This is just a placeholder for now. I'm typing up the results. Check back later.

 

You're such a tease

 

We had a really good day today. First of all, thanks to Jason for setting things up, and thanks to JoTech for the great facility! Don't forget, they're offering club members special discounts on VAFCs and AEM CAIs. Second, I don't have everybody's here, I just put together some charts of things I found interesting. Please PM me with your email and I can send you copies of your actual runs.

First, the fun stuff - forced induction! I put together a couple charts comparing a stock, Comptech supercharged and 9psi turbocharged car.



Next up is a well-modified high-mileage S2000.


Next, a completely stock MY00 S2000 with 37k miles. Coolant temps were 183F, 192F and 205F.


And now we have a completely stock MY03 with 5k miles. Temps: 183F, 187F and 194F.


The two stock cars are pretty darn close. Perhaps the '03 will gain some more once it gets past 10k miles.

And now the really noteworthy cars - two MY04 S2000s
The first with only 670 miles. This car and the above two stock ones were run back to back to back. 176F, 186F, and 205F. (Remember - coolant temps.)

Note the peak hp is essentially identical to the two above stock cars.

The second ith 1700 miles. This was dynoed later on in the day. 208F, 205F, and 207F.

More miles, more hp...

So. Umm. Compare these charts to the press car on www.vtec.net. The shape of the curves for both cars are quite a bit different, no? Especially right before redline, where the press car had a significant spike in torque. Useless in daily driving, and nearly so even for performance driving - but it shure does make for some pretty peak dyno readings, doesn't it?

Here's some more charts so you can draw your own conclusions.
All four stock cars' air/fuel ratio.


Same for power.


And now torque.


My thoughts? Since the '04 customer car torque curves don't match up with the press car's, I'm leaning towards calling it a "ringer" for the moment. The brand new car made almost exactly as much hp as a relatively new 03. And the partially broken in one only made about 3hp more. Given another several thousand miles, I really don't think the F22C1's will make 18 to 26 more hp than the F20C's. I'm still of the opinion that Honda should have stuck with the 9000rpm F20C and just changed the gearing around some.

Some other tidbits that I haven't put charts together on just yet... A Tornado thingy (goes into the intake) can cost you 50hp if it comes loose and gets sideways in the intake. A PRM intake will cost you 10 hp. (But damn it sounds good.) And a Miata with only 117 rwhp can still kick your ass at autocross!

 

so far, I'm not impressed with the 2004.

fred, nice job on tunning your turbo kit, you have the longest lasting power band i have seen on a turbo car.

Based on what I saw, my supercharger would have been second on this dyno day. I really wish things would have been operational. Last dyno 8/20/03 297.9 whp and 181 ftbs I was hitting 200 hp at 6K, unlike freds 250 at 6k.

I had another oil fire on Wednesday, another M-105 backed off and oil was gushing out. I ran down to 1 qt of oil. Mobil one did it's job. There is nothing wrong with the engine as of yet. I will most like be filling a claim through my insurance company and having the vehicle claimed under to oil/engine fires. Hopefully they will total the car out. Physically, besides the melted rear bumper, it looks fine. Now when you get under the hood and really look, you can see the damage on the outside of the wiring harness and other plastis, like the fuse box.

Just to let some of you know. I will be getting the supercharger fixed under warranty and I will most likely be returning the car back to stock form. I should know on Monday if I will be approved for a 2004 Z06.

If I am, I will post up everything that is available, I will most likely offer the installation of the parts in my garage. Including the supercharger. Btw, the fires at this point have not been related the supercharger, but due to faulty oil filter seal design. Although the main seal on the super charger input shaft did break loose and squirt oil out under load.

talk to you all later,
Jeremy

 

Jeremy, bummer news about the fires. Hopefully you'll be up an running in something soon. Would you still come out to our autocrosses in the Z06? Sorry about the low turnout at the track today - as you can see, we were busy elsewhere.

Do you have a VAFC with a harness?

 

Thanks for the results. It was fun. Too bad the chart scales are not equal since it makes comparisons more difficult. Is a composite with the best run from all NA cars possible, or is it not worth the effort?

 

yes, I have a VAFC with harness. I was thinking about packaging that with the super charger kit and wiring in the vortech electronics to the harness, so that the next person wouldn't have to cut into the OEM wiring harness. I have since figured out how to do this.

Yes, I would still come out to auto-x in the Z06. As long as I don't have a CMRA endurance race or sprint that weekend. I have 9 races next year for endurance and sprints. I know I will be racing in the endurance races with my SV650S, I am going to spend about 2K to get it track worthy and competitive. anyway, back on track with the dyno comparison.

I think it was a big mistake on Honda's part with the new '04. lowered redline, HP doesn't appear to be that much more and tq has a small increase.

Does anyone know if the new car accelerates quicker than the previous years? With lowering gearing and the fact that motor hits peak HP quicker, should mean it is quicker, or not?

 

For any member who wants to post this .jpg to the board (I'm a guest and can't upload images), link below is a back to back comparison between a MY03 w/5K miles (blue lines) vs. the MY04 w/700ish miles (red lines). Another MY04 with 1500 mi dynoed slightly higher later in the day. MY04s should do well in B Stock next year....

http://www.geocities.com/stantaur3/04vs03Dyno.jpg

Although some may say "There's no replacement for displacement" after looking at the comparison charts, I'd counter with "Got Boost?" after looking at the NA/Supercharged/Turbo comparison page. Fred's smooth torque curve and 300+ RWHP with daily driver manners is a great alternative for those of us with pre-04s weighing trade-in depreciation vs. turbo/IC investments.

Big thanks to all who showed up for this gathering -- you've helped many of us learn more about our options....

Stantaur

 

I don't see the point they are with in 1-5% of each other.

gernby's car has to be the one with the 208-210 peak hp range.

 

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