It's not reduced in your experience? Was that tested and measured with equipment or just your own "feeling"?

My hearing has not degraded since I was discharged from the Corps several years ago, I get tested yearly.

A typo? That's a pretty big typo that DOES change the final analysis. Which part of it is the typo? The graph or the text? You're assuming, I thought this was a study with a concrete conclusion that ear plugs must be worn, now you're assuming?

I'm not spouting bad advice, if you really feel that I am, I ask you again to show me a study that demonstrates the need for ear plugs. So far you have referenced old studies and articles that can't even publish their own results correctly which should make anyone question it and you have given advice to potentially violate state and local laws. That's bad advice.

There was a study done back around 1996 that stated Olestra was okay to consume, did you buy into that one too?

Other than these old, typo ridden studies, the only other thing you have are "experts" that say you should wear them, and why do they say that? Because those old, typo ridden studies told these experts that they should...

 

Is there any reason NOT to wear plugs?

 

Some feel it affects their ability to hear traffic around you. That is a valid concern with the very best foam plugs but not with typical silicone plugs.

3ngin33r1 want us to place his opinion above that of MANY "experts" (his quotes, our reality). Awfully stubborn in the face of 'some' evidence without a SHRED to support his contrarian view.

 

Some evidence? There is NO evidence.

Your claim is just like every other product out there on the market and how they "could" do something, or state that, "research suggests doing ____ is good for you".

That's all it is, a suggestion, a possibility. Wearing them MAY prevent hearing loss, but even your own referenced research isn't sure if it will or not.

Wearing earplugs COULD prevent hearing loss but that does not mean that it WILL prevent it and you have as much data saying they will as I do that they wont, none.

The only facts that are known are:
Most major motorcycle manufactures do not recommend wearing them (from what I've read so far)
Most major helmet manufactures do not recommend wearing them (from what I've read so far)
It is illegal to wear them in some states.

In 17 years since these studies were conducted, the corporate lawyers have not even thought about putting in a disclaimer line? It costs them next to nothing to do it and would definitely be worth their time in this lawsuit happy nation with warning labels on your cup of coffee.

Maybe they looked at your research the same way I did and realized, it's crap if they can't even publish it with correct numbers to match their graphs. No research to prove it, no lawsuit, lawyers are done.

This is like a Christian trying to preach to an Athiest that God exists. You cannot prove God exists so why should I believe he does? Because you say so or because some contradicting text says he exists?

Just like this research contradicts itself.

Every time I've seen a Christian try to do this, it ends up with the same lines you are throwing out there, "it's bad to listen to that guy because he doesn't believe and must be wrong, my way is better, look, read here and you'll see."

Just like you're doing now in your "reality".

Like I said before, I'd be more than happy to take back what I said if you can provide concrete evidence that shows not wearing earplugs will cause hearing loss.

You show me irrefutable research from a reputable source and I'll not only take back what I said, I'll even work with local politicians on getting laws changed and make a campaign contribution to anyone supporting the lifting of restrictions for the use of ear plugs while operating a motorcycle on public roadways.

 

You are a bizzarre fellow.

It's not difficult to understand. The reason there isn't an outcry from helmet manufacturer's to support ear plogs is because the hearing loss is gradual, it would take years before a before an after test would be conclusive. However, it would be nearly impossible to prove that the helmet use alone caused it.

On the flip side, anyone could get hit by an ambulance that ran a red light because he wasn't paying attention. His lawyer says hey maybe you couldn't hear the ambulance because the helmet manu told you to wear ear plugs! I think we have a case again!

All the ear plugs do is kill the wind noise and the more severe frequencies. I have a stock 636 and I can still hear the engine and exhaust while riding, muchless a horn or emergency vehicles.

It's not like a christian trying to convert an athiest at all. It's like some riders telling another rider it's in his own best interest to wear ear plugs because a lot of people that know more about it than we do think it's a good idea.

Plenty of good info has been provided [by me and a couple other posters] in this thread to the point someone can read it and make up their own mind.

 

Yes, I am bazaar, anyone who knows me personally will fully back you up on that one.

You say that plenty of good info has been provided but as I've pointed out, it's not even good info if the graphs don't match the text.

In the 13-17 years since the initial studies were done, there has been plenty of time to conduct long-term studies on this subject.

You say that people that know more about this than we do say it's a good idea but those people who know about it, get their information from the same studies already shown here that can't get their own data right. Do they really know more about it if they are going off of bad information?

So there's a group of experts that believe something and give advice based on it. Kind of like people who believe the email about the pilot getting off the plane with seeing eye dog email. Just because a group of people believe something to be true, does not make it true.

If you want to wear ear plugs, go right ahead and wear them, I could care less, but you shouldn't jump down my throat and say I'm giving bad advice simply because I don't share your opinion and question the results of what is obviously questionable, outdated research.

 

I don't know how you survive day to day life. You'd probably argue with a brick wall for a week until it proves to you it's a brick wall. There is no rational reason why you'd be so defensive about the fact there are a lot of people and evidence to support wearing ear plugs to better your hearing.

I have very little doubt anyone who knows you personally would back me up, and I bet they would also all agree you are making yourself look like a nut case in this thread.

"So there's a group of experts that believe something and give advice based on it. Kind of like people who believe the email about the pilot getting off the plane with seeing eye dog email. Just because a group of people believe something to be true, does not make it true."

Where do you get this stuff?!? That was rhetorical, please don't actually tell me. I think you spend a little too much time on the net. Before your feelings get hurt again, I spend too much time on the net as well. I'm sure you are a good guy and all but maybe too much coffee..?

 

you are from the UK, i dare you to post this stuff on a proper motorcycle form:
try it on visordown.com

i just dont like to see riders get exposed to this and it makes the s2ki forum look bad too.

3ngin33r1
you got over 15,000 postings here, why?

 

What evidence? I point out flaws in the evidence provided and the excuse is that it's a typo...

I'm not defensive about it, you are the one defending your advice, not me, and yes there is evidence that shows wearing earplugs in high noise environments can protect your hearing. But, there is no evidence that shows a full face helmet is not sufficient protection on a motorcycle at highway speeds and everyone should wear ear plugs.

Like I've said (I think 3 times now), show me irrefutable evidence and I'll gladly eat my words.

No one has done that yet.

As far as spending too much time on the net, well, it's my job to spend time on the net so that's not going to change.

And I'm not nuts... What was that line from Speed... "Poor people are crazy, Jack. I'm eccentric."

 

Why is the sky blue? Who cares why I have 15k postings, go to the corner sometime, there's people there with 5 times the post count that I have. I've been here for over 5 years too.

Why would I post on visordown? Are you suggesting I troll my way over there and randomly post something about ear plugs?