Ok, my problems started a few months ago. I changed my tranny fluid before a track day at Laguna Seca. I've changed my tranny fluid at least 3 times before, but this time I used a pump I bought at Kragen. I put in 2 bottles of Honda MTF, but I noticed there was a lot of "bubbling" in the tubing of the pump as I pumped in the fluid.

I didn't pay much attention to it though because I was able to put in two bottles (it overflowed as I set the car down). The next day I drove up, the car was fine, no shifting problems. When I got to Laguna, my second session I found it really hard to upshift or downshift. I heard clunking, and it was generally hard to shift unless I waited a couple of seconds in neutral then shift.

I didn't drive the car much after that day, I figured something was wrong with the clutch tranny, and I did a search here and found I had the same symptoms as a member by the name of Jasonoff here. One of the spring retainers or somethign was broken in his clutch and since our symptoms were almost identical I figured it was that.

I'll describe the symptoms again:

When at a stop, I can go into every gear but 6th easily. When the car is moving, and I go to shift by putting the clutch in and taking it out of gear, there is a lot of resistance, like the car doesn't want to come out of the gear. I have to blip the gas for what seems like the clutch to release, and then quickly shove the shifter into the next gear. Sometimes, even when I do this it doesn't get into gear, so I'm stuck in neutral and every gear is locked out. I can only then shift once the car comes to nearly a stop. As I come to a stop, if i have the car in 1st gear say, the car will start shaking like it is about to stall, and start clunking. The car will do this even if I have the clutch in, I have to put it into neutral to avoid this.

Ok, forward to yesterday. I finally got off my ass and took the car into the Honda dealership to see what they would say. After the technicians looked at it, he tells me he thinks its a problem in the tranny, and the would need to tear it down. He checked the clutch master/slave cylinder and the lines and he says the clutch is working properly. He thinks its something in the linkage of the transmission, and also that the transmission has been tampered with because the casing bolts were rounded.

The dealer recommends me getting a "Re-man" Honda transmission at a cost of $4200 . Now, my question is does this seem right that it is a tranny problem? To me, since I'm locked out of every gear i figured it was most likely a clutch problem, in addition, the only way for me to shift is to blip the throttle to release the clutch, almost as if the clutch is dragging. What do you guys make of the dealer's diagnoisis? Am I getting the bend over?

Sorry, for the long post, I hope one the experts here can chime in...TIA

 

Unless the dealer guys know something they're leaving out, I'm inclined to think it's a clutch issue. Have you done the engine off test yet? Engine OFF, foot on clutch and row through the gears. Do they go in?
You say you have a hard time getting out of gear sometimes. Here's another test:
when you are ready to shift, leave the clutch alone and let up slightly on the gas so as to take some load off the tranny. (You are essentially trying to do a rev match). At the point where the car just begins to coast, pull (or push) the stick OUT of gear but ONLY into neutral. Will it come out?
If you can row through the gears with engine off and pull out of gear without clutch use on an approach to "coast", I'd say the tranny is OK.

 

I'm inclined to agree. How many miles are on it? When's the last time you flushed out the clutch?

 

Last time I looked, Honda doesn't offer a Remanufactured trans. New only.

It sounds like a clutch release issue to me as well. I'd pull the slave cylinder boot back and have a peek inside the bellhousing. If a damper spring broke on the friction disc you may see it wedged under the pressure plate diaphragm spring.

Then I'd be looking at removing the trans to inspect the clutch.

 

Thanks for the replies.

xviper, I can row through the gears fine with the engine off, and my foot on the clutch. I haven't checked if I can pull the gear into neutral with my foot off the clutch , but it's essentially what I was doing when this problem first began. I would let off the gas, and I could pull the shifter with a little pressure and put it into neutral. I didn't have to put the clutch all the way in to do that.

Slows2k, I'll check the boot tonight.


A little more info, I looked at the technician's write up, and in it they checked the tranny fluid level and it was fine, no metal shavings in the fluid. Clutch fluid is avg. color. Dealer says if the car has been raced or redlined a lot then the tranny input spline may go "out of round" , and cause it to float instead of sit flush in the bushings. Those are his words. He also said if that is the case, then the casing of the tranny cannot be sent back to Honda so there will be a core charge of ~$800 in addition to the re-manufactured tranny. I think he's full of

My thing is, if it really is a tranny problem then why would blipping the gas affect my ability to change gears when the clutch is in? If the clutch is doing its job like they say, then me blipping the gas should have no effect at all to the transmission.

 

First off, Dont ever go back to that dealer.

It sounds like your clutch disk is coming apart like SlowS2K says.

Check your clutch master and slave cylinder for any brake fluid that might be leaking out. I doubt you'll find any.

Next, make the assumption that it is your clutch disk that is going bad and order a new friction disk, throwout bearing and pilot bearing.

If you want to upgrade your pressure plate or flywheel, now would be the time.

Find a good shop, some place you can leave the car for a few days just in case. Give them the parts you ordered and a shop manual if they dont have one. they should be able to replace it in 4hrs or less.

When the disk and tranny are out of the car take a very carefull look at the disk. Look for cracks in the metal face plates near where the 4 springs are retained. If you find cracks or gouging in the surface of the flywheel or pressure plate then you have found your problem. This is the likely outcome.

If for some reason the disk and FW/PP surfaces are fine then take a close look at the splines on the input shaft of the tranny. Take the disk and put it on the tranny input shaft and slide it back and forth. it should move freely. If it cant then it may have been dragging.

Check the surface of tube the throwout bearing slides on. make sure its not scuffed and that the old bearing slides freely on it. If the bearing cant move freely on it then replace it.

If the disk is fine and the disk doesnt drag then consider there is something wrong with the tranny. If you decide there is something wrong with the tranny then replace it with a new tranny dont rebuild it.

When putting the tranny back in make sure you apply Redline CV Grease to the input shaft splines, the inside of the new throwout bearing, the splines of the new friction disk and the tube the trowout bearing slides on.

Ask around here and the S2KI marketplace for parts etc and check here...
http://www.hondaautomotiveparts.com/auto/j...ANSMISSION+ASSY.
for prices on new oem parts.

I hope this helps you feel a little less helpless.

 

[QUOTE=davepk,Aug 2 2006, 07:15 PM] First off,

 

where is spugen??

 

They're in SoCal, Whittier ....

 

All of your symptom sound like clutch to me. You may damage the tranny driving it that way but, it doesn't really sound like tranny damage at this point. I'd be looking at the clutch pedal at this point and slave cylinder.