Melted the brake seals
09-03-2001, 05:50 PM
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Melted the brake seals
After a day at the track with Hawk Blue pads on, I found that the dust seals in the front calipers are melted and brittle/cracking. I figure it is also quite possible that the seals inside the caliper are damaged as well.
Are there any aftermarket caliper rebuild kits available that might stand up to the heat of track days any better?
Clark
Are there any aftermarket caliper rebuild kits available that might stand up to the heat of track days any better?
Clark
09-03-2001, 06:31 PM
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Before you consider a new brake seal kit, we are currently R&D an aftermarket kit that will fit Oem wheels and will be 8~10 lbs. lighter per side,compared to the Oem calipers. Time frame will be approx. 2~3 weeks for final production. I will keep everyone posted with our project!!!
09-04-2001, 06:16 AM
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Joe_s2k,
Hehe, I figured I'd get the obilgatory "use the SEARCH Luke" post. I did search for several combinations and after wading through page after page I gave up because I did not find what I was looking for.
I am not really interested in changing my calipers at this point. I'm sure it's an upgrade I will do in the future, but the timing is not really good for me at the moment.
What I do need to do is replace the seals in my current calipers, and I am looking to see if there are any seal kits that are a little more robust than the stock ones.
Clark
Hehe, I figured I'd get the obilgatory "use the SEARCH Luke" post. I did search for several combinations and after wading through page after page I gave up because I did not find what I was looking for.
I am not really interested in changing my calipers at this point. I'm sure it's an upgrade I will do in the future, but the timing is not really good for me at the moment.
What I do need to do is replace the seals in my current calipers, and I am looking to see if there are any seal kits that are a little more robust than the stock ones.
Clark
09-04-2001, 06:20 AM
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by Davies2k
[B]Before you consider a new brake seal kit, we are currently R&D an aftermarket kit that will fit Oem wheels and will be 8~10 lbs. lighter per side,compared to the Oem calipers.
[B]Before you consider a new brake seal kit, we are currently R&D an aftermarket kit that will fit Oem wheels and will be 8~10 lbs. lighter per side,compared to the Oem calipers.
09-04-2001, 06:27 AM
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Originally posted by Clark
After a day at the track with Hawk Blue pads on, I found that the dust seals in the front calipers are melted and brittle/cracking. Clark
After a day at the track with Hawk Blue pads on, I found that the dust seals in the front calipers are melted and brittle/cracking. Clark
09-04-2001, 06:27 AM
#7
Wow, that is a heat problem I have not heard of. Did you have extended time on the track at one time?
Rather than looking for different seals (which I seriously doubt are available), I would urge you to open up the brake ducts to install functional cooling. I have had zero heat problems after that change.
How did the Blues perform, and is there noticeable rotor wear from them?
Rather than looking for different seals (which I seriously doubt are available), I would urge you to open up the brake ducts to install functional cooling. I have had zero heat problems after that change.
How did the Blues perform, and is there noticeable rotor wear from them?
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09-04-2001, 06:57 AM
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Clark, I am assuming you are referring to the day that we spent at Gingerman the week before last, yes? If so, I can't imagine that you melted the seals. I have spent almost 20 days like that out at Gingerman and I am using the stock/original seals still without a problem. Something doesn't sound right here...are you sure they are compromised?
Man, that's weird...
And I agree with others, I can't imagine that there would be aftermarket seals out yet...maybe soon/someday, but nothing that I have heard of...
Man, that's weird...
And I agree with others, I can't imagine that there would be aftermarket seals out yet...maybe soon/someday, but nothing that I have heard of...
09-04-2001, 07:44 AM
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Greg,
Yes, this was from Gingerman the other week. I was rather suprised too, but yes at least the front dust seals are pretty well destroyed. Since the brakes worked fine on the way home, I don't think there's serious damage to the piston seals themselves, but I'd rather change them as well to be on the safe side.
The only reasons that I can think of that the seals could have gotten so damaged are that:
1. There were two of us driving the car throughout the day, so the car did see about double the amount of track time that it normally would with just me driving.
2. There were a couple of sessions when I went out specifically to see just how late I could brake with the Hawks on (hence the little off at the end of the main straight).
I really am suprised though that this had happened.
cdlena, I do plan to duct the brakes (hopefully in time for the Sept. 14th track day, cause I'll be there then). As for the performance of the Hawks, I was very pleased. They had enough stopping power that I really could have used more tire (R-compound would have been fun).
I was running with stock S-02's with 9K miles on them. Though they have decent tread left on the fronts, I've been very disappointed with their grip since about 7,800 miles (I started to get lots of understeer right around then).
As for rotor wear, yes it is rather noticable. I would not use these pads for anything other than the track. The dust from them is also so metallic that I got rust all over the wheels that you MUST clean off immediately or risk damaging your wheels (had this happen on my Integra).
On a side note, I was only getting about 3-5 good laps in before the tires got too hot and started going off. Is there any neat little trick to quickly cool the tires off so that I might go out and do some laps, come in and cool them, and get some more laps in so that I could get the most out of each session?
Clark
Yes, this was from Gingerman the other week. I was rather suprised too, but yes at least the front dust seals are pretty well destroyed. Since the brakes worked fine on the way home, I don't think there's serious damage to the piston seals themselves, but I'd rather change them as well to be on the safe side.
The only reasons that I can think of that the seals could have gotten so damaged are that:
1. There were two of us driving the car throughout the day, so the car did see about double the amount of track time that it normally would with just me driving.
2. There were a couple of sessions when I went out specifically to see just how late I could brake with the Hawks on (hence the little off at the end of the main straight).
I really am suprised though that this had happened.
cdlena, I do plan to duct the brakes (hopefully in time for the Sept. 14th track day, cause I'll be there then). As for the performance of the Hawks, I was very pleased. They had enough stopping power that I really could have used more tire (R-compound would have been fun).
I was running with stock S-02's with 9K miles on them. Though they have decent tread left on the fronts, I've been very disappointed with their grip since about 7,800 miles (I started to get lots of understeer right around then).
As for rotor wear, yes it is rather noticable. I would not use these pads for anything other than the track. The dust from them is also so metallic that I got rust all over the wheels that you MUST clean off immediately or risk damaging your wheels (had this happen on my Integra).
On a side note, I was only getting about 3-5 good laps in before the tires got too hot and started going off. Is there any neat little trick to quickly cool the tires off so that I might go out and do some laps, come in and cool them, and get some more laps in so that I could get the most out of each session?
Clark
09-04-2001, 07:52 AM
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Hawk Blues are very aggressive race pads. My thought is that they simply introduced a lot more heat into the braking system than other pads, thus cooked seals. I'd guess the double stints didn't help the situation much either.
If you used the same braking force with either stock or race pads, the heat difference would probably be minimal. But aggressive pads allow later braking, and if you take advantage of them and brake later you'll will dissipate more energy, faster. Dissipation of energy equals heat and the harder and later you brake the more heat you'll create. Thus for most drivers, more agressive pads introduce a lot more heat into the system.
I'll be at a track this weekend that is especially hard on brakes, and that's why I'm dropping back to stock pads. I know I'll brake to the limits of the machine, so I've decided to reduce the limits a bit and save myself a lot of heat and possible damage.
If you used the same braking force with either stock or race pads, the heat difference would probably be minimal. But aggressive pads allow later braking, and if you take advantage of them and brake later you'll will dissipate more energy, faster. Dissipation of energy equals heat and the harder and later you brake the more heat you'll create. Thus for most drivers, more agressive pads introduce a lot more heat into the system.
I'll be at a track this weekend that is especially hard on brakes, and that's why I'm dropping back to stock pads. I know I'll brake to the limits of the machine, so I've decided to reduce the limits a bit and save myself a lot of heat and possible damage.