gaddafi

I have said before that these 'ultimate' cars were not built for poor people so it's daft to complain about costs. If their running costs are too much to stomach, people should live within their means.

You'll probably change. There comes a time when there is nothing to prove to anyone else or yourself. A kind of 'been there, done that' warm glow if you like. That often coincides with being able to indulge your whims for the first time so it's usually later in life for most.

Cars no longer have to be used to their potential any more than my diver's watch will ever go underwater or some of my clothing will ever be worn up a mountain or on a yacht. They are just nice things to have.

Of course it is impossible to exploit the limits of most cars, let alone supercars, on public roads, but people want different things from cars. Some just like to look at them, some like cleaning them, for some they help with a sense of achievement and for you it seems to be mostly about extracting the performance. There's no right or wrong or would you disqualify ownership of fast cars unless they're going to be tracked?

When you're younger I get that it might frustrate to see me use a GT3 to get to and from pub lunches or a Ferrari for weekend jaunts to garden openings but that's just life for most people. You have to wait/work for your dreams.

Someone not using something to its potential is just a reflection of their priorities and they are no less right than you are. When I think about my attitude to speed and driving between my twenties and now fifties, it's night and day.

I hope you get a GT Porsche in the not too distant future. You sound passionate about them.

Mike RT4

I totally accept that I am a car snob LOL, and even if I was a multi-millionaire, I wouldn't pay "Ferrari tax", not because I couldn't, but because I think the running costs are just not commensurate with the work done or the true values of the parts. There are some horrendous stories of shared parts with run of the mill cars that are only just into three figures, but the identical part from a Ferrari dealer is well into four figures. It is this kind of day-light robbery that sticks in my throat with Ferrari. I always get the impression that they charge what they feel they can get away with, rather than the actual true value of the work / part, all because "we're Ferrari". That just doesn't sit well with me.

I don't see them being "ultimate" either, they trade too much on their name and to me Ferrari is to the car world what Rolex is to the watch world (I'm an Omega man ). I would have thought that if you mixed it with Ferrari owners you would see all of the above on a regular basis . Obviously some people just don't care and are willing to pay what-ever it takes to have that prancing horse key-ring, but unless it is one of the special cars (and it gets used regularly rather than treated as a mere investment), I look at them with pity that they have been brain-washed that Ferrari is the car to have to prove you are part of the "elite" .

I also would never buy one of these cars and NOT use the performance, so although I have no issue what-so-ever with people driving to the pub, going on Sunday drives and weekend jaunts in these cars, I like to think (even if it isn't true LOL) that they also go to Spa or the 'ring etc and get the thrill of using the car properly. Where my snobbery comes into play is when I see a "Comfort" GT3 (this is the model with the standard Porsche seats rather than the carbon "Clubsport" bucket items), and I just think "WHY!?", why buy a GT3 that has been designed for track to just use on the road, when a "cooking" model would do THAT job far better.

I'm about four years away from reaching my goal, so hopefully Porsche are still producing an NA GT3 by then LOL . However, what has surprised me is how enjoyable the S2000 is, both on track and on the road. It might not have the power to pull the skin off a rice(r) pudding, but it is more fun than all my other cars at much lower speeds (and I am wondering if the GT3 will feel like that as well, where you have to be well beyond the speed limit to get the same buzz that the S2000 is able to provide without breaking the law). Being able to have the roof down adds an extra element to the S2000 as well - the fact that so much can be done to it to individualise it is just an added bonus for someone like me who loves tinkering .

jml

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MHky...ature=youtu.be

Nick Graves

Someone found out a long time ago that shell bearings from a Bedford CF could be trimmed to fit a Ferrari and that Jaguar/Unipart would sell you a clutch and brakes far cheaper than would Ferrari. So there's nothing new...

One thing I've always admired about the S2000 (and the NSX) is that they feel 'alive' at reasonably moderate speeds and in these days of repression of personal freedom (and the gridlock used as its justification) that is becoming increasingly important.

I therefore consider that of the Moderns, only Lotus really appeals. Partly, the rarity and exclusivity overcomes that Porsche/Ferrari stigma (you've still got to be a bit of a masochist to tolerate Lotus!) and the ride/handling/alive feel is still there.

Plus, they perhaps better square the road use/occasional track day circle better than many of the "exotics" which no longer are that exotic.

Having said that, there is a certain appeal to the TVR TE37 as a great big "fuck you" to the modern world....

MB

Yup, after 4 years of trailering I called it a day. I now turn up in the road car, a team bring the car to the track and do lots of things to it while I eat biscuits etc Its much better, but comes at a cost. I have to say i've always been a bit uneasy about driving a road car to a trackday and hoping it's ok to drive home.

Again it's likely a GT3 buyer will track it every now and then, but equally will have the £££ to have a track car too. Have to agree with gad though, I think there's a huge amount of people who would buy a GT3 for cock waving. I remeber someone looking at mine and commenting 'it's not an RS though' Quite an uneducated comment imo. An RS has no more power, but might shave a second off a lap time in the right hands - but it demonstrates to me that people see these things as status. I don't like generalisations but I do think there are a lot of people buy one as it's 'the thing' to have. Conversely a guy I race with has a 991 RS so maybe not

It's great they exist, but I still not convinced of the 1 car fits all thing.

MB

Mike if it's any help, I enjoy driving the S more than I did the GT3

I'd honestly prefer an Exige if I was going for a roat and track car. That car was a lot of fun, even at 30 mph. The GT3 had to be doing mega speeds, the brakes are a bit wooden, and it bobs around a lot.

Cayman GT4 I had was a FAR better car than the 997 GT3.

Mike RT4

Regarding the S2000, that does not surprise me in the least, as I have been reaching the same conclusion over my own cars.

If you had said about the 996 version, it would not have surprised me, as the 996 Turbo was one of the most disappointing cars I have ever driven (bobbed like a boat on the front and was underwhelming in every respect). I am surprised that you felt that about a 997 GT3, as I found the Mk I RS version of that car an amazing experience (albeit on track). However, I have not driven a GT3 (but been passenger in a variety of models).

I missed the boat with a GT4, as I didn't want to sell one of the cars I have (as it was / is still appreciating) and I didn't have the spare capital to do it without doing so. A friend bought his one at exactly the right time, paid list for it (which was just under £80k with all the "right" options) and was offered £110k as soon as he took delivery .

This is the problem with the GT cars, if you can't get your name down (which requires a £10k up front commitment), then you have to pay a premium for one - where I would rather be the one that has that amount in the car by buying it new at list price (and able to spec it how I want) rather than a premium for someone "else's" car.

I too (being from Norfolk ) love the Lotus brand, but the current Exige I find looks a bit clumsy from certain angles (the previous 4 cylinder model looks just about perfect - as does the Hennessey Venom), but the V6 Exige is disappointing in the looks department.

Nick Graves

I would say, Lotuses look far better in the plastic than they do in photos.

Especially the Evora, which does photograph like someone took a tyre inflator to an early-1970s concept car.

Is it safe yet to say that I get the 98x cars, but have always thought the 99x Porsches were inferior to the former? Clearly I'm insufficiently skilled to drive a GTRSThing properly.

Mike RT4

Feck me, Porsche has just released the 'ring lap time and it is a faintly ridiculous 7:12.7 !

djchocice

Lawd that is quick, and the want is strong with that. Makes you wonder how quick the RS will be.