Daremo

So in another thread I mentioned that I was reading no compression in the #4 cylinder. As a result I took in to my local Honda dealer to see what they could do. With leakdown and investigation they are telling me one of the seats is bad. They are saying that Honda doesn't make/sell them anymore and that they can't do aftermarket parts, so their options are limited. They want to pull the head and send it to a machine shop to do the work. 10 hours of labor to pull the head and they are quoting almost $1400 just to do that. Doesn't include the machine shop labor to fix the seat and the labor to reinstall.

I went to Majestic and the fuc-ing seat costs around $2 - 3. We're talking close to $3k in labor to replace a $3 part?? WTF??

I don't know what to do. Take it to a local shop and have them do it? Try to see if I can find some factory seats somewhere? Use aftermarket seats? F-ck it and replace all the valves and seats with aftermarket? I would almost bet my life that a local shop would probably be cheaper, right?

I'm stuck. I don't want to get azz-raped by the dealer, but I want my car fixed right.

Slowcrash_101

Where are you located. It might not be a valve seat could just need a new valve. Still gotta remove the head, inspect it for warping, install a new head gasket, and replace oil and coolant. You may need new bolts, and you'll also have to lap new valves if that's the problem. I doubt it's the valve seat, if it is the valve seat you'll have a heck of a time finding someone that can do the factory 4 angle valve job.

Daremo

I'm in Maryland, near Columbia. Took the car to Jim Coleman's Honda in Clarksville.

They would have to machine the head to put in a new valve seat?

Slowcrash_101

Take it to Billman, if anyone can get your car fixed properly it's him.

No, you don't need to machine the head for that, not necessarily anyway, only if it's slightly warped. If it passes the inspection you can toss it right back on. As far as the valve seat the factory puts a 4 angle valve job on the valve seats, and if it's not done right you will lose a bit of power. Like I said, I doubt the valve seats are bad, probably just have a burned valve or two, so replacing the valves and lapping them so they seal properly on the seats is probably all it takes.

MM3Kwolik

I think there is some confusion with their diagnosis. A valve spring seat doesn't just go bad on these motors, and yes, it is only a 3$ part and simply requires removal of the retainer/keepers, spring, and seal to replace. A VALVE SEAT however is a much more involved job. It is the steel ring that is press fitted into the underside of the head. It is the surface which is ground to 4 different angles that the valve seals against. This is the part that is not sold separately by Honda and if it needs replacing, you will have to go aftermarket. (Old seat gets cut out with a mill, new seat gets pressed in and then ground to the proper angles, valve gets reground as well) It's not a job for any DIY-er and the Honda dealer is going to simply sub out the job to the machine shop they use for that type of work.

Hit up Billman and he should be able to help get you taken care of. I build/rebuild these heads all the time and have replaced hundreds of seats with great success. Just depends on the route you wanna go. 99% of the time if the valve seat itself is bad, a new guide will need to be installed and reamed, as well as a new valve as there is generally not enough good material left on the valve face to get a good grind if it's been mashing around on a distorted seat.

Anywho, good luck!

Daremo

Thanks for the info guys.

Who is Billman? A member of the forum?

ExcelerateRep

Yes. I would definitely get everything apart and see what you actually need before you start throwing parts at it. When the time comes, check out our website for you internal needs.

http://store.excelerateperformance.c...8831&pid=10027

Slowcrash_101

Do seats often go bad? I know that a burned valve will in time destroy the seat, but from what I've seen it's not something that is too common, usually a valve will burn to the point of misfiring before it does anything to the seat. I must admit I've removed heads and put them on but I've never done any machine work with my own two, aside from doing measurements and lapping valves, so I ask.

MM3Kwolik

I have had to replace a few in my time. It's generally only on heads where the owner had a burned valve and did nothing about it and kept driving on it. Another cause for destroyed seats is a bent valve. It'll oscillate on the seat making it egg shaped and there are times where there's not enough material left of the seat to get a good sealing surface again without cutting 90% of the seat out. (It's integrity would be compromised)

Daremo

Well, if I had either of those problems, they never materialized in a way that I could figure it out. I was having a bunch of various P030X codes (misfires) in various cylinders and started going about diagnosing the issue. But I had to keep driving the car. So if something happened as a result of the interim period between getting the codes and finally losing the cylinder I couldn't pinpoint it.

I went ahead and gave the dealer the go-ahead to pull the head and get it out to their performance machine shop that they work with. They should have the head pulled later today and know for sure what happened.