta sovara kati pou doume sto net. akoma kai afto to site pou milame tora, pou einai thysavros plhroforiwn, exei pinelies adi-JDM kai prepei na diakrinoume to adikimeniko apo to ypokaimeniko... Den thelw na pw oti oi Iapones lene psemata gia ta moter tous, alla to na peis oti tha parw to Spoon Overhaul Engine F20C kai tha allaksw ton kofti stis 14.000rpm einai apo radio arvila, mexri radiofono Xitler Fysika den thelw na pw kati gia sena Ds2k, apla exw megalh aporia pou diavases tetia anakrivia..

Prepei na mporoume na diaxorizoume (se oti afora to moter) pou einai to orio:

Dromou -> Sport -> Sport/Trackday -> COMPETITION....

Oi perissoteroi vevea kserete to parakatw, apla na to anaferw gia osous den to gnorizoun. Otan leme oti kanoume Blueprinting se ena moter, shmenei oti otan kanoume assembly (synarmologisi) sto moter, EPANAFEROUME TIS ERGOSTASIAKES APOSTASEIS (clearences) STA METALA, KAI SE OTI EXEI KAINO ME KATI ALLO. (Metala, Elathria Valvidwn, Diametros odigou valvidas, diametros kilindrou, apostash kylindrou pistoniou, DIAKENO ekkedroforou se sxesi me to kapaki tou, kai genika opoy yparxei diakeno... To moter diladi ginete ousiastika kainourio...

Tora enas allos dromos, einai na diamorfosoume aftes tis apostaseis opos emeis theloume. Kserodas pada oti anevokatevazoume tin analogia apodosi/aksiopistia... Enas pou thelei ena agonistiko moter, kai thelei na treksei se ena agona, kai meta tha to ksana-anoiksei, epilegei pole XALARA clearences, gia ligoteres trives, sydomotero strosimo, kai genikotera kalyteri apodosi otan to moter zestathei kai ta eswterika megalosoun.

Tora sxetika me to internet pou elega prin, h spoon kai h Jsracing, LENE oti kanoun ena OVERHAUL, kai ama deite lene oti elafronoun ta eswterika kinoumena merh kata "x" grammaria.. nai men afto einai kalo alla ME KAMMIA PANAGIA den tha strofarei 14.000 xoris na spasei..

1) Den yparxoun elathria valvidwn pou na mporoun na strofaroun toso
2) Den GINETE to pistoni na piasei toso megalh taxythta. Edw sto 2.2L F22C katevasan ton kofti, epeidi logo megalyterou STROKE to emvolo epiane megalyterh taxythta apoti ston F20C. Fadastite tora ena moter pou strofarei 14.000...
3) Poios ekkedroforos tha vgazei aloga stis 14.000rpm? Ths spoon pou einai o mama reprofiled?? Ths toda, akoma kai oi agrioi Vtec Killer, logika mexri 11.000 exoun teleiwsei.
4) Se extreme periptoseis, mporei ena F22C (pou synepagete megalyterh taxythta logo diadromhs) na to pane 9.500strofes.. kai milame gia moter agona pou thelei lysimo kathe "x" xiliometra. Ep'oudeni ena moter dromou den mporei na agiksei afta ta noumera.


opote pws einai dynaton na dosoume 6.000euro XORIS NA KSEROUME KAN TI EXEI TO MOTER MESA???????? Epeidi kai egw eimai poromenos me tin atmosferiki veltiosh, epsaxna apo edw kai apo ekei na dw ti exei mesa.. to mono pou vrika einai oti ths JsRacing exei "doulemenh" kefalh, diaforetika pistonia, adlies klp klp... TIPOTA PARAPANW DEN VRIKA. Ypothetw oti apo ti stigmi pou to moter einai N1, tha ypakouei stous kanonismous N1, opou yparxei megisto epitrepomenh sybiesh, diadromi, kivismos kai ta pada...

Den diafono oti to moter afto tha exei ligoterh adraneia, perisoteri isxy klp, alla min oneirevosaste tsaba 14.000rpm... Kai o filos energetic eipe oti apofasise JsRacing.. ton logo omos? Einai kalytero apo ths Spoon? Exw diavasei tin lista ta leei ola misa.. eidika tis spoon den leei tipota, pera tou oti to moter "ksanadenete" apo enan eidiko... Giati loipon na min pas to moter ston alaniz, pou exei lysei-desei apeira F20C, kai tha sou pei akrivos ti tha sou kanei sto kapaki kai ti tha kerdiseis?? Afou ta legame 2 selides prin afta re pedia. Kai egw tha protimousa na to paw se enan iapona, alla apo ti stigmi pou den mporoume na vroume akrh mesw internet, pws tha stiloume to moter mas Japan mazi me 6.000euro?? An tora exete piasei "chat" me tous iapones pragmatika PAO PASW, kai lysaw na mathw ti sas exoun pei!!

Kai as melethsoume ligo ti exoun kanei ta agonistika S2000 sthn iaponia prospathodas na "klepsoume" tis idees tous (pou opos swsta eipe o D2000 ta perissotera einai proto stadio)

Amuse:

-Amuse Xtapodi adigrafi tis mugen se megalyterh diametro, kai poly pio elafry! (to mono 4.4kila)
-Amuse R1000 moni 70ara eksatmisi titaniu panalafri (xoris kataliti)
-Reprogrammed OEM ECU (hi-tech legetai)
-Mugen CAI
-ena kodo koronopinio (4.4 h 4.7analogos se sxesi me to 4.1mama)

thats all apo to moter! lene oti exei peripou 265 aloga, kai afto einai ena full agonistiko proto stadio (no cat)


JsRacing:

-exei valei to N1 moter ths pou den kseroume ti exei akrivos, panw katw exei pistonia, ligh douleia stin kefali, klp
-epeidi eide oti aftos telika ine monodromos evale ena 2.2L stroker kit
-eisagwgh-xtapodi eksatmisi
-koronopinio klp
opote einai panw katw enas N1 sta 2.2 proto stadio. apodosi lene 280 aloga.

Cwest:

h Cwest exei kai afth ena moter proto stadio, me xtapodi, eksatmisi, eisagwgh agnostou proelefsis, kai kodo koronopinio.. apodosi den mas lene, logika 260-270?!?

ASM:

pou ine pleon to pio grhgoro S stin Japan, exoun epileksei na pane to moter sta 2.4litra! (apistefta eleino rode-stroke ratio) kai to gegonos oti strofarei koda stis 9 shmenei oti to lynoun kai to denoun meta apo kathe agona.
-epeleksan toda ekkedroforous, SPEC B omos pou einai kalyteroi gia ropi!!! afou ine pasifanes oti to moter einai ftiagmeno gia ropi, afou poso psila na pas me 2.4L???
-tetrapetaloudo tis TODA pou gia emas den einai diathesimo...
-xtapodi eksatmisi epilogis tis...

IPPODINAMI?? koda 300 aloga... alla ypothetw oti tha exei poly ropi, tin opoia den tin thymamai.. kai 300aloga einai "kala" gia tetio moter.

ee einai kai ena soro alles eteries pou exoun kai aftes eisagwgh-programma-eksatmisi, afou einai to pio apodotiko stadio gia s2000. Den einai oti den exoun lefta oi eteries na to kanoun 300aloga, apla den yparxei nohma na lyneis kathe mera to moter otan mporeis na eisai 260 kai full aksiopistos!!!! Sthn kalyterh merikes petane kai ena stroker kit, kai kerdizoun alla liga aloga kai arketh roph, alla mexri ekei...

Sorry gia to makry post, kai fysika den eimai o padognosths,kai egw mia akrh thelw na vrw, kai ISOS h ergasia pou kanei sto kapaki mia iaponiki eteria, na einai kalyterh apo afth tou alaniz, alla tha perimena na grafoun 5-6 pragmata parapanw sto site tous!!!

Kai gia na adlisoume kai merikes idees apo tin ameriki, ta agwnistika moter pou ftiaxnei o alaniz, exoun KAI MEGALYTERO BORE, KAI MEGALYTERO STROKE. Apo 87mm se 89mm bore, kai stroke analogos ti thes, synolika ftanoume ta 2.3litra sxedon(analoga).. me agwnistiki kefalh, kai pistonia sibiesis 14:1!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Opote pithanon na xtypaei peirakia kai me 100ara venzini

eipame, sta 2.000litra, me kofti stis 11, me vtec killer ekkedroforous, me tetrapetaloudo, agonistika clearences, kai me oti allo thelete, eimaste koda sta 300, se ropi exoume parei arketa, alla min ksexnate to rebuild kathe "x" xiliometra, kai to gegonos oti den tha mporeite na pate apo edw mexri tin thesaloniki terma gazi giati tha anevazei thermokrasia...

FYSIKA eimai kata tou tourbismatos.. kai egw trellamenos me atmosfera, kai ama eixa tin oikonomikh anesh tha elina to moter kathe mhna.. alla posoi mporoun na to kanoun afto ?? mporei na pate se kana xorio kai na min exei kali venzini, tha theloume ena portpagaz gemato fuel booster

Fysika afta pou lew einai h apopsi mou,kai kathe voitheia/apopsi einai efprosdekti mpas kai vgaloume kana kalytero syberasma en telei.

kai eipe kapoios kati poly sosto (varieme na paw pisw na dw pios itan ) akoma kai ta 280-300 aloga den einai liga.. min trelathoume kiolas..................... apla einai thema poios thelei na bei se afti tin diadikasia.. egw epeidi oute oikogenia exw, oute pedia-skylia gatia, oute douleia exw, opote to aftokinhto einai perissotero HOBBY para meso metaforas, EFXARISTWS tha ebena stin diadikasia afti, alla den mou perisevoun 10.000++++++++++ euro.. proexoun anartiseis, roll cage, kai alla pragmata.... (afou paroume to S pada :PPPPPPPPPPPPPP)


kante mou minisi an thelete gia to vareto post. logika tha tin kerdisete!! ahaahhahahahahhaha

makis

kathomai kai diabazo stis 5 to proi oti exete grapsei kai sta perissotera sumfono,allaan eixa ta euro den tha hthela tipota perisotero kai tipota ligotero apo to s tou power car 2005...geia rikste mia matia sto power techniques tou mhna..akouo entuposeis..

agisd

Σοκ, 280-300 ιππακια ειναι αρκετα σε σχεση με τα 1600 που κυκλοφορουν στην Ελλαδα αλλα πολλες εταιρειες εχουν ενα καρο φθηνα αυτοκινητα στους 300 ιππους απο στοκ μοτορι.

Π.χ. σου αναφερω η Νισσαν εχει 300 ιπππους στο Ζ και στα G35 που μπορεις να τα παρεις πολυ φθηνα. Επισης νεο Λεξους IS350, 305 ιππους μαμα. Επισης Κορβετ και Z06 400 και 500 ιππους αντιστοιχα και τιμες λιγο πιο πανω απο στοκ S και σιγουρα φθηνοτερα απο ολα αυτα τα εξοδα που περιγραφεις.

D_S2000

Kat' arxas gia ton kainoyrio filo ton maki exw na pw oti einai toy Npart (oi palioteroi tou site aytoy ton xeroyn) o opoios einai kai melos tou club. Etsi an ertheis Maki se kapoia apo tis epomenes synanthseis mporeis na gnvriseis kai ton idio alla na deis kai t' aytokinhto apo konta.
Twra oson afora ton Soc diabazontas to teleytaio post epibebaiwsa to poso enhmervmenos kai psagmenos einai kai pragmatika xairomai poy enas anthrwpos exei psaxtei toso poly me thn beltiwsh enos toso eidikoy aytokinhtoy poy den exei akoma kan sta xeria toy!! Elpizv loipon Soc na to pareis to syntomotero dynato kai na kaneis panw sto aytokinhto ayta sta opoia (meta apo toso psaximo) tha exeis katalhxei.
Apo thn meria moy ofeilw na dwsw kapoies dieykriniseis oson afora to noymero twn 14.000rpm poy anefera sto prohgoymeno post.
Loipon ayto to noymero den einai oyte radio arbyla oyte to eida se kapoio site. Eipwthike se mia syzhthsh se mia diethni ekthesh aytokinhtoy (poy aforoyse to tuning) apo mhxaniko ths idias ths SPOON -poy apoteloyse melos ths omadas poy exelissei to sygekrimeno moter sta ergasthria ths SPOON sthn iapwnia- pros ellhna mhxaniko poy anhkei sto team gnvsths etairias beltiwsewn sthn Athina kai ton opoio tyxainei na xerw. Edw loipon ofeilw na dwsw kapoies dieykriniseis. O Iapwnas den isxyristike pote oti to sygkekrimeno moter mporei na doylepsei full safe kanontas xiliades xil. sthn pista. Htan apla mia prospatheia tvn ekei mhxanikvn na ftiaxoyn ena moter to opoio tha doyleye sto ultimate point ths antoxhs toy xvris na toys endiaferei an meta apo ton agwna tha thelei total rebuilt h tha spasei. Katalabainete loipon oti den milame gia ena moter dromoy oyte isws kan gia ena moter competition. Ki edw zhtw sygnvmh an egine kati tetoio pisteyto sto prohgoymeno moy post otan to anefera apla xvris peraiterw plhrofories. Ithela apla na tonisv thn diafora ths filosofias kataskeyhs metaxy enos moter turbo gia S2000 ki enos atmosfairikoy kai na dikaiologhsw thn apopsh toy giati proswpika den tha bandaliza me tipota ayto to apisteyto atmosfairiko moter (poso mallon ena beltiwmeno). Pantws ta allo moter ths SPOON poy anefera kai poy srofarei 11.000rpm doyleyei kanonika afoy einai ayto pou kinei to "Polyphony" to agvnistiko aytokinhto dhl ths "SPOON" poy trexei stis pistes kai to opoio mporei an thelei kapoios mporei na to promhtheytei me to antistoixo timhma fysika.
Twra mhn me rvthsete to ti exei mesa giati ayto einai eptasfragisto mystiko. Kai den tha mporoyse na synebaine ki alliws afoy to na dwsei kapoios plhrofories gia ena tetoioy eidoys moter (gia to opoio exoyn dapanithei apeires wres doyleias kai para polla xrhmata) tha htan san na moiraze ton kopo toy ta xrhmata toy kai tis polytimes gnvseis toy me toys antagvnistes toy etsi teleiws apsyxologhta ki abasanista kati katholoy logiko. Oxi oti aytoi poy theloyn na mathoyn den exoyn telika ton tropo na to kanoyn an theloyn alla allo na to kynhghseis esy xodeyontas xrono kai xrhma ki allo na soy serbirei kapoios etoimh gnwsh.
Etsi loipon nomizw oti apantithike kai to giati gi' ayta ta moter poy anefere ki o Soc den yparxoyn oi plhrofories kai oi texnikes leptomereies poy tha ithele na brei kaneis sto net gia na enhmerwthei.
Twra to an ayta ta etoima moter poy mporei na parei kaneis einai gia 20, 30 h 50 xil xiliometra kaneis (ektos ap' toys Iapwnes oi opoioi einai tafos plhroforivn genika) den to xerei. To mono poy soy lene ta Japanezakia einai "For race use only". Apo ekei kai pera h apofash einai dikh soy. Etsi o Soc exei kapoio dikio otan niwthei anasfaleia pernontas ena moter poy den xerei ti exei mesa (ki ante na pathei kai kati...poy to ftiaxneis? To xanastelneis sthn Iapwnia?) ki aytos einai ki o logos poy proswpika epelexa na ftiaxw to diko moy moter agwrazontas pragmata memonwmena (ths TODA - opws swsta anaferthike einai h monh poy prosferei step by step moterikes lyseis gia to S2000) etsi gia na xerw ti exw kanei kai na eimai se thesh na epembw an kati den paei kala. Alla eite me ton enan eite me ton allo tropo ta xrhmata poy prepei na diatethoyn gia oysiastikh beltiwsh einai polla. Para polla! To an tha epilexei kapoios na parei ena etoimo moter h na ftiaxei to yparxon allazontas kat' epilogh to synolo h kapoia apo ta mhxanika toy merh einai thema ths tsephs toy kai mono. Yparxei omws kai h lysh toy n'antallaxeis "mama" moter m'ena etoimo. Ayth h lysh se sxesh me ekeinh toy na ftiaxeis to yparxon symferei oikomomika apla soy sterei ena back up moter syn to oti exeis ayth thn abebaiothta gia thn opoia egine logws prohgoymenws poy den xereis me poio tropo einai beltivmeno kai se poia shmeia to neo moter.
Oson afora to oti mporeis na pareis me poly ligotera xrhmata (se sxesh m'ena beltivmeno S2000) ena allo aytokinhto (anaferthike to 350Z) me ta idia aloga (300hp) exw na pw oti h onomastikh taytish ths ippodynamhs metaxy enos S2000 me 300HP ki enos limited edition 350Z (320HP) h opoio allo 'mama" thelete me paromoia ippodynamh den kathista ta 2 aytokinhta isaxia. Einai apla h mera me thn nyxta. Einai teleiws lathos na sygkrineis 2 aytokinhta me bash thn onomastikh toys dynamh. Einai tosa alla poy synthetoyn thn synolikh eikona axiologhshs enos aytokinhtoy (frenarisma, baros & katanomh baroys, symperifora ston dromo, anarthsh, apokrish ki aisthish timonioy, perioxh strofvn poy bgazei thn roph kai thn dynamh) ki ena swro alla poy an katsoyme kai t' analysoyme twra, tha bgei moy fainetai ayto to post pio megalo apo toy Soc opote mallon tha brizetai emena meta... (Plaka kanw...)
Ki ena syntomo paradeigma poy exei sxesh me thn isxy kai poy to phra apo thn prosfath sygkritikh dokimh poy ekane to Power Car (teyxos Noembrioy) me diafora aytokinhta gia na anadeixthei to kalytero se kathe mia apo tis treis epimeroys kathgories poy katataxthikan t' aytokinhta. To ashmi TT loipon ebgale 363 peripoy aloga sto dynamometro peripou 110 aloga parapanw apo toy Nikoy me to S2000 poy ebgale 252 ki omws ston gyro pistas to TT htan 4'' sxedon pio argo apo to S. O logos? Den ton xerw alla ton fantazomai. Apla to TT ebgaze thn max dynamh se mia poly mikrh perioxh strofwn poy mesa sthn pista isws na mhn eixe kai thn eykairia pote na dei sto strofometro. Me alla logia: Mh grammikes kampyles ropes kai isxyos...
Ayta ki elpizv na mhn sas koyrasa.
See you..

agisd

Ας πω και εγω την γνωμη μου. Προφανως τα αυτοκινητα που ανεφερα δεν ειναι τοσο αξιολογα οσο ειναι το Ες αλλα απλα τα εγραψα για να δειξω οτι τα τελευταια χρονια το Ες εχει μείνει πισω σε ιπποδυναμεις.

Οσο για την πιστα, η ισχυς δεν παίζει τοσο μεγαλο ρολο, οσο το βαρος και η ισσοροπια του βαρους του αυτοκινητου καθως και αν μπορει να επιδειξει ουδετερη συμπεριφορα (γνωστο οτι τα ΤΤ υποστρεφουν και αρα χανουν χρονο, ουσιαστικα ειναι ενα Γκολφ απο κατω). Επισης τα δυνατα φρενα σε βοηθανε να φρεναρεις αργα αρα κερδιζεις χρονο εκει. Τα λαστιχα επισης ειναι πολυ σημαντικα να ειναι πιστας. Αρα ενα ελαφρο ισσοροπημενο αυτοκινητο (στην κατανομη βαρους) με καλα φρενα θα παει γρηγορα στην πιστα ακομα με μικρο κινητηρα (βλεπε Ελιζ).

D_S2000, σε φρενα, ζαντες, λαστιχα, ελαφρωμα τι ακριβως θα κανεις στο αμαξι;
Αν θες να εισαι γρηγορος εγω πιστευω οι πρωτα πρεπει να ελαφρωσεις το αυτοκινητο και να βαλεις φρενα και κοντο διαφορικο παρα να ανοιξεις τον κινητηρα.

panagiotispa

An endiaferesai pantos to paidi me to Power Award S2000 to poulaei to S tou 60.000

nickolas

Αυτή ακριβώς είναι και η καλύτερη ατμοσφαιρική βελτίωση για το S2000.

Πιστεύω αξίζει να δοθεί περισσότερη προσοχή στην απάντηση του "Αlanis" οπου ουσιαστικά σου λέει ότι μια ατμοσφαιρική βελτίωση (εκτός 4πετάλουδου) θα σου δώσει 30-40 άλογα τροχό και...τέρμα!
Δηλαδή 15-20% αύξηση της ισχύος από ένα υπερκυβισμένο κατά 10% κινητήρα.
Αν αφαιρέσουμε τα οφέλη του υπερκυβισμού πολύ χονδρικά καταλήγουμε ότι το όφελος μιας ατμοσφαιρικής βελτίωσης διατηρώντας τα κυβικά είναι κοντά στο 10%.
Αξίζει αυτό το 10% 10Κ?

makis

tsampa prama dhladh..pao tora.. kata kapoio tropo ta aksizei ta lefta tou..

SocratesDTC

Orea tora pou to ksekatharises kalytera D S2000 symfwnw apolyta. Kai eimai yper kathe "travigmenou" epeixirimatos!! Makari na ta kataferoun kiolas...!! Apla nomiza oti to eipes gia kathimerini xrhsh

Symfwnw epishs oti otan exeis ena toso pusharismeno moter, me metria eksatmisi, kai metriotath eisagwgh, to kalytero pou exeis na kaneis einai proto stadio, afou me ti mia kerdizeis 15-20alogakia, kai meta kalytera na to elafrwseis, na psaxteis me tin anartisi, frena, koronopinio klp! Min ksexnas file poses fores sou anefera to koronopinio, afou pleon mporeis na pareis ena Mazda 4.44 h ena KIA 4.77 me 600-700euro!!

Epese to mati mou kai se ena topic sto "gallery" pou enas filos apo amerikh epeixirei s2000 me tetrapetaloudo ths TWM, sta 2.5L. Leei oti h kefalh, to xtapodi, kai oi ekkedroforoi einai mama! Episis an den kanw lathos tora einai sta 250aloga troxo! Otan ftiaksei kai ta ypoloipa pragmata elpizei na paei panw apo ta 300. MOu fenete travigmeno na paei panw apo 300whp, alla den exw asxolithei poly me to ti ginete ston F20C sta 2.5+ litra. Mexri 2.2 exw psaksei.. meta to Rode-Stroke Ratio ginete xeirotero apo trakter kai einai dyskola ta pragmata me to strofarisma... Good Luck sto pedi padws pou palevei...

Kai egw pou ta leme, 250whp (apo 200) einai poly kala, gia mama xtapodi, kai mama kefalh!

Nickolas swsta ta les, to mono lathos omos pou kaneis einai oti o alaniz eipe 40aloga troxo, ME tetrapetaloudo, agonistikous ekkedroforous, xtapodi, ECU, block klp! (ektos kai an kanw lathos epeidi einai kai ligo arga )

Sxetika me to allo thema.. Epeidi egw endiaferome to kalokairi gia s2000 kai oxi tora, o filos "stocky" apo to luxemburgo eipe oti tha kratisei allo ligo to S, kai meta to poulaei. Milisame mesw PM kai eipe oti kata 99% tha mou to dosei ektos kai an emfanistei kalyterh prosfora. 20.000euro to dinei, me polla pragmata epanw, kai mono 500xiliometra agonistika, kai erasitexnikoi agones, opote den to exei kseskisei (fenetai)... exei kai bolika pragmata epanw. Prosefxome na min to parei kanas allos

agisd

Σοκ, για πιο λες αυτο με τις Καλιφορνεζικες πινακιδες το λευκο αγωνιστικο που ειχε; Αυτο δεν ειναι εκτελωνισιμο, προσεξε μην την πατησεις. Ασε που σε ενα τοπικ που ειχε παλια ελεγε οτι το ειχε ξεσκισει στους αγωνες και χωρις το ρολ μπαρ θα διαλυοταν. Καλυτερα να παρεις το αλλο που πουλαει και να το φτιαξεις.