So many knock offs.....
08-05-2003, 06:31 PM
#1
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So many knock offs.....
As I look through the market place and group buy forums I'm realizing that guys are replicating just about everything out there. I personally try my hardest to buy the real jdm stuff, but I know that can get really expensive. What can I say, I even have a j's style hood.
When a guy comes out with a j's front for example that cost around $200 less than the real thing its hard to opt for the real. I'm just wondering if there are any legal implications in buying a product, copying it exactly and then selling it to the public. I'm no legal expert, but isn't this similar to plagarism?
If I was one of the jdm companies who spent a lot of $$ in r&d to develop a product just to have others duplicate it, I'd be really pissed.
It seems like the only reason someone hasn't tried to knock off a mugen bumper or hood is because King Motorsports is so involved in the forum and would not allow it.
Post your opinions please.
When a guy comes out with a j's front for example that cost around $200 less than the real thing its hard to opt for the real. I'm just wondering if there are any legal implications in buying a product, copying it exactly and then selling it to the public. I'm no legal expert, but isn't this similar to plagarism?
If I was one of the jdm companies who spent a lot of $$ in r&d to develop a product just to have others duplicate it, I'd be really pissed.
It seems like the only reason someone hasn't tried to knock off a mugen bumper or hood is because King Motorsports is so involved in the forum and would not allow it.
Post your opinions please.
08-05-2003, 06:34 PM
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Well, we all know that the knock offs are never as good in quality as the original. Therefore, they are not really "exactly like the original". Technically, it is plagiarism (as you mentioned), but I think that in this market the only thing to protect you is your own knowledge. If you buy a knock off for cheaper than the real thing, then you won't have grounds for complaining if it's cheap in quality and breaks easily. 
08-05-2003, 06:45 PM
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Not only that, but the specific design is copyrighted. And due to international treaties, if it is copyrighted in Japan, it is here too.
It's the same with designer bags. There's plenty of fake Gucci and Louis Vuitton out there, and any knock-offs can be confiscated and destroyed (and are, before they get to the consumer) when the manufacturer complains.
Sorry to piss in the punchbowl.
But as long as the JDM manufacturers don't complain, then there's probably no problem. What this situation does cause is it makes the market harder and harder for the original JDM manufacturer to enter the USDM or license a product to be manufactured here in the US by a licensee. This last point can also be a moot point, because a lot of the time they could care less about the foreign market.
It's the same with designer bags. There's plenty of fake Gucci and Louis Vuitton out there, and any knock-offs can be confiscated and destroyed (and are, before they get to the consumer) when the manufacturer complains.
Sorry to piss in the punchbowl.
But as long as the JDM manufacturers don't complain, then there's probably no problem. What this situation does cause is it makes the market harder and harder for the original JDM manufacturer to enter the USDM or license a product to be manufactured here in the US by a licensee. This last point can also be a moot point, because a lot of the time they could care less about the foreign market.
08-06-2003, 09:06 AM
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First of all, nice topic Stuie.
Rworne has basically hit all the big points and he is very correct. Most JDM companies do not pursue the flagarant copycat/molding/fabrication done here in the States. They simply do not have the time. Also, the companies that do it over here are often small. To fight a legal battle costs time and money.
I have been talking to various owners of JDM companies recently and this topic has come up in almost every single conversation. Yea, they're not particularly thrilled about having people copy their products, as well as retailers and distributors who knowingly sell "fake" products.
What it comes down to is this: the fabricators and shops (distributors, wholesalers, retailers, online retailers) are tarnishing their name. Maybe not so much here in the States- yea, I do see A LOT of people buying copied products because it is cheap and they don't care about the integrity of this aftermarket business.
But trust me, these JDM companies KNOW who is selling and copying their products. (Don't be surprised if you get your dealer inquiry turned down by them) And just as important- WE, the buyers know who they are. I, for one, have absolutely no respect for those companies (and owners) and will never endorse them.
Will this ever stop? Absolutely not. As long as there is a market for these products, and given the price and rarity of these items, molds will continue. Parts which are easy to copy will get copied. Bodykits are #1. However, parts with more detail and technical in nature, will be much more difficult and less likely to get copied. I'm sure the owner of A'PEXi has no worries. I doubt the numbnuts who copy bodykits seriously have the know-how to dissect an ECU.
The capitalist pig-of-a society we have here in the U.S. drives the competition do such bad things.
This just reaffirms the notion that Japanese products are superior. What the copycats are doing here in the U.S. just portrays the typical U.S. business ethics.
Rworne has basically hit all the big points and he is very correct. Most JDM companies do not pursue the flagarant copycat/molding/fabrication done here in the States. They simply do not have the time. Also, the companies that do it over here are often small. To fight a legal battle costs time and money.
I have been talking to various owners of JDM companies recently and this topic has come up in almost every single conversation. Yea, they're not particularly thrilled about having people copy their products, as well as retailers and distributors who knowingly sell "fake" products.
What it comes down to is this: the fabricators and shops (distributors, wholesalers, retailers, online retailers) are tarnishing their name. Maybe not so much here in the States- yea, I do see A LOT of people buying copied products because it is cheap and they don't care about the integrity of this aftermarket business.
But trust me, these JDM companies KNOW who is selling and copying their products. (Don't be surprised if you get your dealer inquiry turned down by them) And just as important- WE, the buyers know who they are. I, for one, have absolutely no respect for those companies (and owners) and will never endorse them.
Will this ever stop? Absolutely not. As long as there is a market for these products, and given the price and rarity of these items, molds will continue. Parts which are easy to copy will get copied. Bodykits are #1. However, parts with more detail and technical in nature, will be much more difficult and less likely to get copied. I'm sure the owner of A'PEXi has no worries. I doubt the numbnuts who copy bodykits seriously have the know-how to dissect an ECU.
The capitalist pig-of-a society we have here in the U.S. drives the competition do such bad things.
This just reaffirms the notion that Japanese products are superior. What the copycats are doing here in the U.S. just portrays the typical U.S. business ethics.
08-06-2003, 09:23 AM
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agreed....the majority of the "Knock-off" products are body kits, ie Items that don't require that much investment to produce.
On the opposite end, i would bet that these JDM companies wouldn't see a drop in sales. Why?
Well first of all, when some guy sees a body kit that he likes, its likely because he saw it on someone elses car. Now the kit on this car is more likely than not a replica. He'll do his reasearch and find that this bumper was say, for example, J's racing style.....or it even could have been a real J's bumper.
Fact of the matter is, buddy probably wouldn't even have heard of J's Racing had it not been for the replica in the first place, so J's Racing probably wouldn't have got the sale. However now, after doing his research, he may choose to pursue an authentic J's racing bumper for the fit, quality, and finish.
I think the replica companies in a way compliment the real companies, and vice versa.
On the opposite end, i would bet that these JDM companies wouldn't see a drop in sales. Why?
Well first of all, when some guy sees a body kit that he likes, its likely because he saw it on someone elses car. Now the kit on this car is more likely than not a replica. He'll do his reasearch and find that this bumper was say, for example, J's racing style.....or it even could have been a real J's bumper.
Fact of the matter is, buddy probably wouldn't even have heard of J's Racing had it not been for the replica in the first place, so J's Racing probably wouldn't have got the sale. However now, after doing his research, he may choose to pursue an authentic J's racing bumper for the fit, quality, and finish.
I think the replica companies in a way compliment the real companies, and vice versa.
08-06-2003, 10:06 AM
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Maybe if the authentic JDM products weren't so absurdly expensive, this wouldn't be as much of a problem.
I prefer a quality product, so if the original is too expensive for me, I don't buy a copy... I just don't buy anything. But that's just me.
The logic behind these astronomical prices is hard for me to fathom. Why not lower prices, make up the profit on volume, and kill two birds with one stone? I just don't get it.
I prefer a quality product, so if the original is too expensive for me, I don't buy a copy... I just don't buy anything. But that's just me.
The logic behind these astronomical prices is hard for me to fathom. Why not lower prices, make up the profit on volume, and kill two birds with one stone? I just don't get it.
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08-06-2003, 10:25 AM
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i so agree with this topic so much, knock offs piss me off, when I was shopping for a kit for my car, I had to search hard to find the j's front and airwalker side skirts, even had to drive to a different state to pick them up, and not to mention the amount of money i paid for them, but the money part is not what bothers me, its that now u have a bunch of companys copying these pieces and now instead of having something rare and jdm, its like everyone has it, its anoying, if i was one of these companys making these copies i'd alteast change the style and maybe even try to improve on the style, i dont see anything wrong with using something as an idea but copying it exactly is retarded, shows no creativity