Right here. I'll chime in a couple points.
1) JMC is 100% correct. People were sold on the SS and Medicare system long ago. They gov. told them, in essence, we're going to raise your taxes, so you will have less money.. but in return, we will take care of you when your older. Well, they didn't count on WWII vets coming home hornier than a three-balled tomcat and making all these babies. You know what they say about hindsight. Honestly though, SS and medicare was the gov. excuse to raise taxes without causing such a ruckus. People, at first, were willing to pay more in return for security.
2) "think medicare is ridiculous too, but instead of reducing benefits the system needs to work to drive down the cost of medical care. sure, cutting edge technologies will always be expensive, but the cost of care in the US is greater than any other country by quite a large margin. medications are far cheaper in other countries, and people need to start shopping around to avoid price gouging. I mean, would you buy a car without shopping around for the best price? why pay out the a$$ for prescriptions? In Britain, they run on standardized health care for everyone. dunno about the rest of the world. but i agree that medicare is a crock, sucks for me because now retirees are receiving benefits proportionally larger than what they paid in, while i'll get back less than my total input."
Sooo misinformed. There are several reasons why medical care is expensive. First, we take care of EVERYBODY. If some sh*tbag is shot during a drug deal, he will incure a hospital bill that is well over 100K....WELL OVER. Who pays for that? The hospital, in order to keep its doors open, must shift that cost to customers that pay. That is why a bag of IV fluid cost 50-100 bucks. Honest, hardworking people's money is paying for those that WON'T pay. Notice I used WONT, b/c I have treated many "indigent" people who for some odd reason can afford cell phones, gold teeth, designer clothes... but can't afford health insurance. Don't even think about starting in with "well, they work crappy jobs that don't offer insurance". Many HONEST, RESPONSABLE people will work 2 jobs or take one crappy one (that has insurance) so their family will be insured. For example, my brother worked 2 friggin jobs.. one just b/c it offered insurance. So, it can be done... but its not as much fun as going to cluuuub and gettin your groove/dance/drink on. People bitch about the cost of perscriptions but have NO IDEA of money spent on research on development of said drugs. I just got my IRD approval from the FDA (Investigational Drug Researcher) and in order to get that I had to submit a complete protocol for monitoring the patients, drug levels, etc (this includes expensive lab test) all so the patients will be safe. Guess who pays for that? The drug companies. Then, there are multiple other trials that must take place before the drug is approved... MILLIONS OF DOLLARS ARE SPENT so patients will be safe, the drug will work as it should and consequently reduce the chance of a lawsuit. You can not compare England to the U.S... its apples and oranges. Everyone thinks the Brittish and Canadian systems are great... think again. In England, you WILL be denied access to procedures and life saving healthcare based on age. Its a cost-benefit calculation. For example, if you are over the age of 65, you will not have access to hemodialysis (treatment for kidney failure). The English, unlike the Americans, realize that you get old and you die. Americans go through EXTRODINARY measures to keep themselves and famliy memebers alive waaaaay to long. Again, who picks up the tap... we do (the hospital and taxpayers). Canada and other countries with socialized medicine have cheaper persciptions...true. BUT, they don't have the same drugs as those available in the U.S. For example, there are medications for high blood pressure and congestive heart failure that block the Beta Receptors in the body (Beta Blockers). Well, not all Beta Blockers are created equal. Atenolol has been shown to significantly improve survival. But, its newer and expensive (again.. R&D). However, metoprolol is the generic version of this drug. It is in the same class but doesn't work as well. Those is socialized contries would have access only to metroprolol... not Atenolol. Why..b/c their governements are not going to foot the bill for the drug. They will go for a cheaper substitute.
3) All in all, there are multiple factors to consider. Americans want to take care of everyone...even those that abuse the system i.e. the IV drug user that destroyed his kidneys, and now get dialysis (at 1000 bucks a pop) and STILL uses IV drugs....even though they through off his electrolytes and cause him to be hospitalized. Not to mention the operations for dialysis access...which I do. Other countries would let them die. We refuse to let people die with dignity and lastly, we file frivilous lawsuits.... all of these drive up the cost of health care.
You can't have your cake and eat it too. Americans can continure to have the cadilac healthcare, but pay pinto prices.

 

Malpractice insurance rates are ridiculous for doctors now and increasing every year. My mom works for a fairly large orthopedic surgeon's practice and you wouldn't believe what these guys are paying for malpractice insurance every year and how much it is increasing just this year. Tenblade made many good points and there are tradeoffs for everything. We can't have our current health care system for the prices Canada and GB have.

 

We get penalised over here tax-wise if we earn over a certain amount and don't have health insurance. From memory I think it's an extra 1% levy. Not such a bad idea I guess.

 

[QUOTE]Originally posted by soul_fly

 

I personally plan to save enough $ to retire on my own $. What is the average Social Security benefit per month right now? $1200 (tax free though)..... what the hell kind of living is that? that would pay for some tracktime, but not even tires...


I just think it is funny (not that kind of funny) that every old person is bitching about their FREE gov't benefit. Did the Gov't promise people they could live comfortably? (obviously $1200 per month is not comfortably unless you live in a shoe).

Something needs to be done to stop the bleeding.....

Part of the problem also is how people hide their relatives $ so that Medicare picks up the Nursing Home tab. There is a 3 year lookback period, so everyone apparently starts hiding shit early then hope the folks can either pay their way for 3 years or don't get sick enough to get into the nursing home....... after 3 years, the $ is gone and the Gov't pays.... They should make the lookback something like 10 years.

 

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Scot
I personally plan to save enough $ to retire on my own $.

 

JMC,
I agree with you. As I stated, these people were sold on SS and Medicare b/c they were told that the gov would take care of them. Like your Grandfather, my grandparents worked into their 70's and they still struggle. Overall, most of these people are hardworking, honest citizens that are getting the shaft.
Scot, if you want to target burdens to public dole, look at the Welfare system. Why is it that we have to pay for women to have children out of wedlock. I am not talking about one, but MULTIPLE kids. Mother, Father, Husband, and Wife have been replaced with "my babby's momma" or "my babby's daddy". Welfare is a failed bit. We, honest hardworking, PRODUCTIVE citizens have to pay for the mistakes of others over and over again. With that said, I am not opposed to Welfare all together, but it needs to be changed. It is supposed to be a band-aid, not a way of life.

 

JMC - I know people pay into SS & Medicare, but it was only 7.65% of their earnings (was it always 7.65% or did it change at some point?)......so maybe someone who just turned 65 paid in $50k (i do realize there is some appreciation of the $50k with interest) over their lifetime.... so they get $1200 per month for 15 years....... so they take back out $216k I know lots of people worked hard, but didn't anyone think to save some of their own $? Maybe the Gov't did a great snow job on the people and they fell for it.? Were people really that gullable?


Ten - yes there are a zillion places to look for wasted $ that the gov't spends....... Welfare, Assisted Housing, even just general contractors for the government are notorious for ripping them off (remember the old $400 hammer and $500 toilet seat stories)......

I personally would feel like a burden if I were waiting for my semi-free handouts (which in SS and Medicare are not technically FREE), and then bitching about it when the world could not afford to keep me medicated with the best prescriptions and lodge me in the best care facility.

 

Scot--Ok, I guess I can see where you're going. I don't have an answer as to why people bought into SS. Perhaps someone else will have some insight into this. Also don't know what the past % were. I do know that sometimes the benefits are subject to income tax.

I agree 100% with you about paying my own way and that of my family.

Gov't waste--sometimes I think it's hopeless.

 

I am so thankful I live in a country where health care extends to all members of the population and not just those who can afford it.

I think there's something wrong with us as a society when we can't (or won't) extend the offer of medical care to those who are in need.