darcyw

completely agree- major PITA to take the car in for service- it really is more convenient for me to do my own servicing on my own time.

I too keep my cars forever- my 2000 SiR, 88 GTX, '03 s2000- all are geriatric in car years. so, that means when i buy my next car, it will be in the family for a generation.

darcy

steven88

I honestly don't know what Honda's target mileage is for reliability. Let's throw up some theoretical numbers. If Honda considers a stock car with consistent maintenance to last 400k (blown engine), then let's half that to 200k when it becomes modded. Well TBH, I'm not planning to keep a Civic for that long. But and let's say that I do, well I would consider it a great investment to get that many miles with bolt ons. And seriously, how expensive can it be to just drop in a new L15 engine? It can't be that much. This isn't a blown engine from a bloody Porsche 911 GT3 RS we're talking about.

Anyway that doesn't mean I'm going out this weekend to buy one. I'm just excited to see how the aftermarket unfolds. Everybody bashed the crap out of Honda when the 9th gen Si came out. It gained nearly 200lbs and stayed the same hp. Well look how it turned out after tuners got their hands on them. I can't wait to see how this new Si turns out after $2k-$3k worth of bolt ons.

JonBoy

Typical Honda goal is 200K miles before you have to replace anything mechanical, besides a water pump or similar accessory. The engine and transmission should last a minimum of 200K miles without issue.

That said, you make an excellent point. There are a ton of Civics out there and a replacement engine (used, typically, from a junk yard) shouldn't be THAT expensive. Labor is usually the bigger issue but still, not that bad.

white98ls

C&D Lightning Lap is out. Civic Si turned a 3:14.6 lap time. Some context:

Subaru WRX STI (2015): 3:10.5
Subaru WRX Performance Package (2018): 3:11.5
Volkswagen Golf R (2015): 3:12.3
Honda Civic Si (2017): 3:14.6
Volkswagen GTI PP 6MT (2015): 3:14.6
Mini Cooper Hardtop JCW (2015): 3:15.4
Subaru WRX (2015): 3:15.5
Ford Mustang EcoBoost PP (2015): 3:15.6
Ford Focus ST (2014): 3:17.6
Subaru BRZ Performance Package (2017): 3:19.7
Mazda MX-5 Miata Club (2016): 3:20.8

Not too shabby for all those complaining about the 1.5L. Some other benchmarks: The old Chevy Cobalt SS, which is quite fast with 260hp, Brembos, Quaife LSD, and sticky rubber, did a 3:13.0. It was the Nurburgring FWD record holder when it came out. Given the Si is meant to be an intermediate step before the CTR, not bad.

More context: it is officially faster than the S2000 CR (3:15.0). For $24k and with 28/38mpg with a manual, I wouldn't mind one for a commuter.

TheDonEffect

I said it before in this thread, I think the EXT and the SI are the FWD Turbo Hondas to get, the recipe is right at these trim levels because it has the practicality, hopefully the reliability, fun factor, but most importantly the value aspect. Buddy of mine just picked one up for under 25k. I just wish it came in the hatcback.
That said, I could care less how fast it tracks, but the fact that it does put down decent numbers is great.
Btw, using an s2000 as any kind of benchmark these days proves really nothing, the 350z was faster than it around most tracks. What makes the S2000 endearing is that it offers a great driving experience with miata level cost of operation, and not that it's fast.

WolfpackS2k

I'll admit I'm impressed by that time.

But please be careful when comparing 2017 times with considerably older ones. VIR was repaved a few years ago, a few turns were slightly tweaked, and those changes made the track faster.

vader1

On top of that I guess I would add that, I think it was Car and Driver ran an article about how much of car performance in the last several years have come from rapid recent advancements in tire technology. Some of the cars tested four years ago might run significantly better times if equipped with some of the newer tires.

iforyou

Yea, It was repaved in 2013/2014, and then again in 2015/2016.

For sure tire technologies have advanced. So IMO it's mainly comparable for cars made in the past few years, like as far back as 2014.

darcyw

Well now I have actually driven an Si- just got back from a test drive- 4 door sedan.
With the A/C on there is no power off the line- I thought there was a problem until I asked the sales guy if he turned the A/C on- he had, then he kindly turned it off. Now we're talking- it moves and like most turbo cars, takes some time to spool up. It does not feel any more zippy off the line than my EM1 (SiR), but once the power builds, its gone. I liked the whoosh of torque and I think I could get used to it. I would have preferred the 2 door and we can't get an Si hatch.

It has more features than I care about, but interestingly heated seats front AND rear. great steering wheel, great quick steering rack. The shifter/clutch is absolutely incredible- good work Honda. I'd drive with the "sport" setting all the time and wish that was default.

I drove a TypeR literally 24 hours previous with verve at autocross- it won me over with its telepathic handling- the more oversteery FWD I've ever driven- it just goes where you want it ALL THE TIME. The CTR shifter is equal to the Si. The Si has a very similar interior to the CTR as well- nearly as good seats…imagine a smoother, less edgy ride- more smooth in the Si. But I prefer the wicked handling of the typeR- the CTR power is pure madness. The Si engine is decent enough, but needs a little more noise- remember, loud pipes save lives.

If not for actual street laws, i'd like to take the Si to the limit. I typically judge a car by how i'd use it at auto slalom- I'm willing to sacrifice some comfort for feedback and edge.

Overall, the Si was much, much better than I expected- and considerably better than the internet said it was- If you only listen to the internet, you'd think the car was a complete dog- its not, trust me. Its 80-85% of the CTR and should be given its lower cost. But, the interior draws heavily from or maybe the CTR draws heavily from the Si.

I question if better summer rubber would bring the Si closer to the CTR experience (we get all season 235 40r18). With the Si not flying out the showroom maybe incentives will sell them and tempt me more.
The sales man I talked to had never sold one and admitted to not caring so much about the Si as, again, he hadn't sold one yet- not his bread and butter. Maybe the manual is a turn off, but it should not be- its the best I've driven in a modern car.

So, a 2 door in red is tempting…but so is the TypeR "lite"- come on Honda.

​​​​​​​darcy

white98ls

At least in the U.S., summer tires are a mere $200 option. Car and Driver has tested an Si with both sets of tires - summer obviously performed MUCH better.