SumAznGuy

I'm pretty sure his is the better hollow bar.

Don't bother with the solid Grendron unless you want to spend more money on a new bar down the road.

Let DaveRX7 tell you about his experience with the solid bar at Nationals.

josh7owens

but the hollow bar isn't as stiff as the solid one right?

sirbunz

Jon (the owner of the black one) doesn't have the 1.375" custom hollow bar. I believe he has the 1.25" solid. The 1.375" hollow is much stiffer than the 1.25" solid. The outside diameter matters more than the thickness (usually). Check out Small Fortune Racing and contact them for more details.

As previously mentioned, Dave (daverx7) still got wheel lift with the 1.25" solid, so he switched out center sections. He even got wheel lift with the 1.375" custom speedway center section at the '09 Dixie Tour, but that was mostly due to the bumps in the lot. The 00-01 AP1 simply has really soft front springs but still very capable of winning with the right mods and driver.

In the end, you are better off buying the bigger Gendron. Since you are just getting started, I see no problem with getting the Saner to keep the cost down and if you only plan to run locally or on street tires. When you start driving faster, switch to Hoosier A6s and run on lots with more grip ... you will quickly experience the Saner bar's limitations.

If you do make the 8/2 event at Papa Johns Stadium, I will be glad to share what I know. That is how I learned ... by other, more experienced S2000 drivers sharing their knowledge with me. You will find more support in the S2000 community than most others. It seems like we all wish to get better and help others along the way!

SumAznGuy

Just an FYI, during Evo I school, I got wheel lift on really old 225 hoosier A6's with the Saner bar on the custom extra stiff 4th hole.

Buy right, buy once. Go with the Grendron bar hollow bar, and save some $$$ for new bushings and mounts, or go with the ARE bar.
Either bars will be good for you for a while as you improve on your driving.

josh7owens

so get the gredron 1.375" hollow bar? I'm gonna run the v710s bc they last longer then the a6's

jadrice

Jon has the 1.25 Hollow, so I'm guessing that won't help you much. As f this writing, he was getting wheel spin on the CR with the bar set to full stiff, so I'm guessing you will have worse issues with the Ap1. As for my car, I have been extremely happy with the Saner bar on medium. I finally experienced a slight wheel spin at Peru, but it wasn't enough to warrant going full stiff.

sirbunz

If you can afford it, yes. Expect to pay 700+. Also, i forgot to mention the Comptech (make sure its a gen 2) adjustable bar. They are on par with the Gendron solid. Most I have seen are pretty worn and still fetch a premium.

One thing to consider on the v710 vs. A6 comparison...

The A6s and v710s have close to the same "usable" life. While the v710s will last longer, they will become hard and heat cycle out faster than the Hoosiers. This usually happens around 50 runs. I bought 3 different sets of v710s when I first started and all 3 did this and had 1-2/32nds of tread (of 4/32nds new) left. When the v710s get hard, my RE01-Rs will put down faster times.

The A6s have grip all the way down to the cords. I am averaging 60-70 runs before this happens and on my 5th set. So in a way, the A6s actually last slightly longer even though they hit the cord faster.

jeffjanzen

If that's the case, you're doing it for absolutely the wrong reason. You won't be able to push it more to its limits. You'll be able to drive it faster, but only because you've raised the limits of the car, not because you're getting closer to them.

You WANT to flirt with the limits. That's how you get fast. If you don't find the point at which you spin, how will you know what it feels like to approach that point consistently?

That said, if you want to learn on r-comps, that's fine. I started racing with an old set of Rs, and I don't think either way is wrong. Just be aware that it requires more determination to push yourself to the limits of r-comps than it does on street tires.

jeffjanzen

Actually I'm running V710s on Corey's (captainpants) S this year. My car IS running in AS-streets, but it's my brother driving it, not me.

That said, I do get to drive street-tire cars a few times a year when I instruct local schools and do fun runs in other cars (including my own), and they do magnify your mistakes more than r-comps do. It's good to drive on them every now and then to remind yourself that you're not a hero.


And Josh7, read the rest of CKIT's post again. Great advice.

captain_pants

+7 or +8 or whatever to the suggestion of just running the car in stock form until you're sure you like autocross. A fully-stock S2000 on staggered street tires is a very capable car and feels quite similar to a fully-prepared A-Stock version from the driver's seat. Only catch is that it's slower and a tiny bit less responsive. A newbie's smile will be just as big in either car.

My experience is that R-compounds lead to more spins due to the fact that they grip very well right up until they let go, then you feel like they have NO grip. Most newbies that upgrade to R's have a huge spin on their third or fourth run as they build up enough confidence on the first two runs to push the tires to their limits.

That said, the car is darn fun on R's with a big swaybar! It just costs a bunch more. My car costs around $17-20 per run for tires alone on Hoosier A6s, and that's on a relatively smooth asphalt. If you have the budget for it, do it. If you just want to try autocrossing for a while, stick with a stock car on street tires.

One other side effect of a big front bar (I'd buy the 1-3/8 hollow Gendron if I was shopping today) and non-staggered race tires is that the car will understeer like a pig on the street with staggered street tires. Count on buying a non-staggered tire setup for street use if you like to play at all on the street.