mosesbotbol

To me the Z's drive more like a muscle car than a fine tuned sports car like the S2000. S2000 was a unique product. Would it be the kind of product that consumers would want from 2013+? Not so sure it is. What is state of the art now is a different direction. Honda's factory racing aspirations are a far cry from what it was when NSX and S2000 were around. F1 moving from V10 really damaged their roadmap to produce a halo sports car, similarly as it hurt BMW. BMW had a shortlived V10 and too bad for that. We'll never see the V10 Honda engine in a consumer car

LUV2REV

Quite contrary as the 986 and 996 vexed record sales and revenue for Porsche in the late 90's early 00's under the guidance of Wendelin Wiedeking who was stellar at the helm from a fiscal perspective. Porsche's darkest days were when the 964/968 and 928 were Porsche's only offerings in the early 90's. The launch of the 993 was really the beginning of the turnaround but the 986/996 were the true catalysts providing Porsche with record sales and profit. The Cayenne was another platform that further diversified the brand generating additional revenue. A previous poster made a very unsubstantiated claim that "Porsche needed the Cayenne to remain in existence". Porsche was profitable without the Cayenne. I currently drive a 2003 911 Turbo in which the original owner spent an additional $18K in options. Porsche has a linear options catalogue for every model they make which is why they make more profit per vehicle than any other manufacturer.

LUV2REV

I asked you a question that you did not answer. You stated "Porsche needed to build SUV's to stay in the business". I asked you if Porsche would not exist without the Cayenne as you had clearly implied that there would be no Porsche without the Cayenne. Instead of answering, you eschew your typical "search the internet in vein" anecdotal information to redeem your shallow ego. You lament others all the time on this forum who contrive to disagree with you. Bad spill on the debating team in High School a few years ago ? A simple search of the internet will provide factual information that Porsche continues to be one of the most profitable manufacturer's on the planet, anyone can do that, you are not a hero but clearly like to think so.

No, you crack me up Chump. Seriously.

Wait until you see what fruit Porsche bears for 2012/13 as the 981/991 are selling let's say, very well.

Wow. One of the first articles I found when I searched "Porsche Profitability" on the internet. Enjoy.





The German automaker has released its latest round of financial data, with staggering new records. In 2011 sales were up dramatically to 116,978 units, an increase of 21 percent. With that came an increased in revenue, up 18 percent to 10.9 billion Euros, or roughly $14.32 billion. With it, profits also spiked, by 22 percent to 2.05 billion Euros, or $2.69 billion.

That’s a lot of dry math, but it does also reveal one shockingly interesting statistic. Some simple division reveals that Porsche returns a profit on each vehicle it sells of 17,524.66 Euros, or roughly $23,000 based on today’s conversion rates. That’s more profit, per car, than a lot of automakers sell an entire car for.

Perhaps customers should be appalled by this info, but they don’t seem to be, with continued strong demand, resulting in record profit says Porsche Chief Executive Matthias Müller. “Once again we are setting standards in the sports car segment with our brand new model range; our international customers appreciate this,” he said in a statement, “Last year, the strong demand enabled us to further consolidate our position as one of the most profitable car manufacturers in the world.”

Growth in 2011 came as a result of increased demand in a few key markets, says Porsche. In particular, growth regions included China, Russia, the US and at home in Germany.

Helping boost sales in 2011 was the all-new 911, and sales should spike further with a new Boxster and Cayman set to launch in 2012. In addition, Porsche is looking to expand its lineup further with the new Macan small SUV set to launch in 2014 as the automaker targets total sales of 200,000 units by 2018.

Not one to hoard all the wealth (at least not all of it), Porsche’s financials statement also says the automaker, “is an excellent employer and a fair and reliable partner for all stakeholders,” commenting that with increases revenues and sales, the Porsche workforce has also increased by 16 percent over the past year.

Mezza

Can you girls stop arguing over which Porsche is more overpriced than another, the topic is about a future S2000.

JohnsS2000

What EVERYONE here seems to forget is that we have an EPA that has already stated their intentions to place additional tax on cars that do not get some rediculously high MPG. All automakers will be required to hit stupidly high average MPG in the near future and since Honda has very few cars in their total line up introducing 1 car that is significantly lower than that average will drag that average down. We can than the EPA for this.

If there was a real desire by the EPA to get better MPG they would not force Corn Syrup to be 10% of our gasoline. I quit using the 10% crap and now use 100% gasoline and went from just shy of 16MPG city to just under 21MPG city with no other changes to my car and no change to driving habits

JohnsS2000

This entire list aside from the Ridgeline is based on other existing platforms, non relevent to the topic.

JonBoy

If you reference the SALES data I posted, MORE THAN HALF of their sales for 2011 were the Cayenne while sales of the 911, Boxster and Cayman were at near-record lows.

Model / Sales for 2011

911 - 21,748 (9% increase over year prior, which was one of their lowest in 15 years)
Boxster/Cayman - 12,207 (1.2% increase over year prior, which was one of their lowest in 10 years)
Cayenne - 62,004 (57% increase over year prior, which was a fairly normal year for them)

So what drove that bottom line upwards? The 9% increase in 911 sales or the 57% increase in sales of the platform-sharing Cayenne?

The Cayenne allows Porsche to share a number of expensive components (transmissions, brakes, wheels, interior features) across the brand, effectively giving them volume efficiency that was NEVER achievable prior to the Cayenne. Spreading out parts purchases and capital expenditures over roughly 84K units (Cayenne + 911) instead of roughly 22K units (911 only) gives a HUGE improvement in buying power, discounts for volume and even manufacturing efficiency.

Seriously, come back to me when you actually know what you're talking about in terms of manufacturing, cost sharing, volume efficiency changes and basic P&L calcs.

I didn't say they AREN'T profitable. I said the Cayenne was the critical vehicle that allowed them to finance the continued improvement of their sports cars and keep them floating through some very rough years (for which I gave full sales data and historical context). That, combined with their recent merger/buy-out with VW, will continue to improve their bottom line significantly.

/thread

WolfpackS2k

That's not technically correct. Per the EPA's rules the fleet mileage for each manufacturer is calculated by how many of each model are sold, not just the mileage that each model gets. So if Honda sells 200,000 Fits that get 40 mpg selling 20,000 S2000 type cars is barely a blip on the fuel mileage average report.

billios996

It's not like the s2k sucked down the fuel. Spirited street driving gets you 27mpg.

There is enough new technology available to get the mpg easily to 30 or better, maintain the power peak, and improve the torque curve.

Why are these guys arguing about Porsche? The company would certainly have remained viable without the Cayenne, but your precious 911 would probably still be air cooled with a whale tail spoiler. (some 911 snob purist just jizzed in his pants thinking about this.)

award78

Am I the only one that thinks 27mpg is near impossible in this car.