Need help getting air out of the brake system
 

******THIS ISSUE HAS BEEN RESOLVED (post #10)******
I bumped the post to update it with the solution. I hate open ended posts when I'm researching a problem I'm having. Just trying to help the next person.


I installed Stoptech brake lines and let the brake fluid drain out. Now I'm dealing with the consequences.

I have tried following RobRob's guide to bleeding the master cylinder - I tried at the MC itself and at the ABS output ports. I've tried gravity bleeding multiple times for a LONG time at each corner. I've tried the old fashioned 2 person bleeding method, running a ton of fluid through each corner. I'm not getting ANY air out during these attempts, but I can't get pedal pressure back. What is the next step?

Are the two ports on the MC totally independent from each other? I used the MC bleed kit to bleed each port back to the res individually, but I have been questioning if I had to do them both at the same time. My kit only came with one fitting the right size, so I will get another kit or fitting if they have to be done simultaneously.

I wish I could find the Billman method for solving this. As I recall you depress the brake pedal and keep it there by bracing the pedal with wood pieces or other objects on the front seat, overnight.

Yes have you tried this yet? After you leave the brake pedal depressed overnight, take the car for a drive and engage ABS a bunch of times, at least 5. You will feel the pedal change. I've had to do this on the S2000 and my TSX and when you first engage ABS you will skid tires because the ABS won't be engaging right away but it will start to engage and that's when you know you're getting the air out. Then you will have to bleed again.

I actually just found that post about wedging the brake pedal today while searching and plan to try it tonight.

I can't engage ABS though. I'm having ongoing issues with that also. The ABS light is on, but there aren't any codes. Scanner says no communication. I tried replacing the module, but that didn't fix it. I might have a broken wire or something but haven't had time to diagnose that any further yet.

I have tried the Billman method and have not experienced these issues you're saying -- out of the many years that people have been trying it, this is the first I've heard of it causing "ABS" issues -- that doesn't even make sense to me. But rock on.

I never said it caused ABS issues haha, his method did exactly as it was supposed to. Read again and rock on harder.

So wedging the brake pedal didn't do anything for me. I looked at the fluid I drained out during bleeding and saw some black specs. I picked out one relatively large piece and it felt like rubber. Starting to think I got the air out but damaged the MC during bleeding. Probably getting pieces of a seal in the fluid.

Damaged master cylinder seal would explain why brake pressure is missing. Maybe it was damaged earlier?

Gravity bleed doesn't work when you have air in lines. It's only for regular fluid change.
Two person method or wedging the brake pedal overnight should work.

For the record, my issue WAS the master cylinder. My helper was putting the pedal to the floor during bleeding and must have damaged the seals. I replaced it with a refurbished unit from Advance Auto, and I now have my pedal back.

For fun, I tried to disassemble the MC and look at the seals. The rear piston came right out, and the seal looked fine. The front one was stuck all the way forward. No amount of banging the MC against the work bench was getting it out either.