RTD 2019 - Suggestions
 

:hello: I talked to several new people as well as seasoned members of our community, and I'm seeing some common threads. The main feedback I got was (from new people) that the event was "over too soon" or felt "rushed" or "compacted", which is a sentiment I can relate to. I also spoke with the bartender at Wildwood Grill and she told me that we are the only car club who doesn't stay Sunday through Sunday, so I'm throwing it out there - Rock the Dragon 2019: Sunday through Sunday.

Before you tear my idea to shreds, allow me to elaborate why I think it would be a good idea:

1.) Lots of newcomers "missed" drives. If we had repeated drives throughout the week, it would be easier to go to Franklin/Cherohala/Little Switzerland/wherever, and have an alternative activity lined up for the day for people who have already gone on the drive/plan on doing it some other time of the week. Example: Monday, we could do a Cherohala drive with lunch at Tellico Plains, while those of us who don't want to tag along can go wild water rafting. Which brings me to point #2:
2.) We have more time for socializing. A lot of newcomers and of course seasoned guys have expressed the wish to socialize more, to put a face to the screen name. This would be possible by doing non-car activities for 1 or 2 days of the week (see example above) - there are innumerable experiences that we miss out on such as ziplining, rafting, panning for gold or going shopping in Gatlinburg, or Highlands, just to name a few.
3.) For a significant number of attendees, this is their main (or second) vacation they take per year. Again, several people I've spoken with have said the event feels "go, go, go" and doesn't even leave room for a bit of relaxation, which again I can agree with.

So again, I would really appreciate your heartfelt feedback to making the event a week next spring. I'm more than happy to help with organizing and securing sponsors (I have a friend who works in PR, and could get me an intro to Honda or Tire Rack for more awesome raffle prizes - I know I sure would have loved to have won some this event ;) )

Let me know your thoughts, I'm glad to type up an itinerary that would outline the week, and help Ken and others substantially with the organization of it.

In my experience people always say they wish it (any event in general) was longer but when the time comes to put up the vacation days, time, and money they typically always back out.

A great compromise would be to keep the formal event as Thursday-Sunday but have an extended option for the days leading into RtD. We already do one add on day (Ken's Super Fancy Shmancy Dinner) so adding Sunday-Tuesday or any combination of those days would be simple!

I'm sure room discounts can be extended to the days leading into RtD.

It's easy to just coordinate with friends and show up a few days early! That's what I always do at least.

We could definitely use help with obtaining sponsorship. Tire Rack and Honda have both been hesitant to sponsor anything because 1) the S2000 is an old platform and 2) Honda is probably following Toyota to Texas, so their spend in many small marketing categories has been frozen or reduce. So as it was explained to me when I spoke with their marketing department.

But, the squeaky wheel get's the grease (or maybe the brakes are just cold), so the more requests and relationships built the more probable it is to land great sponsors.

The CTR, BRZ/FRS/86 and Focus RS craze has hurt our chances of getting marketing dollars. We just need to find the right people at the right time with the right budget.

I drove down the the Canadians this year just to get more days so it sounds good to me. A week might be kind of long, maybe just add a day next year and see how that goes, if people love it then add another day until people say enough. The idea from GUTI007 is a great thought too, keep it the same but add Thursday as an optional day and setup some drives for that day, maybe some of the new drives you're talking.

I like the ideas being thrown around and think it might be nice to have some organization around a longer event. I came down Wednesday so I could get an extra day which is when I did most of my driving. Next year I am already planning to come down a day sooner so I can spend an off day doing rafting or boating.

Some people will come early some will not, but perhaps in the future we can organize some "pre-events" that would get more people down there sooner. Apply some structure. Personally after my first event, I want to do as much driving as I can during the week and on Friday/Saturday stay off the roads (too much traffic to have fun). Friday afternoon and Saturday after the rollout I'd love to do hiking and boating.

As far as sponsors, I used to run and organize big 3 day events in AZ and have experience putting together sponsorship proposals and would be open to helping next year. I always reached out to detailing companies and they supplied me with detail products. Stoner Car Care never responded to me, they just shipped me two cases of glass cleaner which is great to have on a trip.

It's already informally Wednesday through Sunday now. I can always make Wednesday a "formal" RtD2019 day. That's easily done. I doubt that I'd have any problem convincing Fontana to extend the special room rate. Of course, if you want to see how that works, you can always join in the Wednesday night dinner or I can plan something at Fontana for Wednesday for a special dinner or something. Personally, after working on the Spring event for almost 5 months, I'm not sure I would want to be there a week but it's worthwhile finding out.

Good suggestion Florian. I'll check with Fontana in the Fall.

Ken - we will be in touch regarding some ideas I have to make a week-long event "tolerable" ;)

Thanks everybody else for your feedback! Just trying my best to keep more people coming and have more enthusiasm for these events!

Another idea - want your registration fee waived? Volunteer to be our video editor/take over a portion of the event. For example, if you have great video editing skills, you volunteer your time Saturday afternoon to put together a "best of" video for the banquet Saturday night. If you're a good organizer, you make sure everything is set up in time for Friday evening on the ball field. This way, the weight of the entire event isn't on any one person's shoulders. I think if we split the responsibilities by 3 or 4 people who each contribute a few hours, we could have an easier time organizing. Just throwing it out there.

Or maybe you'll get a t-shirt out of it!

Wait a second.... :tipwink:

Between ensuring my wife has a good time and leading drives, I don't have much else ability to help elsewhere. I suspect I'll be occupied with my own group of newbs if not with my wife. Many of you have seen stuff I've done in the past and I'd love to offer a crash course if anyone wants to help but doesn't know how.

I've actually wanted to do a more in depth education session on safe/skilled/fun driving but have had zero time. Maybe it would be a Youtube course some day! I would like the S2K club to maintain its reputation as the safest, fastest, and friendliest club at Fontana.

As a newby to RTD, I was having trouble understanding the schedule, available drives and how those drives/events fit within the schedule. It would be more overheard for the organizers, but a roll-up of all actives with times would be helpful.

Perhaps someone could share a Google spreadsheet, listing actives and entrants in chronological order. Then you could go to one place and see what you were signed up for and how that activity fit within the overall schedule. Individual leaders(?) could edit and add/edit events and names as people signed up. Another option would be to have the schedule rolled-up into a spreadsheet, but split drives into separate worksheets to list the entrants for each drive.

These are all really good suggestions, keep 'em coming!

Did you receive an itinerary via email before the event? It had general start times for each event/drive. For your specific drive start time you follow the forum, and while at the event, post on the white board in the main lobby. Or at least that's what I always do.

Maybe we need to formalize the white board and include a picture of the drive leader/car so newbies can put a face with the screen name! haha

Mountain Road Driving School presented by Aaron. Haha

But for real, I was please to see many following safe driving protocol this spring. Staying in the lines, driving within your own limits, checking your ego in at the front lobby. I will admit I got exposed once on Airport Rd. Carried too much speed into a decreasing radius blind corner. I even said to myself 10 second before, "There's a tricky corner coming up, stay wide." :feint:

There were a few, who shall remain nameless (you know who you are), that need to consider changing their reckless style or consider not returning...:ignore: :zip: :hidechair:

"Chickity check yo self before your wreck yo self" - Ice Cube-

You know what would be cool? Getting use of the public safety training center in Franklin and hosting a RtD Autocross Event! We design a course that plays into the handling characteristics of an S2000, split into classes, and let the stop watch do the talking.

Of course the necessary tech inspection cert would be required, as would a helmet (could be rented). Heck, one day AutoX insurance is actually pretty reasonable for some added protection!

I agree with jeallen, figuring out who was doing what and when was archaic. Pulling up forum threads from last year, scrolling down and tracing out who who had dropped or who had changed times while on the iffy WiFi was a pain. I kept checking the white board and little to nothing was on it.
I'm not complaining, I just think we can come up with better organization options.

I agree with extending the event whether formally or informally. I would like to come down on Wednesday next year and get some more driving in earlier so maybe I could get on the river in a raft or something on Friday or Sat. I really didn't want to go home at the end of this one...lol. Also it would be nice to have a sign up sheet posted on the white board for drives and start times since the wifi is shaky. I tend to get paranoid about "missing the bus". I'm not complaining either, just a few ideas. This event is awesome! The car starts to fade into the background after meeting everyone.

Lots of good ideas flying around.
I like that most of them are not just asking the organizer to do more work. Kens got the solid foundation looked after. From there it is up to the group to add activities.

We have lots of skills in the group and if someone is able to improve the event by stepping up and adding to it, terrific. Billman has done this for years with his tech session.
A performance driving session would be great. May strictly be a classroom ordeal.
There have already been several years with added days before the event. Just need someone to post up that they are doing "whatever" prior to the event if individuals would like to participate.
One year it was the Double Dragon, Another year it was a planned Little Switzerland Drive.
The Canadian tradition is a 3 day group drive to the event. We generally post it up to see if anyone wants to join in.
Someone could easily arrange a pre-event rafting or pontoon boat cruise. Just post it up early, prior to the event to get interested people to attend.

I try to post a comprehensive listing of all events/drives/cluster..... stuff at the top of the Dragon Forum so that everyone will have an idea of drives, etc. This year it was stickied at the top and looked like this:

https://www.s2ki.com/forums/dragon-e...-find-1183822/

All the info in one easy to swallow capsule, available at your grocers. :D



and if you think I'm long-winded...never get a Canadian talking :)

What are you saying Ken? :scratch:

ALL of the event information was available and easy to find.

No, the part about long winded Canadians?
:p

Was wonderng when you might get to that... :)

This year I looked at the itinerary and drives I signed up for and thought it was going to be a busy schedule with a bit to remember. So I decided to create my own itinerary and put it in my phone. I just referred to my phone for the next thing I signed up to do, when and where to go for drives and dinners. Very easy on my part and I didn't need the organizers to do it for me.

OMG! What a concept. :). I do exactly the same thing only I keep the entire itinerary because of the running around I have to do.

Dragon Fall Run is going to run from 09/12 to 09/16. This will be the trial run on a longer event. Depending on how it goes, I will seriously consider extending it more.

+1.

just wake up, gather some friends, go driving, show up for dinner. For my first 2 events, I followed around then came up with my own drives and invited people along.
But to keep on track, I'll still come on Thursday- the full week is too long for me to be away.
darcy

This is my concern. A lot of people don't have a week to burn at the Dragon (or anywhere that's not work related). So, the core days remain the same, the shoulder (a nice hotel term for those days on either side of an event) will remain the same.

Suggestions.....

Find more drive leaders and have them post their drives. I can give 3-5 routes to whoever wants to lead a drive. Most drives fill up within a few days/weeks of being posted.

People need to sign up for drives WELL BEFORE the event. For the drive leaders, its a PITA to try and add multiple people to a full drive. There is a reason why I limit my drives to 10 cars.

For the fall and next spring, need to get an email sent out to all 1st and 2nd time attendees asking them to sign up for drives before they fill up. This should go out a day or three after they register.

Yes, thank you. The folks who are the core of the event know and understand the weekend, because they have been there and done that, over and over. But to newbs it was arcane.

I agree that it can be a bit difficult to follow if you don't visit the Dragon forum on S2KI very often. Most drive leaders update the list of people attending their drives often. I check drives I lead at least twice a day to add the new people and to make sure that any changes are incorporated. Most other drive leaders do as well. There are a number of organized drives every year. Some are always held, some are one-offs. The drives that are always held are:

-Thursday Drive to Meet the OKI Group (open to all)
-Fridays are for Franklin (limited to 10 cars per group. Number of groups varies)
-The Group Dragon Drive (all participants)
-The Cherohala Saturday Lunch and Drive (generally limited to10 or 15 cars per group)

Other drives are organized and posted on the Dragon forum. Two years ago, I stopped including the drives in the itinerary because the size had grown unwieldy. I don't think there's an easy answer, but I'll consider all suggestions.

agreed- maximum 10 cars. I try to announce gathering time and leave time on channel 4 leading up to the drive. I'm not about to wait around for people to decide to come- nor do I fault a drive leader who leaves at the appointed time on the dot or on the other hand, chats up the drivers and leaves a few minutes late. It tends to be pretty organic at times.

darcy

That was a good idea, but there was no roll-up of the info or how the individual events fit in the overall plan for the weekend. The current approach just lacks cohesiveness.

Also... there were drives posted as not for newbys. This begs the question, if you want new drivers, what are the newby options for those days/times?
In the end, there more leaders and and more drives for more levels of drivers, but those were rather last minute additions.
.

Almost all drives have a day and time and meeting place. I agree there is no roll-up but I like to think that most people tend to follow most (if not all) posts in the Dragon forums and are somewhat cognizant of drives and the days they happen. Now, do I agree there could be more information? Absolutely! Dries are usually listed as "spirited", "moderate" or "Not for the faint of heart" and sometimes all in the same drive announcement. Sometimes you might select a group and find the pace is more spirited than you're comfortable with. That's the fault of the veterans. Most of us are familiar with driving styles of drive leaders and select accordingly. That information should be added and will be.

Some drives are lead by people who feel that moderate means 10 mph over the speed limit and some who think that 20 mph over is slow. Part of that is knowing drive leaders. I'l try to make sure that is taken care of. Other drives have inherent hazards (Devils Triangle for one). There are rudimentary (at best) shoulders and absolutely no room for error. Depending on who leads, even I might not go on that drive. That knowledge comes from knowing drive leaders. Again, see above. Somewhat akin to my Thursday night Dragon drive, I lead almost all the newbies. I know the Dragon (well, a bit anyway), and I know the road can be daunting at night for veterans to say nothing of newbies. That explains the "maybe we'll do the speed limit and maybe we won't" notice I always give at the beginning of the drive. As a (bad) example, if you're 5 years old and have never ridden anything faster than a tricycle and someone gives you a motorcycle, the best you could hope for is minor corollary damage.

If you register for drives you're interested in early, Scott, you don't have to worry about last minute changes. That being said however, there are always people who don't/can't/won't read the Dragon forums. There are always al fresco drive leaders who step ut at the last minute and lead drives for the "stragglers".

I'm going to add the planned drives to the itinerary for Dragon Fall Run and see how that works out. It won't be a list of participants, it'll just be the drives planned for that day. I generally send the itinerary out 3 to 5 days ahead of the event so that will give people who havne't been on the forum time to check out what's available. I'll also try to ensure that drives are posted on the whiteboard in the lodge lobby the day before they happen. I hope that will make things easier.

OK... help us out, what do we need to post so that new people understand what THEY need to do, to be ready for the event? It all needs to be done prior to the event. People need to understand, that they need to make an effort to make sure their weekend turns out great.

The organizers can't do everything, they need a hand from everyone who will be attending.

After the 1st event, most understand that they need to watch the forums, sign up early, etc....

But, what can we do to help the 1st timers out, that we don't do already? How to we get the point across to them to visit and interact on the forums, to sign up for drives, ask questions, etc.....

We really do want the 1st and 2nd timers to come back for more... that's what keeps this group/event going.

Biggest thing for me would be to post a complete schedule in the main thread, include all events and drives with approximate start and end times. You could link drives in the agenda to where to sign up.

John, the thread that has links to all Dragon events already exists. Iti's at the top of the Dragon Forum. There are links to everything that is happening. It gives one place to find information about events during RtD and DFR.

You can find the one for Rock the Dragon 2018 here: http://www.s2ki.com/forums/dragon-ev...-find-1183822/
That thread should answer any questions about where to sign up, what drives are happening, what start times who's leading, where they're going, number of cars allowed, etc.

The Canadian crew has been doing close to a full week for the past 4 years now and it's totally worth it. Might be hard to convince 100+ cars to show up for a week. Allowing for a couple of sign up options would hopefully get the folks who can spare a week of vacation but not lose the guys who don't want to join the event mid-way.

I think there are some simple things we can do this fall / next spring
1. Printed lists on the board with the drive schedule + sign up sheets. Print out the names that have already signed up and open spots for people to add their names in. I don't think this is a big undertaking - Takes a lot of the confusion / connectivity issues out of the way for newbies + people who don't check the forum too often
2. New drives - I would love to do a scavenger hunt drive - I'm sure between all the pictures we have, we could muster up some clues, places people need to take pictures in front of, and throw a couple dollars from the registration fee towards a prize.
3. Bigger prizes! One route is sponsorship, the other option is to literally have 3-5$ more in registration fees go towards a raffle where we give someone a set of tires or something like that.
4. New activities - Perhaps doing a 4 hour drive and then a couple hours of activity time, like white water rafting, or zip lining, or whatever would be a cool addition to the drive portfolio.
5. More involvement in the event - Not really an idea or anything, but maybe there's a "job listing" of things that Ken and team want to hand off / don't have the time to do - See if you get any bites?

Hmm, didn't realize I had a team. I have a bunch of great friends who help out with organizing drives and such (you know who they are), could always use someone to fill out the whiteboard in the lobby on Wednesday or Thursday or whenever.

I had someone trying to round up sponsorship for the Spring, it's getting more and more difficult. The car is WAY out of production, it's a shrinking market and sponsors don't see any large amounts of profit gained by product given. That problem is only going to increase in the coming years unfortunately. Maybe you should approach Canadian Tire and see if you can trade those Canadian Tire dollars for a set of Bridgestones :). Seriously, if you want to try to garner sponsors from up north, please feel free. Meanwhile, I'll continue to hit up my local Honda dealer for goodies that he wants to donate, buy the occasional goodie myself and see what my group of volun-tolds can come up with.

Yes, I know and I visited all those threads multiple times. The issue is the lack of a complete schedule and how the drives/events fit with in the schedule. Yes Fridays are for Franklin, but as a newby, I had no idea what happens before the drive, after the drive, if there options/alternative activities if I don't go on a drive.

My goal is to find a BBQ joint, and find the most circuitous way to get there...then do it again on Saturday. But...

Fontana village has some interesting stuff too-
1. downstairs there is a theatre where they play movies and a history of Fontana Dam's construction.
2. Its great to hang out at the pool- when the pool is open. There's also frisbee golf and Putt Putt.
3. Driving over to Fontana dam- upper and lower section makes for a short but really interesting excursion. Star gazing at the dam is excellent- there's even a road to the upper dam that's loads of fun to tear up and down with the car at full chat- we could have a "best Honda S2000 noise" contest :). Until the cops show up.
4. another idea would be to pick 3 or 4 waterfall's or dams and hit them on a drive route...the dam tour.

really for me, sharing a drive with friends is what its all about. I love the car show. I really liked the Friday night set up this year.

darcy

Well Ken, I guess that's my point. You should have some folks helping you out. Dave did an awesome job with the presentation this year.
I'll message a couple folks I know up North to see if we can get some sponsorship. The point around putting some of the registration fee towards getting some big ticket items might be good. Personally, I could have done without the hot dogs and burgers at the restaurant. Would have been happy with a beer swap and just hanging out with the guys.Could possibly put some of that $ towards prizes?

All for it. Don't know what I'd do without at least one Darcy run a season

I'm going to jump in a little here:
1.) Has been done. There used to be a itinerary in the welcome packet that was handed out during several points of the event. Thursday evening, Friday morning, Friday evening. I will personally volunteer to hand out a complete, zip-lock bag style welcome packet Thursday nights, if Ken permits it. Getting the itinerary early puts the event into perspective, and saves a lot of hassles.
2.) We used to have the "Poker Run" on Friday afternoon, I vote we bring that back. The prize used to be a GoPro, or similar high ticket item.
3.) Tire Rack has sponsored us a set of Star Specs in the past. I will reach out to them to see what all I can do to help get that back onto the table.
4.) Absolutely. Need. New. Activities!!
5.) See my original post - you need to divide all the responsibilities up so it doesn't all fall on one person. Let's see what skills we can drum up in the group and then distribute. I volunteer for finding sponsorship and handing out welcome packets.

There are a lot of great ideas here and I plan on implementing a bunch of them. It's always great to see newbies turn into veterans and return event after event, year after year. The Dragon community is a strong one and I think it's safe to say that we all want it to continue to grow and improve.

Or when the dumb drive leader starts the drive at 8am, no one ever signs up! Now if only I could remember who that guy was. :scratch:

I'm going to go out on a limb here... but I bet the drive leader had a 8-10 hour drive lined up, exploring new roads that most of us have never been on.

Also bet the drive leader was a Canadian, or Bama Dave! :)

I don't consider the 8:00 time dumb, just what was needed to make the most of the day! :)

Oh man, that was pretty. Had to do that twice. Tires were yelling all sorts of praises

It was a long drive, would've returned just in time for the banquet. I suspect most have been on most of the roads, just not in one outing. Leader wasn't Canadian or David, or even a Canadian David, but maybe Ohioan??? :p

Something I'd consider, is drive the entire Blue Ridge Parkway to the Dragon. I've done parts of it when I was in my 20s, but haven't been on the road since. Lots of options to stop off and explore.

You really don't want to do that.... 45mph speed limit....

We did it from Asheville to the end... took forever!

Think we took like 3 days to drive the Parkway, with stops!

And so you have something else pressing to do for three days? :scratch:

Driving the same curves for three days is boring..... even stopping by the Mast General Store and other places.... the drive is still boring!

My professional name among friends is Twinkle Toes :D
Among my enemies its Double Yellow Stig :dance2:

Everyone should have the Grand Theft Auto cheat code: a GPS or Google maps attached to your dash! On the straights, a quick glance can give you a heads up of just how tricky that next turn might be. This is the primary reason I can often choose the proper gear before entering a corner.

I should have a bit more time to wander this fall event so I will make a effort to put things on whiteboard.

No, you just didn't have the travel guide along.
;)