japhethwar

With all the talk of valve stuff on here and the s2ki facebook page I thought i'd put up a few pics. This will clearly show why you need to be mindfull of your retainers (on ap1, 2.0 liter cars).
This first picture is a 70k mile ap1 motor with failed retainers. The valves on the left of center have had new retainers installed, the valves on the right have not. Notice how the valve stem protrudes quite a bit farther from the retainer when it has been replaced.
In this picture you see why the valve stems stick out much farther on the new retainers. The ap1 retainers are a good bit thinner and will crack in the center. This allows the keepers to sink farther into the retainer causing the valve to lose spring pressure. Eventually they will start to fail completely. When this happens the engine will begin misfiring, and losing compression. At this point your on borrowed time if you continue driving. As the valve retainer will fail completely,the valve will drop into the cylinder, and the keepers will fly out into the motor. This is VERY BAD.
This is the part numbers for the Ap2 replacement parts. You will also need a valve cover gasket, spark tube seals, and valve cover bolt grommetts for the complete job. All this is available at any honda dealer or on the web. You will need either 8 or 16 retainers, and 16 or 32 keepers depending on whether you doing both sides or not.


These pics came from a 70k mile ap1 which had 7 of 8 intake side retainers failed. Most likely from overrev, but who knows for sure. This is very easy to diagnose by simply pulling the valve cover and checking the valve lash. I have been asked several times recently about doing these and what it costs. If we do these at the shop I work at (Fisher's Garage) its gonna run around 600 for the full job. Thats 400 labor and around 200 for all the parts. Thats doing the intake side only as the exhaust side does not ever seem to fail. If you want to do them all the price will increase about 100$. I will do them on the side as well at my house. The labor is 250$ for me to do them at the house and you supply all your own parts. The job takes approximately 5 hours to complete as I like to take my time with these. It easy to lose a keeper, or make mistakes when you rush. If your interested in having this done pm me on here or txt me at 864-444-3316. If you just want your valves adjusted its 75$ on the side and you'll only need a valve cover gasket. Hope this helps anyone who doesn't know what the big deal is all about.

conzetts2k

WOW good info here peeps! Makes me want to upgrade mine just in case...I like to over build my stuff lol

TPhong

Sounds like a deal. I know where I will be going to have mine done!

japhethwar

I should add that this problem seems to be much more prevalent on motors that have seen heavy abuse or serious mechanical overrev. I know Yves (yellowjacket) widebody car is over 200k miles without a problem. If your tracking the car or driving it hard at high rpms's, its probably a good idea to upgrade. As long as you check them from time to time there's no real need to be worried though. These engines are very robust and with proper maintanence, and no undo abuse, you will most likely never have an issue.

Ultimate_Combination

How much to rent that valve spring retainer holder tool you have there?

japhethwar

Sorry I don't rent it. Can be had for around 60-70 dollars on ebay, amzon, and i think full blown motorsports sells it as well.

wadzii

https://www.s2ki.com/s2000/topic/100...e-spring-test/

And this is why you want to upgrade your springs. Stronger retainers is just a bandaid for the bigger problem of the springs being too weak for 9000 rpms. The intake retainers are more likely to fail because the intake valves are heavier.

you can get that tool from here... http://www.euroexportinc.com/store/t...ing-tools.html

S2k Awe

Again, it should be mentioned, that this upgrade is only helpful if your engine encounters a mechanical over-rev.

I have not heard of any failures that can be documented to never having a mechanical over-rev.

I've got 130k miles on mine, and I just did a valve check and adjustment for the 2nd time (1st at 30k), and there was no signs of damage, and only 3 valves were adjusted.

My car has seen plenty of track events, but I have never had a mechanical over-rev.

If I ever encounter a mechanical over-rev, I'll be performing this upgrade whether there appears to be a problem or not!

These AP1's can take plenty of rev-limited revs and not cause any issues.

twohoos has a great writeup on it here with great input from Billman.