ralper

The economy is improving and gas prices are down yet Thanksgiving weekend sales both in the stores and online were down from last year. What do you think is going on with the economy?

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/01/bu...T.nav=top-news

(This is about the economy not politics. Please keep partisan politics out of this.)

fltsfshr

My November biz is up 28%. I'm hearing the same from several other specialty retailers. So from a micro economics standpoint, I'm happy.

As much as I'd like to, I don't think it's possible to discuss the economy without discussing politics. Free markets don't exist, only regulated ones. See HERE

fltsfshr

Lainey

I've been doing my part to stimulate the economy all weekend. Shopping in the stores, and on line. Eating out too.

I think the lower gas prices will help free up some cash for a few folks. Never a bad thing, especially at this time of year.

Our local economy is hard to judge. New restaurants have opened and seem to be busy. Our downtown area is much more up and coming than it has been for years. However, the local job market is not great by any means and the fishing industry continues to suffer with the new regulations, days at sea, catch limits, etc.

Legal Bill

Rob, this is a very good topic, but I'm not sure this audience can give you a well rounded view of the national economy. We all see the economy based on our own circumstances. I work in a high-end downtown office building in the more expensive part of a city that didn't suffer as much as the rest of the country and has recovered well since the great recession. I live in an upscale neighborhood and I shop at the new malls that have been built over the past five to ten years. So yeah, to me everything looks good. But then I travel to other parts of the country and it is a sobering experience. A recent trip to Trenton, NJ by way of the Philadelphia airport showed me a whole other side of the economy. The city of Trenton had more federal, state and local government offices than I have ever seen in one place. Obviously there was a deliberate decison of the public sector to invest in Trenton. Despite all the public money and public sector jobs many of the private businesses were out of business and in some cases the buildings were boarded up. I had a very hard time finding a place to have lunch. I drove through some of the residential neighborhoods and saw large groups of adults just congregating on doorsteps and in the street. The person I was with blurted out "don't all these people have any place to be in the middle of a work day?" An attorney from New Jersey told me that the unemployment rate in the city was still very high and that the gang violence made the city very unsafe during the evening hours. The economic situation in Trenton looked very bad.

I don't mean to slam New Jersey. I'm sure I can find places in Boston where the local economy is pretty bad as well. But that is my point. If I never go to those places, I don't see how bad the economy is for others, even if they are just a few miles from my front door.

My bottom line is simply this. If you ask a bunch of middle-aged/senior citizens who mostly have their own homes, good jobs, good retirement nest eggs and a sports car or two how the economy is doing, you are probably going to hear that it is doing well. But I wouldn't bank on it.

dlq04

Wow, that sure beats some of 'clocks' I've seen. What an impressive amount of info that even breaks down by state. Those numbers say it all . . . an F'n mess around the country. I know it is in Michigan. Every week our local paper announces another business closing. These are 30-40 year old businesses, not start ups.

Grant, be thankful that it is different in your business and location. As Bill suggests the pockets of dispair IMHO out number the pockets of good life.

S2KRAY

I plan to increase my charitable donations this year. So many people, especially children who have no where to live, not much to eat and a dim future. We are fortunate but don't take our good fortune for granted. I plan to cut down on gift giving this year to channel more contributions to those who really need it. Isn't that what Christmas spirit is all about.

fltsfshr

Rob

Housing is exploding around here, corporations are coming in from everywhere with good paying jobs. Hertz just relocated here among others. Only about 30% of Hertz people moved. Lots of quality openings and many other companies are doing the same.

We've always been tourist based but it's changing rapidly.

fltsfshr

skunkworks

I find it interesting how economic statistics can be easily skewed from source to source.

From a limited and local perspective the economy is improving. I get this perspective from my volunteer work at a regional food bank, where the need has remained consistent over the last year. There’s also a noted increase in existing and new housing sales, new business start-ups, and lower unemployment rates.

I can’t explain the fiscal improvement, increased spending, or the source of the local monies. Perhaps it’s due to regional energy exploration /development, a sense of well being from recent investments, or the National Stimulus input.

gary

RMurphy

Perhaps the decreased sales on Black Friday are less an indication of problems with the economy and more an indication that Black Friday is a thing of the past? We are bombarded with ads of "great deals" but when we check on our smartphones while in the store we find out we can get the same price in multiple locations. We can get "deals" any day of the week at any time of the day on the Internet. People are less enchanted by the whole Black Friday thing. Cyber Monday... that was a thing because people didn't used to have Internet so much at home. Now, everybody has it at home (many faster than at work!) and on their cell phones too so why wait until Monday at work? And all of the stores (both online and brick & mortar) are starting the various holiday sales earlier and earlier every year so I don't think Black Friday is "all that" anymore. I know I'm sick of Christmas sales before we ever even get to Thanksgiving.

I also noticed a LOT of articles and news reports in advance of this past holiday weekend about what *not* to buy on Black Friday since the deals on those items were typically not that great. Clothing, for example. They said that those prices are artificially bloated before Black Friday so the retailers can then claim huge discounts which really aren't all that huge. They said waiting pays off. Selection decreases, but deals increase. Several news clips encouraged people to wait because many of the best deals happen in the last few days before the holiday as retailers make that last push. Heck, many are calling them clearance "after Christmas" sales the day before Christmas. I know I saw Halloween candy on clearance this year and it wasn't even Halloween yet. Kind of goes back to the starting the various holiday sales way too early and rushing the seasons. Selling back to school clothes in July. Easter candy before Valentine's Day. Marketing for Valentine's Day on December 26th. I'm burnt out on most holidays before they ever arrive.

So perhaps we are all just burnt out. Perhaps we see no need to go crazy and spend like sailors on shore leave when Black Friday comes around since it's been rendered a non-event. Perhaps we have just changed our approach to shopping because various reports on TV and online have encouraged us to do so.

Here's a real stretch... maybe some people have gotten the message that having lots of stuff isn't really all it's cracked up to be and maybe having experiences is more in vogue than having stuff.

Legal Bill

I agree. Black Friday numbers can be down for many reasons aside from the economy, which from all indicators is no worse than it was last year.