pyrocpu

"I'll keep my S2000 for decades!" ... so I said for the past 6 years...

So help me out here--dilemma... considering a buddy's gently-loved 08MY E90 M3, 6-speed.

Background (keeping it as concise as possible):
* Bought the S2000 new in 2007
* Until last autumn, it had only 16K on the odometer
* Was a third vehicle; daily driver was a 12MY FX35
* Past vehicles have always been new; highlights include 03MY G35 Coupe 6-speed, 05MY 350Z 6-speed, Xterra Off-Road 6-speed
* Worked in the auto industry for a decade where my job was to analyze new cars & trucks, critiquing faults and noting highlights of vehicles such as: build quality, NVH, ergonomics, feature set, on-track performance, real world driving dynamics

Current Status:
* Divorced, lost the FX that I'd *just* gotten, plus the other car
* Was a third vehicle, now the only car (motorcycle I got to keep )
* S2K has 27k on the clock, being pressed into daily driving duties
* Finally bought another house, post-divorce, back on the West Coast
* 11mi ea/way commute

Lifestage/Mindset
* Early 30s w/ girlfriend
* No kids, not intending any anytime soon
* Used to do 3-4 HPDEs a year
* Used to love mountain drives
* Truly not a brand-whore--I could have instead gotten a new base 335i sedan at the time
* Work hard, play harder

S2000 Pros:
* Old-school VTEC: love the cam kickover! Love revving the engine. Sorry, a little bit of a ricer at heart.
* Transmission: agreed--best trans, ever
* Handling: nimble, neutral (on the track)
* Easily to get into that "one-ness with the car" zone
* MPG: good; average 25mpg in mixed city/hwy
* A blast on the track--can keep up with more exotic hardware
* Driving position is perfect, even though the steering wheel is non-adjustable and seat can only move in 4 directions, manually.
* Great out of the box with little modification needed. This is one of the main reasons I bought the thing--I have great appreciation for OEM engineering
* Interior, while spartan, is of good quality: no rattles, tight panel gaps, solid switchgear feel. Better than a C6 ZR1's interior, IMHO (just quality, not feature set), for instance
* Maintenance is cheap!
* Best of all, I don't owe a dime on this car--haven't for a few years.

S2000 Cons:
* Need to rev it where ever I go. Yes, it's a double-edged sword.
* Passenger seat blows. I've ridden in it several times--bless my girlfriend's patience!
* Cannot do Costco/Home Depot runs. As a new homeowner, this really, really sucks.
* JFC this thing is noisy. My previous work life has completely damaged me in what I look for in NVH. I cannot hear anyone on my noise-cancelling BT headset. When accelerating, everyone stops talking--doesn't matter if they're riding shotgun or on the phone--it ALWAYS stops conversation. Getting annoying for me; I can only imagine what it's like for my friends & family.
* I've gotten tired of track days. I've gotten to the point where my lap times are consistent and I no longer have an adrenaline rush. It seems... very "normal." In order to go faster, would need several thousand dollars in upgrades. No, thanks.
* Can't hit up the mountain roads anymore. Too far away for the weekdays; too many cops & traffic on the weekends
* S2000 is literally just used as commuting, and weekend errands that don't require me purchasing much more than a small grocery run.
* Can't do double-dates--must take g/f's tired economy car
* Steering: while very precise, the EPS system takes all the feel out of it
* Ride quality: tolerable as a driver for trips < 100mi; mediocre after that. Horrible as a passenger. Let's just say ya don't wanna make the g/f's twins unhappy, because later that night I'll be unhappy.

E90 M3 Pros:
* 4-doors! Seats 5! Zomg!
* Power. "Enough" torque to not have to shift all the time.
* Finally, a decent audio system!
* Steering: feel/feedback is amazing
* Quiet in "normal" driving
* Suspension: Jeez--great ride quality and also great handling too? This is awesome!
* Buddy's E90 M3 has fold-down rear seats for the HD/Lowe's runs.
* 6-speed: Must have 3-pedals. I know the DCT is quicker; I just find a 3-pedal car more soulful & rewarding for myself. Just me though.
* Also great out of the box with no modifications needed--again, great OEM engineering, at least for performance.

E90 M3 Cons:
* MPG. 15-16mpg average?
* Shift feel just isn't the same as the S2000.
* Maintenance/reliability: this would be my first European car. Already reading about the throttle body motor gear stripping @ ~$800/ea for parts
* Motor oil: 10W-60? Really? And lots of it? C'mon...
* Used car: never had one before
* Color combo kinda so-so: dark grey (not sure which) with silver interior

Dilemma:
* Funding: I just bought a GD house. I need to sell the S2000 to buy buddy's M3.
* Regrets: I've looked on this forum--everyone who has had an S2000 regretted selling it. Also, there are MANY instances here on s2ki.com where people are second-time owners of the S2000: had one, sold it, regretted it, bought another used one later. I already know I'm going to regret selling it. But it would just be financially irresponsible to keep the S and also snap up my buddy's car.
* I could keep the S2000 and snap up a Honda Fit Sport in manual trans for DD duty, but man, not sure about a penalty box car.
* Yes, I could ride the motorbike to work more, but putting on all my gear on, then off at the office... it's a PITA and takes longer than just driving! The 45mpg is a plus though.

Specs on Buddy's M3:
08MY, ~45K, 3-pedal, Cold, Premium, Tech. Very minimal mods--spacers, 18" OE wheels, exhaust (kept OE exhaust which I'll re-mount), shift knob, OE accessory pedals. Tint. Pricing somewhere between $35K & $40K. TBD.

Anecdotal--I have a twisted/weird taste for cars... examples:
* Rather have a VW Jetta TDI 6-speed vs. a Maxima, for instance
* Fit Sport > MB C-class
* M3 > GT-R
* BR-Z > Mustang GT
* Altima V6 > Audi A4

So... what are YOUR thoughts? What do I do?! First-world problems for sure.

Ryan2949

When buying something like a small hatch back for DD duties you get great gas mileage, reliability, cheap to maintain/fix/insure/etc and it makes the car in the garage(s2k) that much more special because you miss it. You'll be DDing an awesome car like the M3, so you may get bored eventually if that makes sense. I think the M3 as your only car seems like the better option for your lifestyle and scenario.

But, remember, if you ever go back to or buy an S2k(alongside your M3) it won't be a new S2k anymore. You bought one new and it'll always be YOURS. You'll never get that feeling back if you decide to buy another down the road.

The answers will be pretty biased towards keep S2k on this website. I don't personally own one (joined because I was in the market a few years back and loved the community) so I will say M3.

Ryuu

bout the most important words I read were...

* Maintenance is cheap!
* Best of all, I don't owe a dime on this car--haven't for a few years

I've seen an unusual amount stuffed into a Fit....think they stacked a dozen or more S2000 owners in one...at one of the meets...

dv55xc

Keep the S and snag a fit sport for sure.
Main reason: dude you just bought a house! A buddy of mine works at a bmw stealership and he tells me that maintenance prices are astronomical compared to his civic. Sounds like you love the S too and seeing that u don't own a dime on it why put yourself in a position where you'll owe money and pay more for maintenance? Does your girlfriend have a car?

Chris S

I've owned a very similarly equipped E90 M3 since 3/09, have had my '08 S2000 for a couple of years, and had a couple of AP1's before that, so I should be able to give you a pretty good perspective.

IMO, the E90 M3 is one of the best all-around cars on the market, and will hopefully become more highly appreciated over time due to it being the M division's last car w/ a high-revving naturally aspirated engine. I don't drive it that hard very often, but BMW has found a wonderful balance between comfort and performance that seems to elude so many other cars. It has been totally reliable, and yes the oil is expensive, but the oil change intervals are commensurately longer (I'm going 8K miles vs. no more than 3K in the S2000). It has a real Jekyll & Hyde personality by pushing the M button on and off (assuming you programmed the performance-oriented settings for M Mode. I've often thought of selling it for various reasons, none of which have anything to do w/ my feelings for the car, but can never get around to doing so. Overall, I think it's the most satisfying car ownership experience I've ever had.

I love driving my S2000 on the track, but between having it modded for better performance (i.e. stiffer ride and more noise) and getting older, it's not my first choice to drive for street duty.

Bottom line, the S2000 would be the fun car to go if I wasn't interested in tracking. E9x M3's are very capable and durable on the track, but operating costs are a lot higher!

I think Fits are cool too, but your two choices are a personal decision. I'm voting for the M3.

NFR_AP2

I had a 04 S2000 for 2.5 years. I sold it June of last year so exactly one year ago. I have just got into my 2nd S2000 2 weeks ago. The car I had sold my first S2000 for? A 2009 E92 M3. I will never leave the S2000 chassis ever again. End of story!

basscase

If you didn't need to make Home Depot runs I'd suggest a 997/Boxster/Cayman as a better alternative given your details.

I have an E90 M3. It can play daily driver, but if you're not regularly going to drive it above 8/10ths there's really no point to it over a 335i. Like the S2000, at daily driving speeds the M3 is kind of lacking in character-- it's a little dull.

That's what Porsche is quite good at; they feel special even putting around town. Not as special as a Ferrari or whathaveyou, but you actually can daily a Porsche.

ApexPredator

I owned an e46 prior to owning a '11 e350 cause I got tired of maintaining it and spend hundreds on oil changes and valve adjustments. I wanted something comfortable and with warranty. But that got old quick cause I really missed the rush on weekends or nice days. Hence the s2k and I got my 2013 crv for dd. Perfect combo and cheap to own. So I would just keep the s2 and get a inexpensive dd for home dept runs

E90 is sick tho, if u can live with those cons.

Sent from my SCH-I605 using Tapatalk 2

TheDonEffect

FWIW I've owned two AP1s and I'm really not the biggest fan of the S, although I still do love them and who knows may buy a third one, just found the car wasn't me. That said, I'm also not a big BMW fanboi either, although sure I'd love to own an M3. So here's my assessment about you: doesnt like you aspired to own an M3 unlike alot of people, you've always owned new and seem to enjoy that quite a bit, and you seem to really love your S so long as it's a second car. You're not a brand whore and could care less yadda yadda.
Here's why I don't like the M3: I can't afford it. Do I have enough cash flow that I could fund such a purchase, absolutely, but to me it's too damn expensive. It'll slow down my retirement savings, it'll put a big damper on my lifestyle (I'm really big on traveling these days and I eat alot, lol), and for my situation the opportunity cost of buying such a thing is practically impossible to justify. I have to look for coupons to buy tires, and if you fall into that category, then you shouldn't be buying the M3. For what everyone always says about the M3, over time it's like clockwork, some other ridiculously expensive thing goes wrong with them, VANOS this, subframe that, throttle body this, etc etc. For me it's almost inexcuseable since those things 1) dont usually go wrong in other cars and 2) dont usually cost that much if they do. Gotta pay to play right? Hate that term, should only be used for gambling and bragging. If any of what I said strikes a chord with you, the M3 isnt, or at least shouldnt, be your car. But hey if you got the funds and know what youre doing, ala chris s, hasan, dude with teh viper, etc then go for it.
And the S is paid off, and probably worth... 20ish? M3 35-40, so about 18K more out of your pocket. I guess the question really is this: can the M3 be a better daily and weekend car than an S and another 18k car. Sorta unfair to since you're now having one car that's piling up all the miles, expensive miles at that, vs. two cars sharing the load appeasing opposite ends of teh spectrum. Additionally, M3 to make regular home depot/costco run. Hmm.
It seems like you need something more practical, and sounds liek you're not sold on if the extra maitenance cost is absolutely worth it, and if the added threat of a looming expensive repair is very tolerable. But the fit is so... practical, nothing to make you really grin, especially coming from that impressive list of cars you've owned. And I get the lust of wanting a nice car to put around in, but I think an M3 is overkill. Ever thought about just getting something like an IS, or G35/7, acura TL, etc. While those cars will never be an M3, they will be a nice, reliable, and luxurious DD, and you'll still have your S. It'll do all your DD duties you're looking for, and when you need that extra shot, you can switch cars. And honestly, variety is the spice of life. An older enthusiast once told me if you're trying to find a car to do it all, you'll never be satisfied. You either love everything about a car, or you buy cars that have things you love.

kove4life

^^agreed. s2k aside, you don't seem entirely sold on the m3. It sounds like you are settling. The m3 is a thirsty thing and hardly should be considered for daily driving purposes. I would never own a BMW that is out of warranty..the repair costs are quite high. Make the practical decision here..you just bought a house. You've got plenty of time to get into "nicer" vehicles