Opinions on the F20 Powerplant
12-16-2013, 10:08 AM
#1
Opinions on the F20 Powerplant
Hello S2ki
I have been on this site for a couple years just roaming until I finally joined this year as a proud owner of a 2001 Spa Yellow S2000. I am currently saving up to build the car as a Autocross/ Track Car with my part list consisting of suspension upgrades (KW Clubsports, Spoon Rigid Collars , Spoon Gusset Plate , Spoon mid cassis cross bar, maybe the X-brace , 17" rim and tire upgrade etc etc)
The thing I am thinking about is the Powerplant - I know the F20 / F22 motorplant is awesome for high revs and midrange power especially with small upgrades as removing the cat and lowering the VTEC. The thing I am concerned about is the fact that these powerplants hit their limit or wall very low in N/A builds (noticed someone on here with a 2.7 stroker kit only making around 300 - correct me if I am wrong I am asking for advice and not to be flamed) I am very loyal to N/A builds and their capabilities so my question what is your opinion on our powerplants - are superchargers the way to go for track builds rather than turbos (which I see as drag capable rather than turn capable). Any other info on N/A builds that I should know of?
and my last opinion and thought is should I just save my money and swap a K20/24 build which is capable of reaching higher grounds than our powerplant. Love my car but I do want to grow in the field of HP and making the car a track made car.
please no flaming thank you
I have been on this site for a couple years just roaming until I finally joined this year as a proud owner of a 2001 Spa Yellow S2000. I am currently saving up to build the car as a Autocross/ Track Car with my part list consisting of suspension upgrades (KW Clubsports, Spoon Rigid Collars , Spoon Gusset Plate , Spoon mid cassis cross bar, maybe the X-brace , 17" rim and tire upgrade etc etc)
The thing I am thinking about is the Powerplant - I know the F20 / F22 motorplant is awesome for high revs and midrange power especially with small upgrades as removing the cat and lowering the VTEC. The thing I am concerned about is the fact that these powerplants hit their limit or wall very low in N/A builds (noticed someone on here with a 2.7 stroker kit only making around 300 - correct me if I am wrong I am asking for advice and not to be flamed) I am very loyal to N/A builds and their capabilities so my question what is your opinion on our powerplants - are superchargers the way to go for track builds rather than turbos (which I see as drag capable rather than turn capable). Any other info on N/A builds that I should know of?
and my last opinion and thought is should I just save my money and swap a K20/24 build which is capable of reaching higher grounds than our powerplant. Love my car but I do want to grow in the field of HP and making the car a track made car.
please no flaming thank you
12-17-2013, 05:28 AM
#2
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Welcome, and i would say look into what category you want to track your car at and mod accordingly, thats if you plan to take autocross seriously or just a fun hobby. Is money a huge factor? building a N/A s2000 can cost as much as buying a used supercharger kit if not more.
12-17-2013, 06:48 AM
#3
If you are building a track car you need to R&D for your needs.
You should ask yourself these questions
Can you push the car to the outer limits of it performance?
If so, what will improve the performance in your situation?
Generally weight reduction, tire, brake, and suspension upgrades will acheive the most gains. These will allow you to carry more momentum through corners which will translate into higher straight line speeds.
A lot of track prepared cars don't even touch the motor, maybe intake and exhaust the rest would be "chassis" tuning which is the items mentioned above.
If you go to the same track you could regear your car for the track that you go to the most. This would be to eliminate situations where you would be between gears.
More power is great, but if you can't use the power, you might actually go slower.
Remember building a great track car is all about finding the right balance of all aspects of the tuning spectrum for your driving style.
***Edit***
I forgot to mention to not forget about the reliability aspect. Cooling mods, baffled oil pans etc. Also, when you make one part of your car "stronger" it might highlight a weakness that wasn't there before.
You should ask yourself these questions
Can you push the car to the outer limits of it performance?
If so, what will improve the performance in your situation?
Generally weight reduction, tire, brake, and suspension upgrades will acheive the most gains. These will allow you to carry more momentum through corners which will translate into higher straight line speeds.
A lot of track prepared cars don't even touch the motor, maybe intake and exhaust the rest would be "chassis" tuning which is the items mentioned above.
If you go to the same track you could regear your car for the track that you go to the most. This would be to eliminate situations where you would be between gears.
More power is great, but if you can't use the power, you might actually go slower.
Remember building a great track car is all about finding the right balance of all aspects of the tuning spectrum for your driving style.
***Edit***
I forgot to mention to not forget about the reliability aspect. Cooling mods, baffled oil pans etc. Also, when you make one part of your car "stronger" it might highlight a weakness that wasn't there before.
12-17-2013, 07:57 AM
#4
If you are building a track car you need to R&D for your needs.
You should ask yourself these questions
Can you push the car to the outer limits of it performance?
If so, what will improve the performance in your situation?
Generally weight reduction, tire, brake, and suspension upgrades will acheive the most gains. These will allow you to carry more momentum through corners which will translate into higher straight line speeds.
A lot of track prepared cars don't even touch the motor, maybe intake and exhaust the rest would be "chassis" tuning which is the items mentioned above.
If you go to the same track you could regear your car for the track that you go to the most. This would be to eliminate situations where you would be between gears.
More power is great, but if you can't use the power, you might actually go slower.
Remember building a great track car is all about finding the right balance of all aspects of the tuning spectrum for your driving style.
You should ask yourself these questions
Can you push the car to the outer limits of it performance?
If so, what will improve the performance in your situation?
Generally weight reduction, tire, brake, and suspension upgrades will acheive the most gains. These will allow you to carry more momentum through corners which will translate into higher straight line speeds.
A lot of track prepared cars don't even touch the motor, maybe intake and exhaust the rest would be "chassis" tuning which is the items mentioned above.
If you go to the same track you could regear your car for the track that you go to the most. This would be to eliminate situations where you would be between gears.
More power is great, but if you can't use the power, you might actually go slower.
Remember building a great track car is all about finding the right balance of all aspects of the tuning spectrum for your driving style.
12-18-2013, 09:10 AM
#6
Member
I'd be suspicious of a near 300 bhp dyno result on an F20. Even if the standard engine would dyno at 240 (which it won't) I can't see 300 being anywhere near achievable on a 2.0
ITBs don't give top end on these cars, but even with head work / cams / ECU / rods etc and a 9500 + rev limit that's a big stretch. Mine is about 255 bhp (220 standard) and that's with some very tasty Hytech cams.
No replacement for displacement
ITBs don't give top end on these cars, but even with head work / cams / ECU / rods etc and a 9500 + rev limit that's a big stretch. Mine is about 255 bhp (220 standard) and that's with some very tasty Hytech cams.
No replacement for displacement
12-18-2013, 03:07 PM
#7
Well, there's a bit in there from 'bodies....
Both those engines are from the same builder, and both figures from a proper engine dyno cell....and they don't seem to short on the pace front either....
The two cars after 3m40s:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9yv6YHEZ-tc
In case you're wondering, the car a little before that (black and green), is also a 2.0L engine from the same builder, although that one he claims a little more for, you'll probably see why...
Both those engines are from the same builder, and both figures from a proper engine dyno cell....and they don't seem to short on the pace front either....
The two cars after 3m40s:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9yv6YHEZ-tc
In case you're wondering, the car a little before that (black and green), is also a 2.0L engine from the same builder, although that one he claims a little more for, you'll probably see why...
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12-19-2013, 06:46 AM
#9
Welcome, and i would say look into what category you want to track your car at and mod accordingly, thats if you plan to take autocross seriously or just a fun hobby. Is money a huge factor? building a N/A s2000 can cost as much as buying a used supercharger kit if not more.
I have seen this and read this article as he stated in the forum this is a race car pushing high octane and is something that wouldn't really be happy on the street and most drag cars are meant to be raced for about 10minutes before overheating etc etc. I am trying to make my car run reliable and not depend on an external fan etc. Also his car is FWD which gives the car more of an advantage to utilize the power the motor produces. Again I might be wrong but after seeing it done I have seen a slight downfall in Hp from a fwd setup to a rwd setup nothing crazy but it does utilize the power differently but even with the loss in hp the RWD traction is better.
Im basically looking for a monster setup in a s2000 - Lately I have been reading this thread ( https://www.s2ki.com/s2000/topic/645...t-track-build/) and getting the impression I might have to go to Texas or Florida (idk where Urge is from) Im going to message URGE on info but still any other info would be appreciated.