CarandDriver:World Exclusive! 2012 LFA Tested
03-30-2010, 04:38 PM
#21
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Originally Posted by Swift GT,Mar 30 2010, 04:05 PM
In 15-20 years nobody is going to remember or care about the price of this car, only that it had an amazing 9k rpm V10 and that only 500 were built. The Porsche 959 was a sales failure in its time and ludicrously expensive even though Porsche lost money on every single one; now collectors go ga-ga over them...
If 0-60 times and the other data that seems to determine "value for money" for many people on this forum was what mattered to the typical buyers of these types of cars, would they not just buy an Evo or something similar and spend the rest of the money in modifications to make it go 0-60 in 1.5 seconds? What makes this car worth the price is its rarity, the immense amount of development it went through, and the painstaking attention to detail that the engineers put into the car. IMO, you don't get anything near that special from a Corvette, Porsche, or even a base Ferrari (458, 599, whatever). These other companies will always be improving on their cars leaving the old versions feeling dated, this is Toyota's one and only supercar and they have done a lot to ensure that the driving experience was done right instead of just focusing on numbers. To me that is worth the pricetag.
If 0-60 times and the other data that seems to determine "value for money" for many people on this forum was what mattered to the typical buyers of these types of cars, would they not just buy an Evo or something similar and spend the rest of the money in modifications to make it go 0-60 in 1.5 seconds? What makes this car worth the price is its rarity, the immense amount of development it went through, and the painstaking attention to detail that the engineers put into the car. IMO, you don't get anything near that special from a Corvette, Porsche, or even a base Ferrari (458, 599, whatever). These other companies will always be improving on their cars leaving the old versions feeling dated, this is Toyota's one and only supercar and they have done a lot to ensure that the driving experience was done right instead of just focusing on numbers. To me that is worth the pricetag.
03-30-2010, 05:18 PM
#22
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Originally Posted by Swift GT,Mar 30 2010, 04:05 PM
In 15-20 years nobody is going to remember or care about the price of this car, only that it had an amazing 9k rpm V10 and that only 500 were built. The Porsche 959 was a sales failure in its time and ludicrously expensive even though Porsche lost money on every single one; now collectors go ga-ga over them...
If 0-60 times and the other data that seems to determine "value for money" for many people on this forum was what mattered to the typical buyers of these types of cars, would they not just buy an Evo or something similar and spend the rest of the money in modifications to make it go 0-60 in 1.5 seconds? What makes this car worth the price is its rarity, the immense amount of development it went through, and the painstaking attention to detail that the engineers put into the car. IMO, you don't get anything near that special from a Corvette, Porsche, or even a base Ferrari (458, 599, whatever). These other companies will always be improving on their cars leaving the old versions feeling dated, this is Toyota's one and only supercar and they have done a lot to ensure that the driving experience was done right instead of just focusing on numbers. To me that is worth the pricetag.
If 0-60 times and the other data that seems to determine "value for money" for many people on this forum was what mattered to the typical buyers of these types of cars, would they not just buy an Evo or something similar and spend the rest of the money in modifications to make it go 0-60 in 1.5 seconds? What makes this car worth the price is its rarity, the immense amount of development it went through, and the painstaking attention to detail that the engineers put into the car. IMO, you don't get anything near that special from a Corvette, Porsche, or even a base Ferrari (458, 599, whatever). These other companies will always be improving on their cars leaving the old versions feeling dated, this is Toyota's one and only supercar and they have done a lot to ensure that the driving experience was done right instead of just focusing on numbers. To me that is worth the pricetag.
That was a very good post. I don't 100% agree but it was a good post.
You make a great point about cars that were sales failures but end up becoming collectors items later in life. Examples range from the Plymouth Superbird the the McLaren F1. Basically these are the cars that can only be justified via a halo effect at best. These cars often have some bit of interesting technology or design that sticks in people's minds. The LFA is definitely one of those.
However, I'm 100% on board with the 959 comparison. Where I differ is that I think the 959 was a good looking car. I don't see it having the controversial design of the LFA. Also, the 959 was superlative in so many ways. Compared to cars of the late 80s it was MUCH quicker. It's technology such as AWD wasn't at all common and it's performance was on a plateau almost to its self.
The LFA is a very refined bit of engineering but the engine isn't out of this world. It's great but it's not the only high reving V10 nor is the red line beyond comprehension as the S2000 pretty much set that standard a long time back. The looks are controversial rather than jaw dropping and the performance numbers are more or less matched by a number of cars.
That doesn't mean the car isn't awesome nor does it mean it drives like a ZR1 or anything like that. I simply feel it's just not on a whole other plane like the 595 or McLaran were.
However, please take this to be a magnification of a small disagreement with your post. Your overall point is a good one.
03-30-2010, 05:36 PM
#23
What's with the 0-60mph time? Limited traction? Its 0-150mph time is pretty good though.
That's like the Chevy boys saying to a Ford. 
Many of the 200 or so employees at Nissan, busy getting their new full-size work van ready for market, just stopped and stared.
“What’s…that…doing…here?”
“What’s…that…doing…here?”
That's like the Chevy boys saying to a Ford.
03-30-2010, 07:30 PM
#24
Swift GT almost nailed it, but I agree with rockville on the styling. Its controversial vs jaw dropping. The general shape just doesn't seem exotic, but the add flare makes it obvious that its special. To me it seems more like a regular sports car with a fancy body kit.
03-31-2010, 07:46 AM
#25
Thread Starter
id really like to know from those who say it doesn't look special or supercar like if they have actually seen the car in person. like ive always said pictures doesn't do the car justice. also when you see it up close you can see the little details of the car that makes it uber.
03-31-2010, 08:59 AM
#26
The car itself is impressive, and I'm not one to quibble over a few tenths of a second. What I will quibble about is the car looking for a non consumer standpoint.
It isn't faster, didn't hit any benchmarks objectively or subjectively (like style), doesn't provide anything unusual of its class, doesn't provide anything that can't be mimiced (you could even argue that this car is a mimic), doesn't introduce any new tech, and they're losing money on each one.
Yes, it will be collectible, but in that regard every manufacturer sould jsut produce a limited run of their concept cars, think about that VW GTI that had the crazy engine in it for instance.
A lot of cars are collectible, dosn't negate the fact that they're not exactly the best cars out there, just that they're unusual and people with money like to collect unusual rare items. Hell, a small piece of cardboard isn't worth 250K unless it's a Mickey Mantel original rookie card. Doesn't mean that it's anything more than a piece of cardboard, just a rare piece of baseball history. And I get/dig all that.
It isn't faster, didn't hit any benchmarks objectively or subjectively (like style), doesn't provide anything unusual of its class, doesn't provide anything that can't be mimiced (you could even argue that this car is a mimic), doesn't introduce any new tech, and they're losing money on each one.
Yes, it will be collectible, but in that regard every manufacturer sould jsut produce a limited run of their concept cars, think about that VW GTI that had the crazy engine in it for instance.
A lot of cars are collectible, dosn't negate the fact that they're not exactly the best cars out there, just that they're unusual and people with money like to collect unusual rare items. Hell, a small piece of cardboard isn't worth 250K unless it's a Mickey Mantel original rookie card. Doesn't mean that it's anything more than a piece of cardboard, just a rare piece of baseball history. And I get/dig all that.
04-04-2010, 07:48 PM
#29
Originally Posted by Swift GT,Mar 30 2010, 04:05 PM
In 15-20 years nobody is going to remember or care about the price of this car, only that it had an amazing 9k rpm V10 and that only 500 were built. The Porsche 959 was a sales failure in its time and ludicrously expensive even though Porsche lost money on every single one; now collectors go ga-ga over them...
If 0-60 times and the other data that seems to determine "value for money" for many people on this forum was what mattered to the typical buyers of these types of cars, would they not just buy an Evo or something similar and spend the rest of the money in modifications to make it go 0-60 in 1.5 seconds? What makes this car worth the price is its rarity, the immense amount of development it went through, and the painstaking attention to detail that the engineers put into the car. IMO, you don't get anything near that special from a Corvette, Porsche, or even a base Ferrari (458, 599, whatever). These other companies will always be improving on their cars leaving the old versions feeling dated, this is Toyota's one and only supercar and they have done a lot to ensure that the driving experience was done right instead of just focusing on numbers. To me that is worth the pricetag.
If 0-60 times and the other data that seems to determine "value for money" for many people on this forum was what mattered to the typical buyers of these types of cars, would they not just buy an Evo or something similar and spend the rest of the money in modifications to make it go 0-60 in 1.5 seconds? What makes this car worth the price is its rarity, the immense amount of development it went through, and the painstaking attention to detail that the engineers put into the car. IMO, you don't get anything near that special from a Corvette, Porsche, or even a base Ferrari (458, 599, whatever). These other companies will always be improving on their cars leaving the old versions feeling dated, this is Toyota's one and only supercar and they have done a lot to ensure that the driving experience was done right instead of just focusing on numbers. To me that is worth the pricetag.
I suppose both cars will remain expensive and rare throughout history, but how does that matter from an engineering feat/innovation or styling point of view?
