The facts and the figures do not bear this as true.

I am a self employed small business owner so yes, I do find (legal) ways to reduce my taxable income and tax burden. Yet, the so called "rich" still pay far more than their fair share. That type of statement shows complete ignorance.

If you want to know the truth, ask someone like me that experiences this every day. As mentioned above, trickle down economics does work. The lower classes benefit from the so called wealthy. But, remember your quote, "life's not fair".

I started my adult life at 17 with NOTHING. Since then, I have worked my ass of to become (based on the ridiculous standards) wealthy. Believe me, I do better than most. But, I am no where near rich.

I get tired of justifying to leftist elitists like you that will never understand real life. You live in fear with hatred of everything.

Again, I ask...Why do you hate the United States so much?

 

"I never knew how poor I was until I made a little money."

That is more true today than ever for me.

On politics...if you think either candidate is not beholding to interests other than the American people you need to wake the hell up. For me the presidency is a bottom line business. I got a .0001 percent tax cut, people making over 120k got a 3 percent tax cut, high tech jobs dried up like raisins in the sun, debt and deficit spending are AGAIN out of control under Republican spending (no it is the BOTTOM line, I don't give a shiite why). Time for a democratic president.

Anyone believing that "trickle down" economics work you are way off. The economy is driving by the middle and the way this economy is going there will be slightly bigger upper, a smaller middle and a huge ass increase in the lower. Not everyone can be a manager, not everyone can start a small business, not everyone can be involved in good paying professions, no decent paying jobs for the middle = smaller middle. You cannot possibly believe that in 20 years there will be decent paying jobs for those without highly specialized skills. Highly specialized skills = huge commitment and luck. Pick the wrong place to put those skills are you are corporate road kill.


I am not sure if it was right or wrong to invade Iraq. I can tell you 2 things I knew for sure and stated the day the U.S. invaded.

1) Iraq itself was little or no threat to the U.S. because Saddam was all about Saddam and he was very secular. Fundamentalists hated him and everything he stood for. Is the world a better a place without Saddam in power? Of course, that is not debatable (and the only thing Bush says on it, again and again). But is the U.S. safer without Saddam in power, that is very debatable. I guess we are for now as the terrorist are content to kill anyone they can get their hands on or bombs on. The problem is that without long term international support, the fundamentalists in Iraq could easily fester into a biggest terrorist factory the world has ever known.

2) The people of Iraq will never love the U.S. We have different cultures and that cuts both ways. They have jealousy over our apparent wealth, not everyone in the U.S. is Bill Gates BTW. So many of the masses are not educated, I am not sure there is a way to reach them. Of course the Kurds love the U.S. for the most part and I figured that out 3 years ago as well. I am not sure why we don't split N. Iraq into it's own state. The best way to make Iraq a real ally, would be to use oil sale profits to educate it people, but that will take about 20 years. I am sure the Germans and Japanese hated Americans with a passion after the war too. I am too young to remember, but a long term international commitment worked. The biggest difference is that the people of Germany and Japan where already educated and obviously very industrious.

 

The people of Iraq will never like us?? Wathcing to much CNN? liberal media?

Talk to my brother, and other soldiers about serving in Iraq. You know what they tell you? They said the Iraqi people really appreciate their help and glad America is there. Remember these people lived in fear and had no freedom. We are rebuilding a nation, it will be hard like germany Japan.

If the media actually reported what was going on they would show all the construction, new hopitals, and schools, free elections!! You guys really need to see some pictures these guys bring home.

Also I think Kerry said he supported Iraq than said he didnt and now says he does and doesn't I think?

You really need to look at other sources. I'm sure theres a military base near you. Talk to some of the soliders about their experiance. You'll come up with a diff view.

 

[QUOTE=SilverKnight,Oct 1 2004, 09:42 PM] The people of Iraq will

 

Do you honestly think the tech boom of the nineties was from policies of the nineties? Most economic indicators including jobs are lagging indicators. This means that policies implemented today have the greatest impact several years down the road.

Many people put way to much credit with a President on the performance of the economy. The single largest factor in any economy is people. The tech boom of the nineties happened because of emerging technologies that spawned huge growth through innovation. But, for this to happen, there must be a solid business climate were businesses are not over taxed and over regulated.

You are right. The need for highly skilled workers will continue to out grow farming, labor, and other lower paying jobs. Look at our history. It is cyclical. We have fewer farming and manufacturing jobs now than 20 years ago because we are more productive. This means that each generation will continue to evolve with jobs. I hate to tell you. But, the fact that we have fewer farming and manufacturing jobs is a good thing. It means our economy is continuing to evolve. Hell, Americans don't want to do those jobs anyway. So, I completely disagree with your assumption about the classes. Don't forget, the lower earners pay NO income taxes. I have an employee that makes $42000.00 a year and he got earned income credits!!! This is nothing more than a redistribution of wealth.

Luck has little to do with success for the vast majority. Work ethic and commitment mean far far more. Trickle down economics has been proven time and time again to work. Why do you think Reagan was the most popular president in modern history winning 49 states in his second election?

Anyone that thinks the downturn of the economy in 2000-2002 was Bush's fault is completely blind. Besides, it was an incredibly short recession.

 

Good point.

We obviously disagree on a lot. But, at least you make sense and use logic in your argument. (Unlike others)

Hopefully you will take my comments above as constructive.

 

yes wheres honda606

round 2!!

 

Thanks for your constructive comments....now back to honda606 bashing

 

First, on taxes. You are NOT BEING TRUTHFUL.

Tell me what tax bracket you are in. NONE of them got a .0001% cut, none of them. In fact, the amount cut REDUCES the more money you make; the highest bracket was cut 1% (or 3% lower in amount paid) and the lowest 5% (or 33% lower in amount paid...although this bracket rarely pays anything). Next time you decide to make up a tax statistic, do some real research rather than finding your numbers in your bathroom

Perhaps you paid .0001% less because you had fewer deductions or your income went up from last year. It certainly was NOT a result of government policy.

Also, if you think the tech boom dried up due to Bush, you know next to nothing. These companies dried up because they were financed by suckers and ran out of money (and the suckers didn't put up more). Bush's policies are very business-friendly, and if anything, his policies kept the multitudes of "shell companies" around longer. The employment boom was due to these "shell companies" and a big part of Bush's record is blamed on them dying out...which is totally unfair.

Also, deficit spending in REAL (inflation adjusted) dollars is no where near a record. Above average, yes, but we are in a war.

Also, saddam was not secular or isolationalist. He tried to kill a US president and continuously financed terrorism. He paid thousands to blow themselves up in Israel and he attacked his own people numerous times with WMDs! Where are they now? Syria, a member of the UN security council (that gives them immunity).