Hyper-X

I've been giving a lot of thought regarding my approach with dealing with my S in B-stock. I've done tires (Kuhmo Victoracers 225f/245r) and the car has great grip but the oversteer condition is worse and jeopardizes full cornering speed.

For those who are competing in stock class (or was at some point), what have you found that made the most impact in the improvement of your times (aside from driver improvement)?

1. Tires

2. Alignment (please specify UK OEM or custom settings)

3. Front sway bar (please specify brand and stiffness setting)

4. Exhaust system (cat-back, please specify brand and model)

5. Shocks (please specify brand, model and setting if any)

6. Brake components (fluid, pads, etc.)

I'm currently only at #1, but plan on doing #2 (UK OEM alignment spec), and #3 (Saner or Comptech Adjustable) in that order.

payneinthe

The general wisdom is that tires and swaybar need to go together. As you've found, the 225/245 combo is a recipe for oversteer hell without a 1.25" solid bar. I've got the Saner, which is a great value. Time will tell if it's on par with the Comptech and Gendron bars, but I suspect it is.

cthree

Do this:

1. tires and saner sway bar (together) and alignment.
2. brake pads and fluid
3. shocks (koni yellow or similar)

That's it. cat back is pointless. You should be able to auto-x prep for about $1000-$1500 which includes everything:

$700 for tires, $80 for alignment, $200 for the sway bar, $250 for pads and fluid. Stock wheels are cheap (~$250) so you should get another set (or get some nice 17/18 inchers for the street and save the stocks for autox)

Once you get competitive get the shocks and another alignment.

vroom

I don't think that he really needs the brakes or fluid for just autocross.

payneinthe

Fluid is definitely not necessary. Pads are nice to have, but won't make a dang bit of difference unless you're an expert with the brakes.

PedalFaster

Agreed with payneinthe and cthree that tires, alignment, and sway bar together should be your first investment -- as a package they should be considered the baseline for autocross S2000s. If you're on a budget, go with the Saner bar -- a 1.25" solid steel tube is a 1.25" solid steel tube whether you pay $200 or $600 for it.

Something that's been overlooked so far has been multiple sets of wheels and tires. The right tires for the site and conditions (e.g. Hoosiers for concrete, Kumhos for cold and/or rain) make a big difference, as does buying fresh rubber for big events. It's unnecessary and expensive to get stacks of tires if you're not too serious, but you did ask about changes with "the most impact in the improvement of your times", so fresh rubber is second on my list.

Shocks are debatable. Konis provide a subtle improvement, but I'm not sure they're worth the investment if you're on a budget. High-end shocks help a lot, but they cost. On the other hand, at least one trophy winner at last year's Nationals was on stock shocks, and National Tours have been won on them.

I'd argue that exhausts fall into the "don't bother unless you have money to burn" category. You save some weight, and might squeeze one or two horses out the car, but overall there's not much of a win with an exhaust.

Brake components are purely a personal preference item, and thus last on my list. Brake fade isn't an issue in autocross, so your stopping power is limited by your tires' grip, not your braking system. Some people (myself included) prefer the grabbier feel of aftermarket pads, though.

Steve

Hyper-X

Thanks for the input guys.

I've already have 2 sets of OEM wheels, 1 set for normal use on S02's and the other set of Kuhmo's for SCCA.

I don't have a front bar so that's my next physical mod (after my UK alignment).

The next question is how the Saner bar compares to something like the Comptech adjustable? I'm concerned about how I read in the Saner thread about it making noise, and moving side to side. I don't believe the Comptech has those issues, but the Comptech model at the lowest setting is considerably stiffer than the Saner.

jguerdat

I don't think I've seen the stiffness calculations for the Saner bar but the Comptech bar is 62% stiffer on the lowest setting compared to the stock bar. The web site is confusing - it states 162% but really means 1.62x stiffer. How they compare at the highest setting no one knows since no one's that talking has done the measurements and math.

The Comptech doesn't have the side-to-side issues but is still capable making noise, especially with the urethane bushings (mine a creaking now).

payneinthe

From memory, I think the Saner is 1.91x stiffer on its lowest setting.

Mrsideways

#1 Tires , You can't compete on street tires FACT!
#2 Gendron Bar, Found the car very soft and floaty with the Hallow bar, But with the Stiff (aka SOLID) bar the car felt rock solid though slaloms. Like night and day. Still played around with the hallow bar on open track (just for sheer drifting fun) and little tight AHEM $HITTY courses.
Side NOTE.
--- I have driven a Comptech Bar car on stock shocks as well as (my own on stock shocks with the gendron) and the Windsor (I think thats what he had) and the difference is noticeable even between the Hallow gendron and the others. I found I couldn't drive the others as confidently. But the low speed understeer from the stiffer bar does begin to get annoying.
#3 SHOCKS, Koni Yellows. I can't compare them with High Dollar DA's cause I havent' driven a DA car. but compared to stock. They help fight the low speed understeer and they allow you to overdrive the car more then the stockers. But I do feel they cause more inside wheel spin though.
#4 Alighnment, Maybe i'm a Lunatic or just clueless but other then using it for fighting odd tire ware I didn't notice a bit of difference. My co-drivers sure complained alot about my wacky alighnments though. Showed up at the PRO event at talladega with God knows what Alightnment and espically god knows after jason when flying off in the grass sideways at 85mph. First time on the koni's thought the car was GREAT, but did kill off the outter edge of the tires (down to cords) due to lack of camber.
Showed up at Ft. Myres first time with the Solid front bar and my first alighnment which turns out was a screw up by the alighnment shop and gave me 1/4 toe out in the rear. I never noticed. Hell I pulled off a win at the tour to much of my surprise. My co-driver complained he couldn't keep it pointed straight.
So for the divisional I tried 0 toe in the rear. Ran quickest stock class time in the dry. Co-driver complained it wouldn't turn.
So showed up at D.C. with another new idea. 1/4 toe out in the front. Ran .8 on the feild Got the boot, co-driver complained the car was EVIL. (compared to another S he got to drive after we got the boot)
So showed up at nationals with 1/8 toe out in the front 0 toe in the rear. Car worked AWESOME on the practice course but both co-driver and I complained it wouldn't turn on the south course. (I think it really could turn, I just had a Blonde running around in my head. Z06Killer knows what i"m talking about.)

ANYWAY... General Gist. Bang for the buck, Get some koni's and the biggest front bar you can get your hands on. Then play with the alightnment cause thats cheap and easy. Hope I helped.
Ian