So sick and tired of power talk...
09-20-2017, 12:05 PM
#21
Registered User
Have you thought of getting a shorter gear set for the Cayman? Do you use first gear for driving other starting from a stop? Do you shift down into first? I love how busy the S2000 makes me on the shifter. For some that's a negative. I'm thinking about when the kids get older to get a Cayman as my quiet/luxury/winter car but that factory gearing would take some of the fun out for me.
09-20-2017, 12:22 PM
#22
Give me 300HP/TQ to the wheels and a competent AWD system at 3500 lbs or less. That's all I need or want. I'll handle the rest. I'll take more hp/tq but don't really need it. Hell if we are in a power debate, lets talk drivetrains too. I want a rally car for the street. AWD is fast in all conditions.
09-20-2017, 02:02 PM
#23
It's funny. So many "car enthusiasts" are obsessed with horsepower and torque (more, more, more!), yet...
a) They can't even handle that much power on backroads or track. (And most don't go to track anyway.)
and...
b) They're doing less real driving, as electronic this, electronic that, traction control this and stability control that are often intervening to save them from their moderate skills and their cars' obscene power.
I realize pin-your-back-in-the-seat power can be enjoyable, but give me a car with enough, reasonable power to be be a blast, accompanied with a more engaging, mechanical and visceral experience. Guess that's why I'll always own my S2000.
Interested to see if you agree or disagree. Assume we'll have a mixed bunch.
a) They can't even handle that much power on backroads or track. (And most don't go to track anyway.)
and...
b) They're doing less real driving, as electronic this, electronic that, traction control this and stability control that are often intervening to save them from their moderate skills and their cars' obscene power.
I realize pin-your-back-in-the-seat power can be enjoyable, but give me a car with enough, reasonable power to be be a blast, accompanied with a more engaging, mechanical and visceral experience. Guess that's why I'll always own my S2000.
Interested to see if you agree or disagree. Assume we'll have a mixed bunch.
I don't totally disagree with you, but this sentiment has basically become conventional automotive edge lord wisdom. "While you guys were buying horsepower, I was studying the blade."
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lolS2K (09-23-2017)
09-20-2017, 02:40 PM
#24
Moderator
One of the reasons I passed on moving to a bigger hp car like a Vette was the fact that I was just spending all my time in 1st gear with it. Being able to shoot out from a light is fun and torque always puts a smile on my face, but I DD my sports cars so I wanted something that was more playful in daily situations as well as the odd track event. As I've gotten more into the country drive, I find the at-speed capabilities of a lower hp car the most fun. I also have motorcycles, so that may color things as well though.
HP is great, but I'd rather have a fun car than a powerful car.
HP is great, but I'd rather have a fun car than a powerful car.
09-20-2017, 04:09 PM
#25
It's funny. So many "car enthusiasts" are obsessed with horsepower and torque (more, more, more!), yet...
a) They can't even handle that much power on backroads or track. (And most don't go to track anyway.)
and...
b) They're doing less real driving, as electronic this, electronic that, traction control this and stability control that are often intervening to save them from their moderate skills and their cars' obscene power.
I realize pin-your-back-in-the-seat power can be enjoyable, but give me a car with enough, reasonable power to be be a blast, accompanied with a more engaging, mechanical and visceral experience. Guess that's why I'll always own my S2000.
Interested to see if you agree or disagree. Assume we'll have a mixed bunch.
a) They can't even handle that much power on backroads or track. (And most don't go to track anyway.)
and...
b) They're doing less real driving, as electronic this, electronic that, traction control this and stability control that are often intervening to save them from their moderate skills and their cars' obscene power.
I realize pin-your-back-in-the-seat power can be enjoyable, but give me a car with enough, reasonable power to be be a blast, accompanied with a more engaging, mechanical and visceral experience. Guess that's why I'll always own my S2000.
Interested to see if you agree or disagree. Assume we'll have a mixed bunch.
09-20-2017, 04:11 PM
#26
Plus, more BHP and Torque usually means more traffic tickets... for me.
09-20-2017, 04:31 PM
#27
I really dig my S2K....But It's not quite like the thrill I get with the GT350....Even when autocrossing.
And on that note, I don't get why its such a dig to see a small, low-power car pull quicker times in this brand of racing...The little car has a greater ability to use more of its power when it isn't fighting traction every few seconds like a high powered car is. That doesn't make it better...It just means its better at short, sub 60mph parking lot races like that. All that disappears when the big car gets a fast straight or long sweeper.
09-20-2017, 05:32 PM
#28
I have seen it discussed on Porsche boards and, I admit I know nothing about the innards of a manual transmission but the discussion basically said first and second gear are "on the shaft" so it was not doable. I am guessing that nobody makes a replacement piece with shorter gearing on it, and to be honest, I don't think I would come up with the kind of cash to pull the transmission on a Porsche and have it messed with for fun.
For that car though I am getting a flash done when the CPO warranty runs out.
For that car though I am getting a flash done when the CPO warranty runs out.
09-20-2017, 07:57 PM
#29
I have seen it discussed on Porsche boards and, I admit I know nothing about the innards of a manual transmission but the discussion basically said first and second gear are "on the shaft" so it was not doable. I am guessing that nobody makes a replacement piece with shorter gearing on it, and to be honest, I don't think I would come up with the kind of cash to pull the transmission on a Porsche and have it messed with for fun.
For that car though I am getting a flash done when the CPO warranty runs out.
For that car though I am getting a flash done when the CPO warranty runs out.
Last edited by s2000Junky; 09-20-2017 at 08:00 PM.
09-20-2017, 09:51 PM
#30
Good timing with this thread. I just sold my c5z, a car I've wanted since high school and people here know my affection for the fiberglass wonder, and am going to buy an frs this weekend. This after coming from 2 AP1s.
The vette was an amazing machine, and even more wonderful on the track which I had the pleasure of doing my first hpde in. And power is very fun on the track, especially when you lack skill and can use the right foot to make you into a god exiting a corner.
That said, I didn't find the overall ownership experience to be fun enough to warrant the cost of ownership. Granted I did buy it as a bargain, but operating costs, stress of something bound to break, and I hate driving it doing mundane tasks. Got to the point even friends and family didn't even want to ride in it, rather just take my dd. Oh and the vette clubs are... stuffy.
Driving fast cars is very fun, just like cocaine, but like cocaine if you don't have the disposable income to fund your habit comfortably, well it does even more terrible things. I think what some of us are trying to articulate is that smaller, less powered cars provide the most thrill, scratches the most automotive itch, for the buck. You wake up one day saying why do I have this much time and money tied up in this. Then you drive say a miata, or an s2000, or whatever, and realize that in a vacuum, in your own mind, you're having lots of fun. It's only when the next guy pulls up in a gtr or viper that your fun diminishes. Think about why people like cars like evos, camaro ss 1les, even the type r, because they're perceived giant slayers; but in the end it's all one big dick hanging contest. It becomes insanity, consumerism at it's finest. I was shopping vigorously for a 1le, then one morning I woke up and realize the only reason why I want it, besides it being a badass car, is because how fast it is relative to its peers. There's always something cooler and faster.
So with this frs I'm taking it back to my roots, where my car love was pure, and now I have the means to do whatever I want to and with it. It's liberating. The 86 clubs much like the s2000 clubs are very active, and I plan on honing my driving skills in it.
I know for sure I will miss the power, a supercharger is in the budget in the near future, but it's nice to know that if I blow a motor it won't financially cripple me.
Every single old timer track guy told me it doesn't matter what you drive so long as you're out there driving it, whatever car let's you do that the most will bring you the most fun. My vette wasn't expensive in its purchase price and the operating costs weren't so bad, but I could never drive it to the mall or the movies, tires were very expensive (I could almost replace all four tires on an frs for the price of one rear tire), lifting the car up was a pain in the ass, it became a waste of space and time which made it expensive. Plus it's old.
Anyway happy motoring.
The vette was an amazing machine, and even more wonderful on the track which I had the pleasure of doing my first hpde in. And power is very fun on the track, especially when you lack skill and can use the right foot to make you into a god exiting a corner.
That said, I didn't find the overall ownership experience to be fun enough to warrant the cost of ownership. Granted I did buy it as a bargain, but operating costs, stress of something bound to break, and I hate driving it doing mundane tasks. Got to the point even friends and family didn't even want to ride in it, rather just take my dd. Oh and the vette clubs are... stuffy.
Driving fast cars is very fun, just like cocaine, but like cocaine if you don't have the disposable income to fund your habit comfortably, well it does even more terrible things. I think what some of us are trying to articulate is that smaller, less powered cars provide the most thrill, scratches the most automotive itch, for the buck. You wake up one day saying why do I have this much time and money tied up in this. Then you drive say a miata, or an s2000, or whatever, and realize that in a vacuum, in your own mind, you're having lots of fun. It's only when the next guy pulls up in a gtr or viper that your fun diminishes. Think about why people like cars like evos, camaro ss 1les, even the type r, because they're perceived giant slayers; but in the end it's all one big dick hanging contest. It becomes insanity, consumerism at it's finest. I was shopping vigorously for a 1le, then one morning I woke up and realize the only reason why I want it, besides it being a badass car, is because how fast it is relative to its peers. There's always something cooler and faster.
So with this frs I'm taking it back to my roots, where my car love was pure, and now I have the means to do whatever I want to and with it. It's liberating. The 86 clubs much like the s2000 clubs are very active, and I plan on honing my driving skills in it.
I know for sure I will miss the power, a supercharger is in the budget in the near future, but it's nice to know that if I blow a motor it won't financially cripple me.
Every single old timer track guy told me it doesn't matter what you drive so long as you're out there driving it, whatever car let's you do that the most will bring you the most fun. My vette wasn't expensive in its purchase price and the operating costs weren't so bad, but I could never drive it to the mall or the movies, tires were very expensive (I could almost replace all four tires on an frs for the price of one rear tire), lifting the car up was a pain in the ass, it became a waste of space and time which made it expensive. Plus it's old.
Anyway happy motoring.