User 121020

Sounds like he's shooting for an even front:rear roll stiffness ratio.

IntegraR0064

Alignment makes a huge difference to front/rear balance. I'm gonna need to go way softer now up front than I did with my previous alignment. Here's a picture:

oinojo

Jon what is your alignment? I think you meant to say you now need softer front springs with your current alignment? Care to expand on this? I also dont see a problem with lifting a tire unless it is happening at every entry.

IntegraR0064

Well that by itself isn't a problem but it's indicative of the fact that it's understeer city right now.

Alignment is something along the lines of 3 degrees camber in front, 2.8 in rear, 0 toe front, between 3/16 and 1/4 inch rear toe. Before I had a lot less rear camber but otherwise the same. Changing the rear camber transformed the car.

oinojo

where are you on your front bar? does the understeer only happen during steady state sweepers? if so i would try and soften the front bar first.

berny2435

oh wow! yeah, I'd think that you could go a few softer setting on the front sway. Like mama always says, fix the end that needs it first. Easier to adjust too soft off the bat than incremental to your theoretical #. i'm testin out the Miata RSB this weekend with shock settings the same as last event on different surface. Hard to tell what will happen up front but I'm hoping that steady state cornering will be a little less hairy along with the slight lift throttle oversteer! Rear toe measured at 1/8" and slight front toe out due to my slightly high ride height. only 0.7 to 0.8 lower than stock. next mod, 700/650 springs if this weekend feels too floaty and soft.

IntegraR0064

Yep, that's what I'm going to do - soften the front bar. I only did one event after changing the rear camber so I didn't get much of a chance to drill down on when it's happening, but as far as I could tell it understeered everywhere, with steady state sweepers being the worst. It wasn't that horrible, it was a slalom heavy course so my time was very good, but definitely more understeer than I wanted. I was on gendron 1.25" hollow in front at full stiff, no rear bar. I'll probably start off going down 2 notches on the front bar when the season starts up again and see how that goes. My spring rates are 800/700.

neurotic

This might be a bit blunt and wrong, but why would one soften the front roll rate to offset increased rear grip? I would think the desire would be to increase the rear roll rate, or if only transient (as are most autocross maneuvers) increase rear compression or decrease front rebound.

What rear bar do you use (if you have one)?

EDIT: Other setup change possibilities decrease rear camber or increase total rear toe (outwards)?

IntegraR0064

No rear bar.

Think of it this way - Before I had a much stiffer front roll stiffness than the rear, the purpose of which was to reduce grip in the front. This was because I had more grip in front than rear because alignment was better in front than rear. Now that I've gotten the rear to be similar to the front, I can soften the front again. Softer means more mechanical grip so that's the direction I'm going. I could also stiffen the rear but that's not the direction I want to go.

//steve\\

I just finished this over the weekend and it might be something good for those of you having suspension travel issues.

https://www.s2ki.com/s2000/topic/913...trol-top-hats/