Going FI, need some advice
Thread Starter
Joined: Apr 2006
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From: Clifton, NJ
Going FI, need some advice
Hey guys 
MY07 here, and I'm looking for a 300whp set up.
On the topic of engine management, I will be using a Greddy EManage (already installed on my car). Since my car is DBW, options are limited. Namely, using AEM would cause my VSA and Cruise Control to be disabled, and unable to pass emissions. In addition, I'm not looking to perfectly tweak my car, just want around 300whp.
Why 300whp? Because that is all I need. I feel that my car is decently quick with a relatively simple NA setup (t1r70 with test pipe, K&N FIPK, and j's header). However, I just need a little more 'oomph' and I think FI will be the best way to get there. Also, I don't want change my headgasket.
What else, besides 300whp, do I want form this kit? It has to be reliable, daily drivable, and trackable. I haven't been to the track yet, but the last thing I need to worry about is overheating when I'm trying to learn how to drive by car on the track.
So the question is, how can I achieve this?
Through my own research, I've come to two options:
1) Greddy Turbo
Pros:
Reasonable price
Gets me to the power I want
Full boost at 3k
Cons:
No real upgrade path (but i don't want more than 300whp)
People don't agree with drain bolt solution vs. tapping oil pan) (I'd go with latter)
Problem with SS manifolds (I'd be getting a new kit with the improved cast manifold)
2) Kraftwerks S/C
Pros:
Gets me the power I want
Linear power
Seemingly more trackable (can someone confirm)
Cons:
More expensive than Greddy (but at the end of the day, I'm willing to spend $ for the better option)
No real change in mid-range torque (compared to turbo)
I've studied dyno plots of both kids, and it seems the Greddy has so much more torque down low. The supercharger's linearity is appealing at the time though. The supercharger comes with an oil cooler, greddy doesn't. If I want to track, do I need to spring for Greddy's oil cooler?
What do you guys recommend?
P.S. I realize 300 whp might not much to a lot of you, but this is all I want, so please don't respond by suggesting that I go for some 400whp kit.
P.S. #2 - I have a 4.57 reinforced diff, ACT HD pressure plate, flywheel, and new OEM clutch either sitting in my house or on the way to my house for my FI set up
P.S. #3 --
Are there are other kits you guys recommend that might be 'higher quality' than Greddy? Again, I'm looking for 300whp and no more than 350, with very good midrange power.
MY07 here, and I'm looking for a 300whp set up.
On the topic of engine management, I will be using a Greddy EManage (already installed on my car). Since my car is DBW, options are limited. Namely, using AEM would cause my VSA and Cruise Control to be disabled, and unable to pass emissions. In addition, I'm not looking to perfectly tweak my car, just want around 300whp.
Why 300whp? Because that is all I need. I feel that my car is decently quick with a relatively simple NA setup (t1r70 with test pipe, K&N FIPK, and j's header). However, I just need a little more 'oomph' and I think FI will be the best way to get there. Also, I don't want change my headgasket.
What else, besides 300whp, do I want form this kit? It has to be reliable, daily drivable, and trackable. I haven't been to the track yet, but the last thing I need to worry about is overheating when I'm trying to learn how to drive by car on the track.
So the question is, how can I achieve this?
Through my own research, I've come to two options:
1) Greddy Turbo
Pros:
Reasonable price
Gets me to the power I want
Full boost at 3k
Cons:
No real upgrade path (but i don't want more than 300whp)
People don't agree with drain bolt solution vs. tapping oil pan) (I'd go with latter)
Problem with SS manifolds (I'd be getting a new kit with the improved cast manifold)
2) Kraftwerks S/C
Pros:
Gets me the power I want
Linear power
Seemingly more trackable (can someone confirm)
Cons:
More expensive than Greddy (but at the end of the day, I'm willing to spend $ for the better option)
No real change in mid-range torque (compared to turbo)
I've studied dyno plots of both kids, and it seems the Greddy has so much more torque down low. The supercharger's linearity is appealing at the time though. The supercharger comes with an oil cooler, greddy doesn't. If I want to track, do I need to spring for Greddy's oil cooler?
What do you guys recommend?
P.S. I realize 300 whp might not much to a lot of you, but this is all I want, so please don't respond by suggesting that I go for some 400whp kit.
P.S. #2 - I have a 4.57 reinforced diff, ACT HD pressure plate, flywheel, and new OEM clutch either sitting in my house or on the way to my house for my FI set up
P.S. #3 --
Are there are other kits you guys recommend that might be 'higher quality' than Greddy? Again, I'm looking for 300whp and no more than 350, with very good midrange power.
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 10,301
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From: New Jersey
Well neither kits are "track proven" at this point so anything is just speculation.
For your cons for the greddy, you pretty much negated any of them. You'll be getting the cast manifold, tap the pan, and don't want anything more then ~300rwhp.
The cons for the kraftwerks is nothing you can change (if will never make as much midrange power) but price shouldn't be a con assuming its what you want.
From what I've seen here, aftermarket oil coolers are a weak spot in the relability of the engine. They might lower your temps by ~15 degrees or so but you risk a line failing. The least amount of oil lines outside the engine the better no matter if its a SC or a turbo.
What I'm saying is, it really comes down to your educated decision on the matter of what YOU want given your situtations. I only believe in giving facts as my own personal bias means nothing to you as its your decision not mine
For your cons for the greddy, you pretty much negated any of them. You'll be getting the cast manifold, tap the pan, and don't want anything more then ~300rwhp.
The cons for the kraftwerks is nothing you can change (if will never make as much midrange power) but price shouldn't be a con assuming its what you want.
From what I've seen here, aftermarket oil coolers are a weak spot in the relability of the engine. They might lower your temps by ~15 degrees or so but you risk a line failing. The least amount of oil lines outside the engine the better no matter if its a SC or a turbo.
What I'm saying is, it really comes down to your educated decision on the matter of what YOU want given your situtations. I only believe in giving facts as my own personal bias means nothing to you as its your decision not mine
Thread Starter
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 7,852
Likes: 0
From: Clifton, NJ
Originally Posted by Spec_Ops2087,Feb 11 2008, 12:56 AM
Well neither kits are "track proven" at this point so anything is just speculation.
For your cons for the greddy, you pretty much negated any of them. You'll be getting the cast manifold, tap the pan, and don't want anything more then ~300rwhp.
The cons for the kraftwerks is nothing you can change (if will never make as much midrange power) but price shouldn't be a con assuming its what you want.
From what I've seen here, aftermarket oil coolers are a weak spot in the relability of the engine. They might lower your temps by ~15 degrees or so but you risk a line failing. The least amount of oil lines outside the engine the better no matter if its a SC or a turbo.
What I'm saying is, it really comes down to your educated decision on the matter of what YOU want given your situtations. I only believe in giving facts as my own personal bias means nothing to you as its your decision not mine
For your cons for the greddy, you pretty much negated any of them. You'll be getting the cast manifold, tap the pan, and don't want anything more then ~300rwhp.
The cons for the kraftwerks is nothing you can change (if will never make as much midrange power) but price shouldn't be a con assuming its what you want.
From what I've seen here, aftermarket oil coolers are a weak spot in the relability of the engine. They might lower your temps by ~15 degrees or so but you risk a line failing. The least amount of oil lines outside the engine the better no matter if its a SC or a turbo.
What I'm saying is, it really comes down to your educated decision on the matter of what YOU want given your situtations. I only believe in giving facts as my own personal bias means nothing to you as its your decision not mine
Are any FI kits 'track proven'?
Thread Starter
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 7,852
Likes: 0
From: Clifton, NJ
Originally Posted by ATOice,Feb 11 2008, 10:04 AM
Used S/C, call it a day...it's cheaper and only when you want to run to 9K is the boost. you can go with minimal boost, 7 psi. But no torque down low, and always upgradeable later.
at the end of the day, price isn't really the determining factor, and since my car is relatively new, I'd rather stick with a new s/c kit..
thanks for the advice!
Thread Starter
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 7,852
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From: Clifton, NJ
Originally Posted by afwfjustin,Feb 11 2008, 09:56 AM
The centrifugal chargers are pretty track reliable - but they don't have the balls that your options will give you.
in the worst case scenario, my brother has an AP1 I could track (what kind of 'worst' scenario is this?
)
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 4,131
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From: New Jersey
Originally Posted by devs2k,Feb 11 2008, 10:10 AM
i hear you..
in the worst case scenario, my brother has an AP1 I could track (what kind of 'worst' scenario is this? )
in the worst case scenario, my brother has an AP1 I could track (what kind of 'worst' scenario is this?
) We'll talk on Wednesday
Marcus
Former Moderator
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 3,677
Likes: 1
From: Mesa
Just a couple other pros/cons
The Kraftwerks kit can include a reflash of your 07 ECM - should retain absolute OEM drivability. But is it cost effective.
You already have the eManage - so the one with the Greddy kit can be whored out for about $500 with the PnP harness (further reducing the kit price/iinvestment). Flip side - you could take one for the team and use your ULT on the KW kit and then help others with info when they buy the u-tune-it kits.
If I were looking at the KW kit I would probably go Vortech since it has a proven track record and is a bit less expensive.
The Kraftwerks kit can include a reflash of your 07 ECM - should retain absolute OEM drivability. But is it cost effective.
You already have the eManage - so the one with the Greddy kit can be whored out for about $500 with the PnP harness (further reducing the kit price/iinvestment). Flip side - you could take one for the team and use your ULT on the KW kit and then help others with info when they buy the u-tune-it kits.
If I were looking at the KW kit I would probably go Vortech since it has a proven track record and is a bit less expensive.