i posted this in another forum with little luck, but i think more tech inclined ppl are on this board and i want to hear their opionions.....

i was just curious about anyone with personal experience with water injection systems, water/meth systems, and even water/meth/nitro injections systems.

They claim less detonation, and even hp increases when running a nitro ( u know the uber expensive fuel for r/c cars and funny drag cars) in the injection systems.

They also claimed that running a stage 2 kit, your motor will respond to 91 oct as 120 oct. (i know it doesnt transform the gas to 120oct (i.e. its not a super oct. booster), but it works by keeping the temp down in the combustion chamber, it burns at a similar temp as 120oct, there by reducing detonation, or something along those lines, i think)

they also claimed many other benefits, amongst a max of 60hp gain. humm, im not too sold on it, but ive never heard much about these systems. A friend of mine runs meth (alcohol?) in a shifter kart, and he has to use 2x the meth to make the same power as gas but the meth burns alot cooler.

so i figured that it has to work to some degree... anyone have any personal expierences with these types of systems?

Anyone have any bad experiences with them?

and since its rather cheap for a stage 2 no less ($399) how come there not more of a mainstream modification?

im not affiliated with these people but heres the link:
snowperformance.net

thanks

 

You can't run nitromethane in this motor...well you can for about 30 seconds.

Don't expect gains...just a safer running motor. Also if you don't have any mods (stock S2000) it wont give you anything. If you really want to reduce combustion chamber temps because you live in a very dry and hot climate year round - change the plugs to 1 heat range colder.

The gains they advertise is probably some heavily modified car that was running pump gas and then they turned on the meth to basically increase the octane rating of the fuel system. You can get the same results on a heavily modified vehicle by running race gas. Once again...heavily modified.

Remember, 60hp is pretty insignificant if the test engine was making 1000hp.

 

Considering you can't even start an engine on 90% nitromethane without blowing the cylinder heads off, It's not a good choice in a street engine.

Pro Stock racers would mix Nitromethane with the oil to get "some" nitro past the rings into the chamber. It doesn't take much to get a power gain.

Nitromethane and Methanol are also very corrosive to aluminium. The fuel systems have to be flushed when the car is not being run.

With methanol, you have to run much more fuel than gasoline. A decent amount of fuel mixes and dilutes the oil. Oil has to be changed very frequently.

Unless the car is used in a race environment, and serviced all the time, Niether are good choices for a street car.

Nitro also runs close to $20 a gallon, Methanol is a bit cheaper.

 

i hate to do this but...

the nitro is just a small percentage, where the hell did 90% number come from, seriously? i dont remember what the site said but its like 20% mix of the water/meth that gets injected in SMALL amounts depending throttle opening. its nothing crazy, and also a 1 or 2 liter tank is supposed to last 500 miles on the street! sorry if ppl take offense but i hate ppl that post without knowing wtf their talking about and also ppl who dont take the time to READ and UNDERSTAND what a person is ACTUALLY ASKING. No, im not running straight meth, alcohol, or nitro. No, the fuel system is NOT EXPOSED to any of the aformentioned chemicals, because the chemicals have their own pump and is shot into the intake. Im no big fan of drag racing but nitro funny cars, umm use nitro as gas. No not in oil. Yes, the nitro is limited to a certian percentage due to NHRA standards to limit hp, and yes i do believe that its 90%. i dont care to go on. (YES im SORRY, but ive had such bad luck everytime that ive posted with people going on about something completely irreivent. YES i am thankful for his post, and yes you are correct about corrosive properties.. just.. im sorry for singling you out of a crowd, the statements arent directed at you, just in general)

not to contiune my rant but i spent a LONG time posting VERY LATE AT NIGHT another way to pull the tranny to swap the clutch, and all i got were responces like i could have pulled my motor faster than you could have pulled your tranny. Well im sorry, but no. and its like ppl miss everything i try to explain to them.

ok kane, thanks for posting, and im sorry i forgot to include that the meth injection was for another car i own, and the ppl on that board are very uniformed (read : kids) and the question went no where. the water/meth was for a 2.4l running a gt-35r turbo at various boost levels (from 10 street in the upper 20's for track) , im mostly mimicing another persons setup, however he didnt have the water injection, and had to use c-16 gas to max out his boost runs. my hopes for the project were to be able to have more horse power/boost , even by .5 psi on pump gas than he was able to get, and maybe be able to run a lower knock value/ timing.

thanks, and sorry for the rage that left the cage

 

I havent run a water/alcohol injection system myself but the research Ive done really doesnt indicate any drawbacks to it except you have to remember to keep the tank full.

Im not familiar with using nitromethane.

It would seem to me that water/alcohol injection might alleviate "heat soak" on a stock car.

On a turbo car you have a pressure switch to activate it of course. On an NA car Id hook a relay to the VTEC solenoid power so the injection activates when VTEC activates.

I dont know a ton, just trying to post something positive since I agree with your comments about the attitude on this board not being the most helpful.

 

My only experience with Nitromethane and Methanol is in NHRA TA/FC and A/FD. (Top Alcohol Funny Car and A-Fuel dragster) = I used to work on them.

I'm speaking from first hand experience using Nitro and Methanol as primary fuels.

I should have clarified that in the 1st post.

You asked for opinions, I gave you mine. Don't get pissy because you didn't get exactly what you wanted to hear.

 

20% nitro still has a lot of combusion energy when compared to a straight gasoline mix. The temperatures it will reach IF the engine does hold will be pretty immense and I doubt you'll be able to get away with it for very long. That also doesn't take into account it's caustic properties against metal. Soft aluminum, which is what this engine is primarily composed of will get eaten faily quick.

It seems like you're settled on the water/meth injection so why not go for it? You'll be able to advance the timing a few degrees and still keep the knock safe.

 

.. im not really looking to use nitro in the injection system..

its just a possiblity of the system if others choose to do so..

my main curiousity was to see if under high boost applications, if more boost could be used, while using the same gas, but without the chances of detnoation, and or knock. im not set on using the system at all, i just wanted to add my own spin on the previous turbo setup, and this seemed to be a resonable idea. However i have no experience with it, and its not really a common mod, atleast where i live. I was just looking for people were more knowedlable than i am about this system, and what the benefits, and mainly drawbacks were, and other resources of info. I plan on using it in a high boost application.

Thanks for all the info.

 

what about running only water? like the aquamist system? I have never seen them before on an S.. or any honda that is.. but on the web site ( http://www.aquamist.co.uk/) they do have many turbo and supercharged daily drivers running these systems. Has anyone installed this or any other type of water injection on a supercharged S?

 

fperra and Hecash both have used an Aquamist systems.