CFA Stuff
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Originally Posted by Chris S2K,Feb 4 2010, 08:41 PM
I believe I failed because I got mentally lazy and lost focus studying parts of the of the curriculum I deemed "boring." It still bugs me a little bit to think that I failed by no more than a few questions (at most), so if you're thinking about signing up, just see to it that you push yourself until the end, no matter how mundane it may be at times.
Originally Posted by magician,Feb 4 2010, 09:39 PM
It depends to a great extent on the particular company. PIMCO, for example, typically hires account managers with degrees from Harvard, Wharton, Stanford, Chicago, and the like. At other companies it makes less of a difference where you earned your degree.
When I was at PIMCO they insisted that all of their account managers and analysts sit for the CFA exams. To that extent, it's a great equalizer. I didn't graduate from Harvard, Wharton, Stanford, or Chicago, but I passed all three CFA exams while many others at PIMCO who did graduate from those schools failed them.
If I were hiring someone for a financial position, I'd weigh their results in the CFA program more heavily than the school from which they earned their degree. Note, however, that others might have a different opinion.
When I was at PIMCO they insisted that all of their account managers and analysts sit for the CFA exams. To that extent, it's a great equalizer. I didn't graduate from Harvard, Wharton, Stanford, or Chicago, but I passed all three CFA exams while many others at PIMCO who did graduate from those schools failed them.
If I were hiring someone for a financial position, I'd weigh their results in the CFA program more heavily than the school from which they earned their degree. Note, however, that others might have a different opinion.
.. I guess that makes sense. When my mom was working VC's almost every single partner was MIT, Harvard, Haas, Stanford, USC, Brown, etc etc etc. I don't think I can get in to one of those, and think I'd be better suited to take the CFA exams... but also don't want to be discounted in the workforce even if I have my CFA but "only" a Bachelor's from SJSU or SFSU
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Originally Posted by magician,Feb 4 2010, 09:51 PM
The required body of knowledge is broad - possibly too broad. I had a distinct advantage over many of the candidates: a BA in Accounting, and both a BA and an MA in Mathematics. Thus, FRA, Quant, Econ, and CF were all old hat to me, and Equity, Fixed Income, Derivatives, Alternatives, and Portfolio Management were easy to learn: all applied math. Many of the ideas were new, but most were things I'd already seen many, many times before, or slight variations on those.
Do you feel it'd be beneficial in the long run to also major in something like an applied math? In order to graduate, I only need Calculus 1.
IF i were to double major.. should I focus on a math to make it easier for the CFA exams? Things like analysis come really easy to me. I'm really really well with crunching numbers.. but statistics, derivatives, and theoretical math don't sit well in my brain.
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Originally Posted by espelirS2K,Feb 4 2010, 10:00 PM
ANOTHER thing I've been considering... double major. Since most other business majors require only another semester of work.
Do you feel it'd be beneficial in the long run to also major in something like an applied math? In order to graduate, I only need Calculus 1.
IF i were to double major.. should I focus on a math to make it easier for the CFA exams? Things like analysis come really easy to me. I'm really really well with crunching numbers.. but statistics, derivatives, and theoretical math don't sit well in my brain.
Do you feel it'd be beneficial in the long run to also major in something like an applied math? In order to graduate, I only need Calculus 1.
IF i were to double major.. should I focus on a math to make it easier for the CFA exams? Things like analysis come really easy to me. I'm really really well with crunching numbers.. but statistics, derivatives, and theoretical math don't sit well in my brain.
- Math 150A,B Analytic Geometry and Calculus
- Math 250A Intermediate Calculus
- Math 250B Introduction to Linear Algebra and Differential Equations
- Math 280 Strategies of Proof
- Math 307 Linear Algebra
- Math 335 Mathematical Probability
- Math 350 Advanced Calculus I
- Math 306 Vector and Tensor Analysis
- Math 310 Ordinary Differential Equations
- Math 340 Numerical Analysis
- Math 302 Modern Algebra
- Math 370 Mathematical Model Building
- Math 375 Discrete Dynamical Systems and Chaos
- Math 406 Introduction to Partial Differential Equations
- Math 412 Complex Analysis
- Math 425 Differential Geometry
- Math 435 Mathematical Statistics
or - Math 438 Introduction to Stochastic Processes
- Math 440 Advanced Numerical Analysis
- Math 450 Advanced Calculus II
- Math 470 Advanced Mathematical Model Building
That said, a math degree - pure or applied - will be a tremendous help for the CFA exams.
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Not disregarding at all..
Just weighing options. I have a couple friends, one who just graduated with a PhD in Cognitive Science, and another who is applying for PhD programs in Chemistry.
While I don't want to do these.. seeing them succeed and being relatively average students (asked my friend with the PhD in CogSci and he graduated with a 3.3 in the undergrad program). So I know I could do things like this if I really set my mind to it. And as I'm getting closer and closer to transfering out of community college it's making me want to try and succeed more and more.
I mean, I'm pretty sure it's subjective... but what would you say that extra work (2-3 years worth) weigh out for the CFA exams? Lets talk percentages and ROI since this is a finance focused discussion
Just weighing options. I have a couple friends, one who just graduated with a PhD in Cognitive Science, and another who is applying for PhD programs in Chemistry.
While I don't want to do these.. seeing them succeed and being relatively average students (asked my friend with the PhD in CogSci and he graduated with a 3.3 in the undergrad program). So I know I could do things like this if I really set my mind to it. And as I'm getting closer and closer to transfering out of community college it's making me want to try and succeed more and more.
I mean, I'm pretty sure it's subjective... but what would you say that extra work (2-3 years worth) weigh out for the CFA exams? Lets talk percentages and ROI since this is a finance focused discussion
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espelirS2K - I don't think focusing on math will necessarily improve your chances of passing the exam dramatically. Keep in mind that the quantitative methods section of the exam is the smallest section of the pie, while Equity Valuation and FRA make up the bulk of the package. Those sections don't require anything more than basic algebra, so studying stochastic calculus is overkill. It is true that you will need to apply some of the quant. knowledge to other sections of the exam, including derivatives, portfolio management, and alternative investments, but from what I've seen, expert proficiency in algebra and statistics will go a long way in finance and the exam, so unless you want to work in a specialized field, such as securitization (which is just about dead), it's not necessary. Also, if you do decide to venture off into those fields, you'll need just as much knowledge with programming and modeling so now you'll need to add programming (C++, Matlab) to your school curriculum.
Focus on math if you want to go into actuarial science. Stick to finance/econ, or finance/accounting if you want to go the CFA route, with the latter being the preferred route.
Focus on math if you want to go into actuarial science. Stick to finance/econ, or finance/accounting if you want to go the CFA route, with the latter being the preferred route.
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Thanks guys-- that's what I wanted to hear.
I think my ultimate goal with taking the CFA would be working with VCs and startups on investment decisions. Management Analysis? Performance Analysis?
I think my ultimate goal with taking the CFA would be working with VCs and startups on investment decisions. Management Analysis? Performance Analysis?
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Originally Posted by espelirS2K,Feb 4 2010, 06:23 PM
Another question! (also to keep this thread alive).
In your experience (I'm sure you've had to hire people--or have been close to someone who has) does it REALLY matter where you get your degree from? Especially if I'm going the CFA route rather than grad school?
I've planned to go to SJSU because I know they have a very good business program, but may take the opportunity to move to San Francisco. In which case, it won't be "as good" a business program as SJSU.
But would I really be missing out on THAT much... say from an employment standpoint. Does the school name matter that much? I really don't want to leave the bay area, and don't think I qualify for Berkeley
In your experience (I'm sure you've had to hire people--or have been close to someone who has) does it REALLY matter where you get your degree from? Especially if I'm going the CFA route rather than grad school?
I've planned to go to SJSU because I know they have a very good business program, but may take the opportunity to move to San Francisco. In which case, it won't be "as good" a business program as SJSU.
But would I really be missing out on THAT much... say from an employment standpoint. Does the school name matter that much? I really don't want to leave the bay area, and don't think I qualify for Berkeley
It depends, but generally, yes. Attending a top ranked school will get you in the industry quicker, and having the charter is only meaningful after passing all 3 exams and fulfilling the work requirement; therefore, it's in your best interest to get into the best school possible to get a head start. The real value of the CFA charter is its usefulness in the investment management field, so if you'd like to pursue other career paths in finance, such as i-banking, M&A, PE, corporate finance, then I think an MBA would be a better alternative to the CFA since it covers a broader spectrum. Additionally, (assuming you have limited experience), those jobs are easier to access via on-campus recruiting (critical part of landing those jobs), as opposed to the CFAI job boards. This is purely subjective, but I don't feel the CFAI is quite up to par in that respect when compared to top business schools yet, but it's also 25X cheaper. Lots to consider....
Now, looking further into the crystal ball, if you are already working in the investment management field, then I think the CFA is just as valuable as a top tier MBA, BUT only after you've had the necessary work experience to nullify academic credentials. It's becoming fairly standard in the investment management world to require at least passing the level 1 exam, and there are even times where some shops require both to become a full analyst, so the only certainty I can pass onto you if you choose either the CFA or the MBA, is that you will be staring at textbooks for a long time.
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Yeah, I figure I'll be studying for the next 5-6 years. So say 3 years after I get my Bachelor's.
My mind is spinning! I would LOVE to do M&A, PE, corporate finance... but I also know I a) can't afford a GOOD graduate degree from a top tier, and b) haven't placed myself properly (avg. gpa is only 3.3) to get in to a top tier undergrad degree.
Also, I don't want my MBA.. I want a Masters in Finance (MFE).
Doing some research... I think I may need to set the bar a lot higher and attempt Haas for my MFE.. sigh.
Also, I think I will have to double major in some sort of math if I go for an MFE as the prereq's are insane.
This is the route I'd take if I don't do the CFA (which judging by what you said, Chris, I shouldn't)
My mind is spinning! I would LOVE to do M&A, PE, corporate finance... but I also know I a) can't afford a GOOD graduate degree from a top tier, and b) haven't placed myself properly (avg. gpa is only 3.3) to get in to a top tier undergrad degree.
Also, I don't want my MBA.. I want a Masters in Finance (MFE).
Doing some research... I think I may need to set the bar a lot higher and attempt Haas for my MFE.. sigh.
Also, I think I will have to double major in some sort of math if I go for an MFE as the prereq's are insane.
This is the route I'd take if I don't do the CFA (which judging by what you said, Chris, I shouldn't)
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MFE in Finance and the CFA overlap quite a bit, so it sounds like overkill to me in one concentration. A lot of information has been thrown your direction, so my apologies if this is confusing more than it is providing clarity. I think the best approach is to focus on what you can do now, which is to try to get into the best school you can get into, then load up on finance and accounting courses. You can take a CFA after you graduate and decide whether you really want to pursue it or not at that time, don't worry too much about the jobs right now.