Required wiring to retain EPS and etc
04-29-2016, 05:28 PM
#1
Required wiring to retain EPS and etc
What are the required inputs to retain eps and other features? I have a stand alone harness and I am having a little trouble figuring out the best solutions
05-01-2016, 05:43 PM
#2
I trusted my wiring to someone far more experienced and patient than myself, so I can't help much.
I thought all of the EPS wiring was in the chassis harness? All that get retained.
I thought all of the EPS wiring was in the chassis harness? All that get retained.
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Bill2008 (10-27-2017)
05-04-2016, 01:31 PM
#4
I'm hoping I can get away with just the new Dakota unit cause $300 for the IM kit is not helping my "budget", but there are so many conflicting reports form the t56 stock motor guys saying they were able to use the gm sensor and a Dakota box.
05-04-2016, 06:40 PM
#5
Going through your info stratocaster has been a bunch of help.
From what I've gathered so far the output from a s2000 sensor is about 46 pulses per rotation(40 teeth on the secondary with a 1.16 increase to the output). This ends up around 160k ppm. Assuming it is three wire square wave.
The gm units are 17 pulses. Which is around 50-60k ppm. Until it gets to the ecm and it becomes 4000ppm. So you use the signal right off the sensor and not the ecm output. The gm sensor is two wire however I don't know if that's a huge issue.
The new Dakota box does unconversion up to 16 times so I suspect it might work.
From what I've gathered so far the output from a s2000 sensor is about 46 pulses per rotation(40 teeth on the secondary with a 1.16 increase to the output). This ends up around 160k ppm. Assuming it is three wire square wave.
The gm units are 17 pulses. Which is around 50-60k ppm. Until it gets to the ecm and it becomes 4000ppm. So you use the signal right off the sensor and not the ecm output. The gm sensor is two wire however I don't know if that's a huge issue.
The new Dakota box does unconversion up to 16 times so I suspect it might work.
05-05-2016, 04:22 AM
#6
I do know that the Honda speed sensor and the GM speed sensor have different pulse rates.
In order to have the reverse lockout solenoid work properly on the T56 the GM ECU needs to receive the speed signal from the speed sensor, which when the speeds gets over a certain MPH the GM ECU sends the lockout signal to the reverse lockout solenoid. Since the IM swap uses the Honda sensor with the Dakota box (which has an output that can run to the GM ECU for use in this reverse lockout case) the pulses don't match up. The GM ECU is expecting a certain pulse-per-MPH but receiving a different pulse-per-MPH. Not really sure what the result would be if we just wired it in without changing the pulse rate in HP Tuners for the GM ECU... perhaps the reverse lockout would trigger slightly sooner or slightly later than normal which wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing... just not the way it would have worked in an OEM application.
HP Tuners allows you to change the pulse rate setting on this signal so we can change it to match whatever the pulse rate on the Honda sensor is. Then the reverse lockout solenoid will function just as it would in an OEM application.
In order to have the reverse lockout solenoid work properly on the T56 the GM ECU needs to receive the speed signal from the speed sensor, which when the speeds gets over a certain MPH the GM ECU sends the lockout signal to the reverse lockout solenoid. Since the IM swap uses the Honda sensor with the Dakota box (which has an output that can run to the GM ECU for use in this reverse lockout case) the pulses don't match up. The GM ECU is expecting a certain pulse-per-MPH but receiving a different pulse-per-MPH. Not really sure what the result would be if we just wired it in without changing the pulse rate in HP Tuners for the GM ECU... perhaps the reverse lockout would trigger slightly sooner or slightly later than normal which wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing... just not the way it would have worked in an OEM application.
HP Tuners allows you to change the pulse rate setting on this signal so we can change it to match whatever the pulse rate on the Honda sensor is. Then the reverse lockout solenoid will function just as it would in an OEM application.
05-05-2016, 05:52 AM
#7
You are on the right track. Assuming you have a stock speed cluster, it outputs a 4K PPM signal to the EPS, Softtop and cruise control. The Dakota digital box I used had several outputs from a single input. You just need to insure that the PPM for the speedo, ECU are both met for your VSS input as output from the Dakota Digital box. If you are not using the stock speedo, you need to directly connect to the EPS and softop.
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05-05-2016, 12:20 PM
#8
Can I not up convert the 64k vss signal from my t56 to a 160k for the cluster? Then let the cluster do the eps signal?
My t56 will use a Gm vss, from a 17 tooth wheel.. To keep my lockout working. I however want to branch off the vss signal to a Dakota box and then upconvert that 64k output to 160k then let the cluster down convert it for everything else.
Either way a stock or GM unit will only see as many signals as the teeth they are in the trans. So the only issue is that the signals might be a different type (square vs sine ) but The Dakota digital box can handle that as well supposedly
My t56 will use a Gm vss, from a 17 tooth wheel.. To keep my lockout working. I however want to branch off the vss signal to a Dakota box and then upconvert that 64k output to 160k then let the cluster down convert it for everything else.
Either way a stock or GM unit will only see as many signals as the teeth they are in the trans. So the only issue is that the signals might be a different type (square vs sine ) but The Dakota digital box can handle that as well supposedly
05-20-2016, 05:00 AM
#10
Most standalone's are quite capable of generating the correct 2 outputs for the EPS to function as OEM. Wire and configure 2 spare outputs on your ecu that can generate a frequency directly to the EPS module. This gives you 100% factory like EPS. Most people removing the OEM ecu or cluster or both are running in EPS fault mode which gives assist over 8 mph or a constant level of assist.
RPM: Blue wire at pin 5 at the EPS
7v pulse (also works at 12v)
Setting: Frequency
Duty cycle:50%
Frequency table:
53 hertz at 1500rpm,
103 hertz at 3000rpm
Vehicle speed: White/Black Pin 2 at the EPS
12v pulse
Setting:Frequency
Duty cycle 50%
Frequency table:
100 htz at 0 MPH
10 htz at 10MPH
25 htz at 21 MPH
58 htz at 51 MPH
A few notes: The vehicle speed sensor is on the gearbox. It's a 5v 3 wire hall effect. This goes to the cluster and is then translated to the above frequency table. I wired my veh speed into my standalone ecu at first to log the gearbox speed and the pull to 5v wasn't high enough to generate the channel. When i wired it into my Motec dash, I was able to set the trigger limits when configuring the sensor and it worked great. Then I generated a table to create an output channel based on the above table for the EPS to run correctly. Make sure you wire key on power and ground to the EPS module to run the module if you are are deleting the OEM wiring loom. I wired in the fault light to my motec dash as an extra precaution as I don't have a stock cluster.
Have fun,
-Paddy
RPM: Blue wire at pin 5 at the EPS
7v pulse (also works at 12v)
Setting: Frequency
Duty cycle:50%
Frequency table:
53 hertz at 1500rpm,
103 hertz at 3000rpm
Vehicle speed: White/Black Pin 2 at the EPS
12v pulse
Setting:Frequency
Duty cycle 50%
Frequency table:
100 htz at 0 MPH
10 htz at 10MPH
25 htz at 21 MPH
58 htz at 51 MPH
A few notes: The vehicle speed sensor is on the gearbox. It's a 5v 3 wire hall effect. This goes to the cluster and is then translated to the above frequency table. I wired my veh speed into my standalone ecu at first to log the gearbox speed and the pull to 5v wasn't high enough to generate the channel. When i wired it into my Motec dash, I was able to set the trigger limits when configuring the sensor and it worked great. Then I generated a table to create an output channel based on the above table for the EPS to run correctly. Make sure you wire key on power and ground to the EPS module to run the module if you are are deleting the OEM wiring loom. I wired in the fault light to my motec dash as an extra precaution as I don't have a stock cluster.
Have fun,
-Paddy
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