S2000 Engine Management Engine management topics, map and advice.

Flashpro datalogs of 2 S2000's

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Old Dec 24, 2009 | 04:41 AM
  #21  
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Originally Posted by gernby,Dec 23 2009, 08:29 PM
What is painfully obvious is that the partial throttle tune is 50 times harder than the full throttle tune.
Partial throttle is what puts $$$ in tuners pockets. WOT tuning is cake by comparison. It takes a lot of experience to do it right.

My advice would be to pay a good tuner and shadow him for a session or two. Ask the right questions and go from there. Trying to get it right by yourself may be an exercise in pure frustration.
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Old Dec 24, 2009 | 07:37 AM
  #22  
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Originally Posted by alSpeed2k,Dec 24 2009, 01:02 AM
One thing I'd like to know though. Is it possible to start Datalogging right away? I.e. Can I rip open the packaging and plug the Flashpro into my stock ECU and press a button to start the logging? Yeah, I can be impatient!
The FlashPro will datalog right away. When you get one, you can also load one of the pre-tuned calibrations that best matches your setup. You won't make quite as much power, but you can at least enjoy the lower VTEC and higher rev limit.
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Old Dec 24, 2009 | 07:39 AM
  #23  
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Originally Posted by spectacle,Dec 24 2009, 07:41 AM
Trying to get it right by yourself may be an exercise in pure frustration.
That's what makes this so great!
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Old Dec 24, 2009 | 03:03 PM
  #24  
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Originally Posted by gernby,Dec 24 2009, 08:37 AM
The FlashPro will datalog right away. When you get one, you can also load one of the pre-tuned calibrations that best matches your setup. You won't make quite as much power, but you can at least enjoy the lower VTEC and higher rev limit.
Cool, is it pretty straight forward? I plan on data logging my own factory tune, after this I plan on installing the Hondata Stock Tune (just curious as to whether there are any slight differences) and datalogging this, finally I will run one of the other pre-installed Hondata tunes.
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Old Dec 31, 2009 | 07:24 AM
  #25  
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Originally Posted by gernby,Dec 22 2009, 10:06 PM
If the AF numbers that you are talking about were acurate, they would be CRAZY lean too! An air fuel ratio of 14:1 at wot is not safe. I feel confident that Honda did not intend their stock S2000's to run 14's at WOT.

Editted to remove the drunken aggressiveness ...
bs - 14:1 below 8k is not going to hurt a stock or mildly moded n/a s2k. your a/f drops to an ideal 13.8 a/f above 8k. the proof is that the stock '06 is running close to 14 flat. honda would not tune that aggressive if it was an issue.

besides i have experience tuning the rsx (the k engine not as strong as the F series) with a 13.75 target a/f with spots in the low 14s below 8k. but i always have the a/f to drop off above 8k to low to mid 13s. i put over 120k miles on the rsx before selling it with no issues. the rsx had the n/a basic bolts with 205whp.
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Old Dec 31, 2009 | 07:26 AM
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Originally Posted by gernby,Dec 23 2009, 08:29 PM
What is painfully obvious is that the partial throttle tune is 50 times harder than the full throttle tune. I am able to get an almost perfectly flat AFR at full throttle in just a few minutes (better than +/- 0.1:1 variance even across VTEC). However, I've spent probably 100 hours trying to develop a mathematical model in Excel for calculating the part throttle fueling based on the WOT fueling with absolutely no success. Every time I think I have it figured out, I find another load interval where it is way off. I'm even doing some logrithmic averaging with the stock fuel maps, meaning that the lower the load level, the more the stock map is averaged in.

I know that I could save myself tons of time by having Mike at Elite Tuning tune it, but that would go against every fiber of my being. I don't just want a good tune, I want to know HOW to do a good tune.

BTW, I think the modelling that I'm doing in Excel for part throttle tuning will be a complete failure, but there is a LOT of kick ass stuff that this spreadsheet does with the FlashPro datalogs! I'll share it when I'm done.
or you can simply force open loop and tune part throttle just like WOT...
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Old Nov 15, 2011 | 03:14 PM
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sorry to bring back from the dead, but would replacing the oem o2 sensor with a better aftermarket one make the a/f correction reading more correct?
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Old Nov 15, 2011 | 03:21 PM
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Originally Posted by ans2k
sorry to bring back from the dead, but would replacing the oem o2 sensor with a better aftermarket one make the a/f correction reading more correct?
yes it will. the only downside is that an aftermarket wideband cannot be used for closed loop operation. it will run in open loop the entire time.
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Old Nov 16, 2011 | 08:04 AM
  #29  
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I'm not aware of an OEM compatable aftermarket sensor that can be used in place of the OEM sensor to improve O2 accuracy. However, you can install an aftermarket wideband sensor and controller, and wire it into the ELD or ECT2 inputs on the ECU. However, that input won't be used by the ECU for anything at all. It will just show up in the FlashPro datalogs as an additional (3rd) O2 value.
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Old Nov 16, 2011 | 01:13 PM
  #30  
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I've also done a simple excel mathematical model based on wot values to help me with partial tuning. I split the rpm basically into 4 sections (idle, mid range low cam and mid range vtec, and high range).

I realized also that there are some factors that prvent it from being simple math and I've done a few things to minimize them.

1) o2 feedback table. I kept it simple as possible and its mainly all 14.7 and 13.xx at WOT so that most of the fuel table will be highly consistent after the 2nd or 3rd top load row.

2) fuel pressure regulator. I use an adjustable one and constant pressure (no vacuum hose). The stock one rises with increasing pressure or decreasing vacuum from like 40psi idle to 50psi at wot. With this in the equation it is less likely to be simple math.

That being said I don't expect it to be perfect but it helps me with small changes in the wot tune.

Partial throttle tuning must be so easy with a dynapack I imagine (correct me if wrong). The dyno connects to your vacuum line and I think it is capable of dynamic loading so you can easily instruct it to hold a certain constant load throughout the rpm range as well as measure the torque (for optimal PT afr and timing).

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