Mugen Type S Pads or Spoon Pads - Need Advice
12-03-2018, 08:52 PM
#21
Thread Starter
No resurfacing of rotors needed for the new pads...?
12-04-2018, 08:27 AM
#22
Semi metallic pads usually don't need a fresh surface to be effective. They work on abrasion for friction. Hence the higher rotor wear.
Organics and Ceramics count on a transfer layer. Which is why you really should mate them to a fresh (or resurfaced) rotor.
Organics and Ceramics count on a transfer layer. Which is why you really should mate them to a fresh (or resurfaced) rotor.
12-04-2018, 08:48 PM
#23
Thread Starter
309's are still en route to me... the wait is... not really killing me but I need them soon!
One day I will perhaps get the mighty Spoon blue mono calipers or...Endless
P.S. I see Stoptech offering low priced stainless brake lines. I'm tempted just for the front. Your thoughts?
12-05-2018, 05:37 AM
#24
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You taught me something new, cheers m8.
309's are still en route to me... the wait is... not really killing me but I need them soon!
One day I will perhaps get the mighty Spoon blue mono calipers or...Endless
P.S. I see Stoptech offering low priced stainless brake lines. I'm tempted just for the front. Your thoughts?
309's are still en route to me... the wait is... not really killing me but I need them soon!
One day I will perhaps get the mighty Spoon blue mono calipers or...Endless
P.S. I see Stoptech offering low priced stainless brake lines. I'm tempted just for the front. Your thoughts?
12-05-2018, 07:24 AM
#25
As long as the stoptech lines have some sort of guv'ment public road certification (DOT or TUV, for example) and a teflon jacket, I'd say go for it.
If they don't, I'd say pass on it.
I have been using Russell lines for a while without any signs of wear or problems. Its good for pads that throw sparks at the lines...and also a good insurance against bursting from heat/pressures seen from track use.
The factory lines work fine too. Just inspect for wear from time to time.
If they don't, I'd say pass on it.
I have been using Russell lines for a while without any signs of wear or problems. Its good for pads that throw sparks at the lines...and also a good insurance against bursting from heat/pressures seen from track use.
The factory lines work fine too. Just inspect for wear from time to time.
12-05-2018, 09:08 PM
#26
Thread Starter
12-05-2018, 09:13 PM
#27
Thread Starter
As long as the stoptech lines have some sort of guv'ment public road certification (DOT or TUV, for example) and a teflon jacket, I'd say go for it.
If they don't, I'd say pass on it.
I have been using Russell lines for a while without any signs of wear or problems. Its good for pads that throw sparks at the lines...and also a good insurance against bursting from heat/pressures seen from track use.
The factory lines work fine too. Just inspect for wear from time to time.
If they don't, I'd say pass on it.
I have been using Russell lines for a while without any signs of wear or problems. Its good for pads that throw sparks at the lines...and also a good insurance against bursting from heat/pressures seen from track use.
The factory lines work fine too. Just inspect for wear from time to time.
I may go stainless later on down the road. As you said the factory rubber lines work well too but need to be inspected from time to time especially if they see track time.
Does high temp/performance brake fluid like Endless, Project Mu G Four 335 (which apparently changes colour from green to clear when its time to change the fluid) or ATE super blue really make a significant difference to pedal feel, outright braking performance or is it more of a safety net giving you confidence that your fluid isn't gonna boil on track? https://www.project-mu.co.jp/en/prod...her_fluid.html
12-06-2018, 02:47 PM
#28
High temp fluid is key for repeated hard braking events. The fluid needs to stay in liquid state to remain uncompressible.
If it changes to a gas (boils), your pedal will travel more than you want.
Old brake fluid soaks up water. It will boil faster.
You don't need high temp fluid for street use. Some people may disagree. But you should consider the fact that I am right and they are wrong.
As long as the fluid is a clean liquid of the proper viscosity, the pedal will feel the same whether you're using the expensive stuff or normal DOT3 that came with the car.
That being said....
Flush your fluid every year or two to prevent rust from building up inside braking system and ruining it.
Be mindful not to push the pedal past its "nornal working range" when you flush it, if it hasn't been done regularly for the car's life.
DOT4 needs to be changed more frequently than DOT3, as it absorbs more of that tasty, tasty water.
If it changes to a gas (boils), your pedal will travel more than you want.
Old brake fluid soaks up water. It will boil faster.
You don't need high temp fluid for street use. Some people may disagree. But you should consider the fact that I am right and they are wrong.
As long as the fluid is a clean liquid of the proper viscosity, the pedal will feel the same whether you're using the expensive stuff or normal DOT3 that came with the car.
That being said....
Flush your fluid every year or two to prevent rust from building up inside braking system and ruining it.
Be mindful not to push the pedal past its "nornal working range" when you flush it, if it hasn't been done regularly for the car's life.
DOT4 needs to be changed more frequently than DOT3, as it absorbs more of that tasty, tasty water.
12-06-2018, 09:59 PM
#29
Thread Starter
High temp fluid is key for repeated hard braking events. The fluid needs to stay in liquid state to remain uncompressible.
But you should consider the fact that I am right and they are wrong.
As long as the fluid is a clean liquid of the proper viscosity, the pedal will feel the same whether you're using the expensive stuff or normal DOT3 that came with the car.
That being said....
Flush your fluid every year or two to prevent rust from building up inside braking system and ruining it.
Be mindful not to push the pedal past its "nornal working range" when you flush it, if it hasn't been done regularly for the car's life.
DOT4 needs to be changed more frequently than DOT3, as it absorbs more of that tasty, tasty water.
But you should consider the fact that I am right and they are wrong.
As long as the fluid is a clean liquid of the proper viscosity, the pedal will feel the same whether you're using the expensive stuff or normal DOT3 that came with the car.
That being said....
Flush your fluid every year or two to prevent rust from building up inside braking system and ruining it.
Be mindful not to push the pedal past its "nornal working range" when you flush it, if it hasn't been done regularly for the car's life.
DOT4 needs to be changed more frequently than DOT3, as it absorbs more of that tasty, tasty water.
I have a clear understanding of what happens to cause the fluid to boil now, thanks. Honda dealer changed my brake fluid not too long ago, probably less than 2 years and when I look at the master cylinder it still looks clear. Clutch reservoir however, not so clear. I need to give that attention soon. I can only assume that the dealer used straight up 'normal' DOT3, or maybe 4 fluid but nothing in the way of high temp fluid. If I'm realistic I will say that Motul RBF600 is what I'll be buying since the Mu and Endless fluids need to be imported anyway...
So do you advocate pumping the pedal to flush the fluid out over gravity bleeding? Would a litre of fluid be sufficient too flush out the old fluid through all 4 brake lines and get the master cylinder up to the full line?
12-07-2018, 07:12 AM
#30
1 man method with pushing fluid via the pedal has always worked for me. Its fast and easy.
Gravity method works well too. I use it when I have time to let one axle drip while I move on to some other task.
As long as you're performing either method correctly, you'll get the same result.
I would remove the dirty fluid from the reservoir via vacuum pump or turkey baster first. Then refill before starting. That way you're not wasting new fluid by trying to push the old reservoir fluid out.
1L works just fine. Buy an extra 0.5L bottle if you're not sure. If you're new at it, you will use more fluid to get it thoroughly exchanged.
Once opened, just use the whole bottle. Once the seal is broken, moisture will slowly degrade the fluid while it sits on a shelf.
I've used ATE with good results with track use. Also Castrol GT-LMA. And Valvoline Dot4 synthetic when I was in a pinch and needed a "department store" available fluid while at the track already.
Motul certainly works. I've never out-paced ATE...so...never tried Motul.
Gravity method works well too. I use it when I have time to let one axle drip while I move on to some other task.
As long as you're performing either method correctly, you'll get the same result.
I would remove the dirty fluid from the reservoir via vacuum pump or turkey baster first. Then refill before starting. That way you're not wasting new fluid by trying to push the old reservoir fluid out.
1L works just fine. Buy an extra 0.5L bottle if you're not sure. If you're new at it, you will use more fluid to get it thoroughly exchanged.
Once opened, just use the whole bottle. Once the seal is broken, moisture will slowly degrade the fluid while it sits on a shelf.
I've used ATE with good results with track use. Also Castrol GT-LMA. And Valvoline Dot4 synthetic when I was in a pinch and needed a "department store" available fluid while at the track already.
Motul certainly works. I've never out-paced ATE...so...never tried Motul.