Factory alignment spec
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 6,863
Likes: 125
From: Pawtucket, RI
Those specs are UK, first set is the range, 2nd set "recommended settings".
Unfortunately, their range for rear toe is absurdly, insanely, dangerously high, 2x higher vs the US range. IMO, it is in error. They recommend the lowest end of the range, or 0.67 degrees total, but this is still way too much imo. Poor handling, instability over bumps or in traction-challenged conditions, ridiculous wear rate, and worse mileage vs lower toe settings. I recommend 0.2 to 0.3 degrees total.
The uk recommended camber is fine, though.
Unfortunately, their range for rear toe is absurdly, insanely, dangerously high, 2x higher vs the US range. IMO, it is in error. They recommend the lowest end of the range, or 0.67 degrees total, but this is still way too much imo. Poor handling, instability over bumps or in traction-challenged conditions, ridiculous wear rate, and worse mileage vs lower toe settings. I recommend 0.2 to 0.3 degrees total.
The uk recommended camber is fine, though.
Thread Starter
Registered User
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 87
Likes: 0
Those specs are UK, first set is the range, 2nd set "recommended settings".
Unfortunately, their range for rear toe is absurdly, insanely, dangerously high, 2x higher vs the US range. IMO, it is in error. They recommend the lowest end of the range, or 0.67 degrees total, but this is still way too much imo. Poor handling, instability over bumps or in traction-challenged conditions, ridiculous wear rate, and worse mileage vs lower toe settings. I recommend 0.2 to 0.3 degrees total.
The uk recommended camber is fine, though.
Unfortunately, their range for rear toe is absurdly, insanely, dangerously high, 2x higher vs the US range. IMO, it is in error. They recommend the lowest end of the range, or 0.67 degrees total, but this is still way too much imo. Poor handling, instability over bumps or in traction-challenged conditions, ridiculous wear rate, and worse mileage vs lower toe settings. I recommend 0.2 to 0.3 degrees total.
The uk recommended camber is fine, though.
I think i'm doing
Front
Caster Left 6.45"
Caster right 6.45"
Camber left -1"
Camber right -1"
Toe 0"
Rear
Camber left -2"
Camber right -2"
Toe left 0.15"
Toe right 0.15"
Does that sound good ? I'm lowered on koni yellow (lower perch) and eibach pro kit though. Not sure if they're going to be able to get this exactly . I'm mainly going to be daily driving this .
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 6,863
Likes: 125
From: Pawtucket, RI
Be careful with your units! Another think the UK spec got wrong was using (") instead of (') for arcminutes. (") is the symbol for arc*seconds*, which are 1/60th of an arcminute, 1/3600th of a degree.
In the US, most shops do not use arcminutes, but decimal degrees. Some shops still use inches for toe settings, for which the symbol is ", which is what erroneously appears all over the UK spec where they intended arcminutes but used the symbol for arcseconds.
What units does your shop use for toe settings? Decimal degrees, arcminutes (not likely), inches, or millimeters?
If you ask for 0.20" per side, that will be taken to mean zero point two inches, or 0.46 degrees per side, 0.92 degrees total. YIKES! Way way WAY way too much.
My recommendation for rear toe in decimal degrees:
0.10 to 0.20 degrees per side, or 0.20 to 0.30 degrees total
in inches ("):
0.044" to 0.066" (inches) per side, or 0.088" to 0.132" (inches) total
millimeters:
1.1 to 1.7mm per side, or 2.2 to 3.3mm total
arcminutes ('):
6' to 9' (arcminutes) per side, or 12' to 18' (arcminutes) total.
In the US, most shops do not use arcminutes, but decimal degrees. Some shops still use inches for toe settings, for which the symbol is ", which is what erroneously appears all over the UK spec where they intended arcminutes but used the symbol for arcseconds.
What units does your shop use for toe settings? Decimal degrees, arcminutes (not likely), inches, or millimeters?
If you ask for 0.20" per side, that will be taken to mean zero point two inches, or 0.46 degrees per side, 0.92 degrees total. YIKES! Way way WAY way too much.
My recommendation for rear toe in decimal degrees:
0.10 to 0.20 degrees per side, or 0.20 to 0.30 degrees total
in inches ("):
0.044" to 0.066" (inches) per side, or 0.088" to 0.132" (inches) total
millimeters:
1.1 to 1.7mm per side, or 2.2 to 3.3mm total
arcminutes ('):
6' to 9' (arcminutes) per side, or 12' to 18' (arcminutes) total.
Trending Topics
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 6,863
Likes: 125
From: Pawtucket, RI
Here you must mean 6 degrees, 45 arcminutes. Not six point four five inches!
IMO, caster is overrated. I like less, actually. The range in the UK spec of 6 degrees +/-45 arcminutes translates to 5.25 to 6.75 degrees. You will be OK anywhere in that range, but my preference is toward the lower end. More gives heavier steering and more self-centering. Less gives lighter steering and less self-centering. Your preference within that range should be OK.
Damn UK spec! Should be DEGREES, not inches (or arcseconds).
Same here. But zero is zero anyway...
Again, DEGREES, not inches or arcseconds.
IMO, caster is overrated. I like less, actually. The range in the UK spec of 6 degrees +/-45 arcminutes translates to 5.25 to 6.75 degrees. You will be OK anywhere in that range, but my preference is toward the lower end. More gives heavier steering and more self-centering. Less gives lighter steering and less self-centering. Your preference within that range should be OK.
Camber left -1"
Camber right -1"
Camber right -1"
Toe 0"
Rear
Camber left -2"
Camber right -2"
Camber left -2"
Camber right -2"
Thread Starter
Registered User
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 87
Likes: 0
Sorry, I meant for all of these # to be in degrees but couldn't find the symbol. Anyway, got my alignment done today and specs are
Told him to do this spec:
Front
camber -1.0 degree
caster 6.75 degree or (6 degree and 45 arcminute)
toe 0 total
Rear
camber -2.0 degree
toe 0.20 total
Here's the old and new specs afterward (he tried to get as close as he could to the specs I provided him):
Front left (PREVIOUS)
camber -1.1 degree
caster 6 degree
toe -0.39 degree
Front left (NEW)
camber -1.1 degree
caster 6.0 degree ( said this was the max)
toe 0.01 degree
Front right (PREVIOUS)
camber -1.0 degree
caster 6.1 degree
toe -0.39 degree
Front right (NEW)
camber -1.0 degree
caster 6.1 degree ( said this was the max )
toe 0.00 degree
Rear left ( PREVIOUS)
camber -2.4 degree
toe 0.61 degree
Rear left (NEW)
camber -2.1 degree
toe 0.11 degree
Rear right (PREVIOUS)
camber -2.6 degree
toe 0.60 degree
Rear right (NEW)
camber -2.3 degree
toe 0.10 degree
Impression: overall, I did notice a big difference. The car was overall more responsive to driver's input and more " agile " . I'm not sure why he wasn't able to adjust the caster from the previous setting though.
Told him to do this spec:
Front
camber -1.0 degree
caster 6.75 degree or (6 degree and 45 arcminute)
toe 0 total
Rear
camber -2.0 degree
toe 0.20 total
Here's the old and new specs afterward (he tried to get as close as he could to the specs I provided him):
Front left (PREVIOUS)
camber -1.1 degree
caster 6 degree
toe -0.39 degree
Front left (NEW)
camber -1.1 degree
caster 6.0 degree ( said this was the max)
toe 0.01 degree
Front right (PREVIOUS)
camber -1.0 degree
caster 6.1 degree
toe -0.39 degree
Front right (NEW)
camber -1.0 degree
caster 6.1 degree ( said this was the max )
toe 0.00 degree
Rear left ( PREVIOUS)
camber -2.4 degree
toe 0.61 degree
Rear left (NEW)
camber -2.1 degree
toe 0.11 degree
Rear right (PREVIOUS)
camber -2.6 degree
toe 0.60 degree
Rear right (NEW)
camber -2.3 degree
toe 0.10 degree
Impression: overall, I did notice a big difference. The car was overall more responsive to driver's input and more " agile " . I'm not sure why he wasn't able to adjust the caster from the previous setting though.
!