Track day tires—faster and/or better wearing than RE-71R
04-25-2019, 11:36 PM
#31
I’d echo most of what anorexicpoodle posted above with one slight difference. We have found that the Rival S will take heat better, gets less greasy, and lasts longer than the RE71. We have been using them on a very fast e30 endurance car. We can get full 8 hour race out of them at Road America, and barely usually make them last 8 hours at Mid Ohio. They’ll go 10+ at Daytona, but that place is easy on tires. Road America tires will look ok after 8, Mid Ohio tires will be real sketchy after 8. Can’t get anywhere near that with RE71.
now, maybe this won’t happen in typical DE scenario where you heat, cool, repeat. And maybe this won’t happen on an s2000, but we’re not using crazy large tires on the E30, just 225 on 15”. YMMV
if you just want to go out and track the car, and turn a bunch of laps on a good tire that’ll last, then RS4 is the way to go. A little slower for a whole lot more life. We can get 2, 8 hour races out of them. But 1.5-2 sec a lap slower
now, maybe this won’t happen in typical DE scenario where you heat, cool, repeat. And maybe this won’t happen on an s2000, but we’re not using crazy large tires on the E30, just 225 on 15”. YMMV
if you just want to go out and track the car, and turn a bunch of laps on a good tire that’ll last, then RS4 is the way to go. A little slower for a whole lot more life. We can get 2, 8 hour races out of them. But 1.5-2 sec a lap slower
Having a tire which is predictable and easy to drive near its limit is probably more important than either lap times or tire life. It should also let the driver reach and expand their personal limits faster and with less risk.
How do the tires compare in predictability and breakaway?
Note: the A052 now has an autocross legal tread depth.
04-26-2019, 08:33 AM
#32
I autocross the RE71r and have never driven the Rival S or RS4. However, in comparisons, the RE71r is often mentioned as easier to drive fast than the RE71r in autocrosses. Does that hold on the race track?
Having a tire which is predictable and easy to drive near its limit is probably more important than either lap times or tire life. It should also let the driver reach and expand their personal limits faster and with less risk.
How do the tires compare in predictability and breakaway?
Note: the A052 now has an autocross legal tread depth.
Having a tire which is predictable and easy to drive near its limit is probably more important than either lap times or tire life. It should also let the driver reach and expand their personal limits faster and with less risk.
How do the tires compare in predictability and breakaway?
Note: the A052 now has an autocross legal tread depth.
It's a good combination for this platform since the S2K is already a twitchy car, a more.predictable/tire w less falloff past the breaking point makes for a better dance partner.
04-27-2019, 02:45 PM
#33
I autocross the RE71r and have never driven the Rival S or RS4. However, in comparisons, the RE71r is often mentioned as easier to drive fast than the RE71r in autocrosses. Does that hold on the race track?
Having a tire which is predictable and easy to drive near its limit is probably more important than either lap times or tire life. It should also let the driver reach and expand their personal limits faster and with less risk.
How do the tires compare in predictability and breakaway?
Note: the A052 now has an autocross legal tread depth.
Having a tire which is predictable and easy to drive near its limit is probably more important than either lap times or tire life. It should also let the driver reach and expand their personal limits faster and with less risk.
How do the tires compare in predictability and breakaway?
Note: the A052 now has an autocross legal tread depth.
we have no experience with the A052
04-27-2019, 09:18 PM
#34
For an STR-legal car used on the track, it sounds like RE71r/Rival S for autocross and RS4 for the track...unless the A052 changes the equation. No STR-legal car is going to be optimized for track use.
04-27-2019, 11:47 PM
#35
I am also curious what people are seeing out of tires in our cars. I've gone through four sets of NT01s in 8-9 hours each and toss them when you start to get the little cracks you can see the cord through, rather than running to cord.
I've heard people say they get faster all the way until cord, but I have not had that experience. I feel like they drop off pretty heavily after 4-5 hours and are pure slide mode in the last hour or two.
I've heard people say they get faster all the way until cord, but I have not had that experience. I feel like they drop off pretty heavily after 4-5 hours and are pure slide mode in the last hour or two.
I agree, though with them dropping off in grip. They definitely do NOT get faster. I ran Chuckwalla on a set with 10 hours that was 1.5 years old and ran a 2:06s all day in November. Got a new brand new set, and ran 2:03s in February.
I swap out before cording as well. I'm averaging around 6-7 track days on a set, which is 12-14 hours for me.
05-03-2019, 02:44 PM
#36
RE's don't hold up on track at all, but the feel is there and they can do great one-lap times. Overall I would only run them if you're also running autocross and just want a set for occasional track use.
Rival S 1.5 hold up better, are slightly faster than the RE's (depending on driving style), but the feel leaves something to be desired. They like a lot of slip angle and make the car a little harder to place, also do not communicate as much as other tires. I generally don't have issues with wear on these though, were as the RE's will burn up in a day if you drive them hard enough. One real issue with them is rubber pickup. They do pick up a lot of track marbles and that does not help with grip at all, so if you're at a track which has a lot of marble accumulation these might be an issue.
RS4 is a rock of a tire, will last forever. Feel is decent, somewhere in-between the RE and Rival. It's definitely slower than both.
I have no personal experience with the A052, however based on limited observations they appear to be as fast if not faster than the Rival/RE on track. Second hand reports tell me the feel is phenomenal but the grip does not come in until they're very hot (180*+ core temp). Wear also appears to be in between the RE and Rival.
Rival S 1.5 hold up better, are slightly faster than the RE's (depending on driving style), but the feel leaves something to be desired. They like a lot of slip angle and make the car a little harder to place, also do not communicate as much as other tires. I generally don't have issues with wear on these though, were as the RE's will burn up in a day if you drive them hard enough. One real issue with them is rubber pickup. They do pick up a lot of track marbles and that does not help with grip at all, so if you're at a track which has a lot of marble accumulation these might be an issue.
RS4 is a rock of a tire, will last forever. Feel is decent, somewhere in-between the RE and Rival. It's definitely slower than both.
I have no personal experience with the A052, however based on limited observations they appear to be as fast if not faster than the Rival/RE on track. Second hand reports tell me the feel is phenomenal but the grip does not come in until they're very hot (180*+ core temp). Wear also appears to be in between the RE and Rival.
05-03-2019, 03:35 PM
#37
No
Wish I could try the Rivals, but up here in Canada they're considerably more expensive than the REs, so it's not really worth it.
Too bad about the Yokos not being good cold. Was planning to swap those in next, but not if they're going to be slower at autocross. Usually only getting 120-130F max there, in the summer.
RE's don't hold up on track at all, but the feel is there and they can do great one-lap times. Overall I would only run them if you're also running autocross and just want a set for occasional track use.
Rival S 1.5 hold up better, are slightly faster than the RE's (depending on driving style), but the feel leaves something to be desired. They like a lot of slip angle and make the car a little harder to place, also do not communicate as much as other tires. I generally don't have issues with wear on these though, were as the RE's will burn up in a day if you drive them hard enough. One real issue with them is rubber pickup. They do pick up a lot of track marbles and that does not help with grip at all, so if you're at a track which has a lot of marble accumulation these might be an issue.
RS4 is a rock of a tire, will last forever. Feel is decent, somewhere in-between the RE and Rival. It's definitely slower than both.
I have no personal experience with the A052, however based on limited observations they appear to be as fast if not faster than the Rival/RE on track. Second hand reports tell me the feel is phenomenal but the grip does not come in until they're very hot (180*+ core temp). Wear also appears to be in between the RE and Rival.
Rival S 1.5 hold up better, are slightly faster than the RE's (depending on driving style), but the feel leaves something to be desired. They like a lot of slip angle and make the car a little harder to place, also do not communicate as much as other tires. I generally don't have issues with wear on these though, were as the RE's will burn up in a day if you drive them hard enough. One real issue with them is rubber pickup. They do pick up a lot of track marbles and that does not help with grip at all, so if you're at a track which has a lot of marble accumulation these might be an issue.
RS4 is a rock of a tire, will last forever. Feel is decent, somewhere in-between the RE and Rival. It's definitely slower than both.
I have no personal experience with the A052, however based on limited observations they appear to be as fast if not faster than the Rival/RE on track. Second hand reports tell me the feel is phenomenal but the grip does not come in until they're very hot (180*+ core temp). Wear also appears to be in between the RE and Rival.
Too bad about the Yokos not being good cold. Was planning to swap those in next, but not if they're going to be slower at autocross. Usually only getting 120-130F max there, in the summer.
05-03-2019, 03:57 PM
#38
The Yoko's get up to temp pretty fast IMO. Takes about 1/2-3/4 lap to get up to temp for me but dunno about autoX.
05-03-2019, 07:38 PM
#40
If the car is a daily driver, isn't the RE71r much better in the rain than the A052 or Rival S?
Observation: it is quite possible that a winning autocross tire is not an ideal track day tire. Is the solution 2 sets of wheels and tires?
Observation: it is quite possible that a winning autocross tire is not an ideal track day tire. Is the solution 2 sets of wheels and tires?