hwyix

Now that the 2019 Miata with 181 hp has been out for a while I wonder how the two cars compare with coil overs and good tires on both of them.
From the factory the S2000 is set up much nicer than ND2.

TheDonEffect

I drove the ND2, the power delivery feels stronger than the S right up until around where VTEC would kick in. The ND2 definitely has more punch on the top end than the ND1, but doesn't have the frenetic nature of the F20/22, and there's something about the the S's engine that feels more mechanical, perhaps stiffer mounts or something. The ND2 by comparison feels like a smoother B16C, and frankly the engine in that chassis is a bit of a charmer. Finally the Miata motor has character befitting of its fun nature.

The ND1s are pretty well documented for being competitive against the S, so the ND2 should close the margin more. Chassis for chassis, I'd give the edge to the ND2, lighter is always better. For blind taste testing, I actually prefer the ND2 as well for most driving situations. It's superior around town and just tossing around, I feel that as you get up to the limits the S starts to shine more, but I'd rather have the ND2. The F2xC motor though probably has more headroom for FI power with its stronger internals (we have yet to see what the ND2 can endure but I doubt it'll be as much as the F2xC), but honestly if you're going to build a hardcore track car with big power, it sorta defeats the purpose of buying these cars.

The ND2 aftermarket tunes are right around the corner, and the anticipated gains with basic bolt ons are optimistic. Consider that an Elise weighs in at 2000lbs, S2000 around just north of 2800, the ND2 just under 2400lbs, so another 20-30hp in that ND2 would be a hoot.

rob-2

If you're looking for the S2k formula I don't think anyone is yet to catch up. I love that the Miata is still a thing but it's always been a slight miss in my books. Great platform could never see myself owning it.

TheDonEffect

The ND has already proven to be competitive to the s2k before it got its power bump. Keep in mind the car comes from the factory really, really soft and with tiny tires. The s2k in contrast came pretty dialed in with stickier tires. The 500lb difference cuts into the s2k power advantage, more so now that they're finding that exhaust mods add worthwhile power and still no tune available yet.

In RF guise, with some light modding, I wont miss the s2000 other than the novelty of owning somewhat of an import icon.

hwyix

This is what I have been wondering. The ND2 has been out since oct of 2019. Seems by now an nd2 with bolt on's and s2000 with bolt on's would have crossed paths on the track.

The s2000 is still faster in a straight line. The S2000 has a higher trap speed in the 1/4 so it has it sill has the better power to weight ratio.

Chibo

I mean, we have this. A stock ND1 with single adjustable coilovers, a front bar, and 245 RE71R with the top down. A 2:02 at Chuckwalla CCW is quicker than non-aero S2000 territory, at least from what I have seen. I have done a 2:00 with room for a 59 there on NT01s, but I have aero and am an AP1.

Bullwings

Not the best driver, but here is this guy in a decently tracked prepped s2k with aero chasing an ND2 at laguna seca. The ND2 driver isn't exactly a pro-either, so we can say driver skill between the two cars is on par.

TheDonEffect

Yeah keep in mind there are still zero tunes available for the nd2, so power mods at this point are very minimal. If the nd2 in those bids had more tire and addressed the significant bodyroll, they're going to carry more speed in the corners than the S, and then getting out of the hole the S wont be able to reel it as if it had a v8.

hwyix

Trap speed is a much better indication of power to ratio than 0-60 or 1/4 mile times. An awesome
launch and a good launch will have different 1/4 mile times but the trap speed does not change or is
very close to the same.



Car and Driver tested the nd2 and it trapped at 95mph
https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews...ne-more-power/


I used this caculator to adjust the test weight until the trap speed matched
181 hp and trap speed of 95 mph.
https://www.ajdesigner.com/fl_horsep...trap_speed.php

stock ND2
test weight 2705
trap 95
horse power 181


I see S2000 trap at 98 to 100 mph. Using the same test weight of
2705 the Miata would need an additional 17 hp to to 30hp to keep up.

trap 98
horse power 198.1

trap 99
horse power 204.8

trap 100
horse power 211

hwyix

I wonder on the video if that's a tired S2000 engine with a 150,000 miles+ vs an ND2 engine with less than 10,000 why the two cars seem to be about the same pace.

Hard to tell in that video because they are never side to side and the ND2 is so far in front in the video it might just be making up time late braking, carrying more speed int the turn with better tires etc...