Yup, it's pretty simple. Why sell something with less profit when you can sell something with more? Simply stop offering the cheaper thing and sell more expensive stuff. It's in shareholders' best interest. This has largely been the trend in many industries post covid. I can't "blame" manufacturers since they aren't running a charity. The Honda Fit and Toyota's Yaris they stopped selling, at least here in the US. Of course this works until it doesn't, and leaves a bad taste in people's mouthes, but the govt stopped carrying about monopolistic practices for a long while now.

 

https://www.kbb.com/best-cars/top-10...s-trucks-suvs/

Not sure what statistic you're looking at, or who is expressing those desires?

 

What statistic was I referring to?

 

That's my question.

You pointed out that tastes and desirability are shifting. Just wondering where you pulled that out of?

 

Truck, CUV, Truck, CUV. Nothing new to see here. Glad the Corolla/Civic as at least still on the list but decently equipped they are $30k with TTL.

 

Mostly observational interpretation, merely voicing my opinion. Objectively, the rise in desire for cars like the NA Miata seem to indicate this. Around here in the bay area, if you see a Camry XSE or Sport, most of the time it's being driven by a younger working dude who usually expresses how they like/love their car. It's observational, and speaking with my younger family members seems to be consistent as it appear to be popular in social media platforms I absolutely do no partake in.

 

I predicted this when the electric mandate malarky took hold a number of years ago. I thought to myself, "there are smart people at these big companies- I can't believe they are putting all their money down at the EV roulette table". Sadly, where I live (Canada), the F liberal idiocy continues unabated and the drive to EV's continues. What manufacturer selling in Canada, is going to push forward in a market that's 10% of the US market? The F liberal mandate is pushed forward trying to "save" the planet and reduce our carbon footprint...never mind our country is festooned with massive carbon sinks (forests and lakes)...and forest fires pushing tonnes of carbon back into the air is unregulated...maybe they can tax the forests...oh wait, that's just as stupid.

this is a very limited market (as compared to ICE or hybrid markets) and the desire for EV's will be likely driven by tax incentives paid for by me and my countrymen to attract further adopters. Furthermore, who is affording these vehicles...and even yet, willing to take the hit on depreciation. I am not willing to pay $60K+ for an EV that's worth 50% less in a mere 18 months.

Plus, I can't agree with the environmental cost of the mining and processing of these minerals and rare earth minerals that are in quite limited supply and non renewable and often times found in questionable locations with questionable political forces at play using questionable labour practices to mine and process said minerals...at least with current battery technology relying so heavily on lithium, cobalt, nickel, silver, copper, and manganese. Hybridization is a decent stop gap solution until better solutions arrive.

Canada and the US have massive reserves of that lovely recycled dinosaurs and prehistoric gunk at our disposal to continue to utilize ICE- we don't have to rely on other countries to power our mobility. Like others have iterated, let the market decide.

Ok, I'm getting off this damn soap box, but if you want to take a deeper dive into this topic, check out "Charged: the Dangerous and Misguided Promise of the Electric Vehicle" by M. Bucholtz. It's a well researched book that dives into this topic with far more detail.

darcy

 

All solid points. Just quoted this one, as I’ll say it again…I’ve been daily driving an electric vehicle for 12 years straight this February. Same vehicle. No buy/sell/trade, same got damn donkey DD. So with 12 years experience, EV’s are an excellent vehicle for those of us who live in major metros, for use as a daily driver. Mine is a virtual EV Honda Fit, just made by Nissan. They make sense in this roll, commuter car. Anything more expensive, more elaborate, to me is just stupid. For the reasons you mentioned, the mining of rare earth elements. They make sense provided it’s a “relatively” inexpensive commuter type DD. And most importantly, you’ll keep it. You don’t have to keep it 12 years as I have but it should be something with some thought about long term ownership, which right there rules them out for most idiotic consumers who just wanna buy/sell/trade incessantly. Oh I should also mention, I make my own power. Most of it anyways. 35 panels. For my use, and for many, they do indeed make sense, but Corolla HB or Civic HB sized. All the larger, heavier, more expensive EV’s require so much more of those rare earth elements to provide the nonsense straight line performance, the range, or both. My EV weighs around 3300 pounds.

I like that my beater charges off the sun. I like that any grid power I use for it (almost nonexistent) is American made. I will buy another EV in the future. But it’ll be the Slate. Simple, inexpensive (relatively), and will be owned for as long or longer. And it’ll be used once I move rural, where again I’ll have a solar array, only this time I’ll be adding battery backup/storage and a windmill. EV’s are perfect for boring, mundane, necessity type driving to your job, the gym, the doctor, getting groceries, etc. But they aren’t for everyone. And keep in mind, hybrids use battery packs that require rare earth elements also. They just don’t require as much.

 

The slate at $20k was on my radar as well. Curious where it will actually land in terms of price.

 

Don't get me started about "rare earths" in EVs... Ok, I'm started.

Permanent magnet motors use rare earth elements, induction motors don't, and not all EV motors are permanent magnet.
(e.g. Tesla AWD uses induction in the front and permanent magnet in the rear, due to their different characteristics).
China dumps tons of rare earths on the market at low prices to dominate the market (so they are actually "non-rare").
Rare earths are usually mining byproducts, not directly mined, so they are available regardless of whether anyone wants them.

There are zero rare earths in batteries.
Some batteries (not LFP) have Cobalt, but that isn't a rare earth, and will likely be completely phased out within a couple of years due to the cost.
And, no, Cobalt isn't all mined by slave labor.
iPhones are definitely built with slave labor though (but of course I have an iPhone).