Staggered vs Non-staggered
07-07-2011, 11:28 AM
#1
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Staggered vs Non-staggered
I'm so lost on why some people run non-staggered on a RWD car. I was at a meet last night and was told that the car handles better. I still don't see it. Newb question and maybe I should've searched first so don't flame me so badnon this 
07-07-2011, 11:38 AM
#2
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Basically, more rubber, more aggressive grip on turn in, more friction for braking. Other than the track, you'll never safely use it though - not to discount non staggered cars. The set up works for the track, if you're taking your car there its an option.
The reason Honda sent the car out with staggered wheels from the factory was to help stability by trying to keep the front ahead of the rear through less grip, but the S2000 is still known as a tail happy car. The S2000 has no problem rotating on staggered wheels so unless you really need a car that can dance I wouldn't change that.
In general, staggered is much more complicated though. Four equal wheels means you can rotate, for example. Staggered set ups are typically used when the chassis and car can't be made neutral on their own. If you do go to non staggered, you have to change the suspension geometry to work with it. Just because you have non staggered wheels does not mean your car will handle better - the choice to stagger or not is all about setting the handling.
The reason Honda sent the car out with staggered wheels from the factory was to help stability by trying to keep the front ahead of the rear through less grip, but the S2000 is still known as a tail happy car. The S2000 has no problem rotating on staggered wheels so unless you really need a car that can dance I wouldn't change that.
In general, staggered is much more complicated though. Four equal wheels means you can rotate, for example. Staggered set ups are typically used when the chassis and car can't be made neutral on their own. If you do go to non staggered, you have to change the suspension geometry to work with it. Just because you have non staggered wheels does not mean your car will handle better - the choice to stagger or not is all about setting the handling.
07-08-2011, 02:26 AM
#4
Great explanation. I've always wondered myself why people who track tend to prefer going non-staggered with this car. Seeing how the rear rotates so readily I didn't think the front tire size would be a limiting factor in corner speeds. I feel the S2000 stock brakes with upgraded pads are border-line sufficient so increasing front traction would definitely overwork them. I guess I'm of the "if it ain't broke, don't fix it camp" and pretty satisfied with the staggered setup. In terms of quantifiable improvements, what other characteristics aside from increased front traction for braking would be observed?
Basically, more rubber, more aggressive grip on turn in, more friction for braking. Other than the track, you'll never safely use it though - not to discount non staggered cars. The set up works for the track, if you're taking your car there its an option.
The reason Honda sent the car out with staggered wheels from the factory was to help stability by trying to keep the front ahead of the rear through less grip, but the S2000 is still known as a tail happy car. The S2000 has no problem rotating on staggered wheels so unless you really need a car that can dance I wouldn't change that.
In general, staggered is much more complicated though. Four equal wheels means you can rotate, for example. Staggered set ups are typically used when the chassis and car can't be made neutral on their own. If you do go to non staggered, you have to change the suspension geometry to work with it. Just because you have non staggered wheels does not mean your car will handle better - the choice to stagger or not is all about setting the handling.
The reason Honda sent the car out with staggered wheels from the factory was to help stability by trying to keep the front ahead of the rear through less grip, but the S2000 is still known as a tail happy car. The S2000 has no problem rotating on staggered wheels so unless you really need a car that can dance I wouldn't change that.
In general, staggered is much more complicated though. Four equal wheels means you can rotate, for example. Staggered set ups are typically used when the chassis and car can't be made neutral on their own. If you do go to non staggered, you have to change the suspension geometry to work with it. Just because you have non staggered wheels does not mean your car will handle better - the choice to stagger or not is all about setting the handling.
07-08-2011, 05:43 AM
#5
Moderator
Basically, more rubber, more aggressive grip on turn in, more friction for braking. Other than the track, you'll never safely use it though - not to discount non staggered cars. The set up works for the track, if you're taking your car there its an option.
The reason Honda sent the car out with staggered wheels from the factory was to help stability by trying to keep the front ahead of the rear through less grip, but the S2000 is still known as a tail happy car. The S2000 has no problem rotating on staggered wheels so unless you really need a car that can dance I wouldn't change that.
In general, staggered is much more complicated though. Four equal wheels means you can rotate, for example. Staggered set ups are typically used when the chassis and car can't be made neutral on their own. If you do go to non staggered, you have to change the suspension geometry to work with it. Just because you have non staggered wheels does not mean your car will handle better - the choice to stagger or not is all about setting the handling.
The reason Honda sent the car out with staggered wheels from the factory was to help stability by trying to keep the front ahead of the rear through less grip, but the S2000 is still known as a tail happy car. The S2000 has no problem rotating on staggered wheels so unless you really need a car that can dance I wouldn't change that.
In general, staggered is much more complicated though. Four equal wheels means you can rotate, for example. Staggered set ups are typically used when the chassis and car can't be made neutral on their own. If you do go to non staggered, you have to change the suspension geometry to work with it. Just because you have non staggered wheels does not mean your car will handle better - the choice to stagger or not is all about setting the handling.
07-08-2011, 06:10 AM
#6
Great explanation. I've always wondered myself why people who track tend to prefer going non-staggered with this car. Seeing how the rear rotates so readily I didn't think the front tire size would be a limiting factor in corner speeds. I feel the S2000 stock brakes with upgraded pads are border-line sufficient so increasing front traction would definitely overwork them. I guess I'm of the "if it ain't broke, don't fix it camp" and pretty satisfied with the staggered setup. In terms of quantifiable improvements, what other characteristics aside from increased front traction for braking would be observed?
Originally Posted by Saki GT' timestamp='1310067493' post='20756740
Basically, more rubber, more aggressive grip on turn in, more friction for braking. Other than the track, you'll never safely use it though - not to discount non staggered cars. The set up works for the track, if you're taking your car there its an option.
The reason Honda sent the car out with staggered wheels from the factory was to help stability by trying to keep the front ahead of the rear through less grip, but the S2000 is still known as a tail happy car. The S2000 has no problem rotating on staggered wheels so unless you really need a car that can dance I wouldn't change that.
In general, staggered is much more complicated though. Four equal wheels means you can rotate, for example. Staggered set ups are typically used when the chassis and car can't be made neutral on their own. If you do go to non staggered, you have to change the suspension geometry to work with it. Just because you have non staggered wheels does not mean your car will handle better - the choice to stagger or not is all about setting the handling.
The reason Honda sent the car out with staggered wheels from the factory was to help stability by trying to keep the front ahead of the rear through less grip, but the S2000 is still known as a tail happy car. The S2000 has no problem rotating on staggered wheels so unless you really need a car that can dance I wouldn't change that.
In general, staggered is much more complicated though. Four equal wheels means you can rotate, for example. Staggered set ups are typically used when the chassis and car can't be made neutral on their own. If you do go to non staggered, you have to change the suspension geometry to work with it. Just because you have non staggered wheels does not mean your car will handle better - the choice to stagger or not is all about setting the handling.
I have found my OEM brakes with upgraded pads MORE than adequate for my 255x4 setup, so it may just be a matter of not having the right pads in your case (i use CL-brakes RC5+) another advantage of non-staggered is you can stiffen up the front a LOT more w/o getting understeer which in turn helps put the power down better coming out of tight corners and helps with transitions, these are especially helpful in autox.
07-08-2011, 07:25 AM
#7
Moderator
Great explanation. I've always wondered myself why people who track tend to prefer going non-staggered with this car. Seeing how the rear rotates so readily I didn't think the front tire size would be a limiting factor in corner speeds. ... In terms of quantifiable improvements, what other characteristics aside from increased front traction for braking would be observed?
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07-08-2011, 08:18 AM
#8
Moderator
It comes in handy for us AP2 folks with stock roll bars...personally Im still going staggered for the track, but less than stock (ex:235/255 f/r)
07-09-2011, 07:37 AM
#10
In some situations maybe... what people do not realize is that the rear has the same amount of grip regardless of front tire size. So, if you go non-staggered and you will not spin on anything you used to do as long as that something did not result in any sliding (understeer or oversteer) BUT things that used to get understeer may just grip now or even oversteer. But you can make suspension modifications like I have, big front tires allow you to stiffen up the front more without getting understeer, stiffening the front makes the rear more planted and less likely to slide, so you get more grip front and rear.