JonBoy

Couldn't have said it better. Light-weight road-legal cars are extremely uncommon today. To get one this cheap, this good, is a miracle.

Jah2000

That's not true. If you watch Miata development throughout 3 decades, it is apparent that a lot of passion was put into it (maybe even more so than the niche, overly-hyped and short-lived S2000)... especially the newest iteration, the ND.

S2000 was only R&D'ed for a couple years, by only the Honda engineers and a few celebrity race-car test drivers. Miata was R&D'ed by many different teams and different countries (US, Japan, Europe).

They put a lot of passion and R&D in the chassis and suspension of the Miata. The newest ND is very impressive engineering. Aluminum components galore, chassis and component strength where needed, weight loss where needed, advanced and well-engineered suspension geometry and characteristics.

Imo, S2000 is like an outdated Rwd Civic with an outdated modified B-series engine. It doesn't even have VTC like the K-series. It's just a modified B-series with coil-packs. The S2k chassis and suspension is twitchy, doesn't give much warning, too hyper-sensitive and can't even drift smoothly. (I know, I'm ragging on our beloved S2k too much, lol)

Say Chi Sin Lo

Don't get me wrong guys, the new 2019 ND Miata is by no means "2nd place". For all the reasons you all have mentioned. It's just that as a whole package, it just doesn't tingle my senses as much as a S2000.

And I'm a Mazda owner, currently owns a 2009 Mazdaspeed 3 and I absolutely love that car. But if you put the 2019 ND Miata, and an AP2 S2000 in front of me, I would most likely walk towards the Honda S2000.

Vitt

I agree with everything you said about the ND, but the S2K still provides a great motoring experience. Your comments about chassis and drifting are driver specific issues. F1 cars are also twitchy and can be driven smoothly in the right hands (OK, I am stretching it with the F1 car comparison but you get my point). If I didn't have an S2000 that I really don't want to sell, I would certainly be looking into the ND as a toy.

rpg51

The Miata is obviously a great car and I am glad they are sticking with it and moving it forward. But, for me, the s2k is the sweet spot. I love the looks of the S2k. Not so much the Miata. I love the rawness of the s2k. The only thing that tempts me at all is a well restored english roadster, (AH, Triumph, MG, etc.). To me the s2k is a luxury version of the old english roadsters. In my old age, and with my expanding waist line - the s2k is the sweet spot.

I think I'm repeating myself. When you boil it all down I think the number one problem for me is the appearance of the car which I do not like. Others love it. I get that.

ZDan

Having separate high-lift cam lobes (which of course can be phased differently from the lower-lift low-rpm lobes) is way way WAY better for a performance engine than variable phase with fixed lobes. Which is why the F20C made 240hp and the ND's engine makes 181hp from the same displacement. Yeah, it's great that the ND got the power boost. No, its engine isn't anything like as good a performance engine as the F20C or F22C.

The "twitchiness" of the AP1 was due to a frankly stupid idea to have rear geometry resulting in toe change with bump. It's always been a terrible idea and it's never worked on other cars, I have no idea why they did it again with the AP1. For sure my (stock) AP1 isn't nearly as driftable as other FR cars I've owned/tracked (240Z, S13, S14, FD, BRZ). Supposedly fixed with AP2 I thought?

ANyway, good on Mazda for giving the Miata a much better performing engine. But it's WAY off the F20C mark...

CosmosMpower

Comparing cars designed in the late 90's and 2018 is hilarious.

CMK

Any manufacturer could build a sportscar like the ND. But I feel confident in saying that nobody but Mazda 1. has the desire to build one, and 2. can make money off of it.

From the manufacturers' standpoint obviously point 2 is more important, but from an enthusiast's perspective I'm just thrilled that Mazda's still "got it." Much respect.

rwheelz

My AP1 drifts just fine. Nothing like a car with a longer wheelbase, but I do not consider it "twitchy." Maybe you guys need to adjust your alignment settings. I have never given a Miata a second thought, and this new iteration won't change that. I do love the idea of it on paper though.

Jah2000

I think the appeal to liking the S2k more (I admit, I totally like its' simple looks much more too, as well as having an awesome Honda dohc vtec powerplant, which I've loved since the '90s), is because it's simply almost a classic and vintage car now, but still performs very well (unlike true vintage cars that are 30-50 years old, are super slow and cannot handle well at all). It is Raw and the appearance is simple, but effectively sexy.

To most '90s Japanese car lovers, the ND is much too new, too modern, etc. People like us, simply just like and are more used to a Raw performing car, with a minimal appearance and aesthetic (via an S2k).

If we took away all the modern amenities and styling-cues of the ND and made its' appearance and performance more '90s and raw... I am sure even more people would like it. But, this will be impossible (due to current and constantly changing automotive safety rules).


Anyways... here's a cool ND video: