S2000 Forced Induction S2000 Turbocharging and S2000 supercharging, for that extra kick.

Reliable low-boost SC?

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Old Oct 5, 2016 | 10:56 AM
  #11  
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Originally Posted by VitaRenovatio
I'd like to compete in NASA TT4 next year, with a WT/PWR limit of 12:1. I'm expecting a race weight of 2700 lbs with driver, so that allows me 225 average HP, or probably closer to 235 WHP. I have an 2003 F20C, and I'm putting down around 190 WHP (at Salt Lake City elevation of 4500 ft). That means I can have 45 more WHP and still be legal. I'm thinking the cheapest and most reliable way to do that is with a supercharger. I was wondering if anyone had any suggestions for a low-boost (3-4 PSI) supercharger that can take track abuse all day long?

Thanks in advance!
You have the right idea in going forced induction, but what you really want is a turbo. With a proper turbo setup you can make low boost up top and tons of boost in the midrange. Talk to Chi Ho and Ian Stewart about it as that is what they did in TTC one year.
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Old Oct 5, 2016 | 11:20 AM
  #12  
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Originally Posted by s2000Junky
Originally Posted by michaelnyden' timestamp='1475691981' post='24077461
get a 6 psi SC kit and add a restrictor plate or vent some of the boost to atmosphere. Honestly though, it might be better to just max our your NA endeavors first.
This is not a common set up, the OP would be virtually on his own to construct the system to employ this approach and IF he was successful at it, the power band would be really thin, plus the added weight would negate a sizable portion of the gains made along with the detriment to the handling and breaking of the car which is just as important on the track as power. With a standard base 6psi supercharger kit, the system starts to produce positive pressure ( 1psi) at about 4000rpm and progressively doubles that pressure every 2k rpm or so, until it reaches 6psi at redline, so with a base kit there is little power produced bellow normal vtec range (ie 10whp 6trq) until about 6k rpm, at which point you are starting the need to cap it off to not exceed 235whp because the kit if left alone would make close to 300whp in that upper range, all wile adding 80lb to the car to carry throughout. Its an extremely inefficient way to go about adding 30-40whp and wont be cheap I might add. Basically what I'm saying is it will have much the same power curve as a bolt on NA car but add 80lb.
I was more advocating for a roots/positive displacement supercharger and restrictor plate if he goes above a certain power level (but realized I used the word kit, there aren't any kits out there right now), it's custom. Most supercharger kits are in the 50-60 lb range, not 80 lbs to be honest.
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Old Oct 5, 2016 | 11:28 AM
  #13  
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Originally Posted by michaelnyden
Originally Posted by s2000Junky' timestamp='1475693026' post='24077478
[quote name='michaelnyden' timestamp='1475691981' post='24077461']
get a 6 psi SC kit and add a restrictor plate or vent some of the boost to atmosphere. Honestly though, it might be better to just max our your NA endeavors first.
This is not a common set up, the OP would be virtually on his own to construct the system to employ this approach and IF he was successful at it, the power band would be really thin, plus the added weight would negate a sizable portion of the gains made along with the detriment to the handling and breaking of the car which is just as important on the track as power. With a standard base 6psi supercharger kit, the system starts to produce positive pressure ( 1psi) at about 4000rpm and progressively doubles that pressure every 2k rpm or so, until it reaches 6psi at redline, so with a base kit there is little power produced bellow normal vtec range (ie 10whp 6trq) until about 6k rpm, at which point you are starting the need to cap it off to not exceed 235whp because the kit if left alone would make close to 300whp in that upper range, all wile adding 80lb to the car to carry throughout. Its an extremely inefficient way to go about adding 30-40whp and wont be cheap I might add. Basically what I'm saying is it will have much the same power curve as a bolt on NA car but add 80lb.
I was more advocating for a roots/positive displacement supercharger and restrictor plate if he goes above a certain power level (but realized I used the word kit, there aren't any kits out there right now), it's custom. Most supercharger kits are in the 50-60 lb range, not 80 lbs to be honest.
[/quote]

The standard aftercooled SOS, Comptech or Vortech centrifugal kits with proper up sized racing heat exchanger are closer to adding 80lb to the car I believe.
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Old Oct 5, 2016 | 11:42 AM
  #14  
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Originally Posted by s2000Junky
Originally Posted by michaelnyden' timestamp='1475695258' post='24077507
[quote name='s2000Junky' timestamp='1475693026' post='24077478']
[quote name='michaelnyden' timestamp='1475691981' post='24077461']
get a 6 psi SC kit and add a restrictor plate or vent some of the boost to atmosphere. Honestly though, it might be better to just max our your NA endeavors first.
This is not a common set up, the OP would be virtually on his own to construct the system to employ this approach and IF he was successful at it, the power band would be really thin, plus the added weight would negate a sizable portion of the gains made along with the detriment to the handling and breaking of the car which is just as important on the track as power. With a standard base 6psi supercharger kit, the system starts to produce positive pressure ( 1psi) at about 4000rpm and progressively doubles that pressure every 2k rpm or so, until it reaches 6psi at redline, so with a base kit there is little power produced bellow normal vtec range (ie 10whp 6trq) until about 6k rpm, at which point you are starting the need to cap it off to not exceed 235whp because the kit if left alone would make close to 300whp in that upper range, all wile adding 80lb to the car to carry throughout. Its an extremely inefficient way to go about adding 30-40whp and wont be cheap I might add. Basically what I'm saying is it will have much the same power curve as a bolt on NA car but add 80lb.
I was more advocating for a roots/positive displacement supercharger and restrictor plate if he goes above a certain power level (but realized I used the word kit, there aren't any kits out there right now), it's custom. Most supercharger kits are in the 50-60 lb range, not 80 lbs to be honest.
[/quote]

The standard aftercooled SOS, Comptech or Vortech centrifugal kits with proper up sized racing heat exchanger are closer to adding 80lb to the car I believe.
[/quote]

Might be but I can't say for sure, my intercooled Kraftwerks c38-91 kit was 70lbs shipping weight on the box and the scale, then minus all the boxes, some miscellaneous stuff and TONS of packaging material, ~60lbs all said and done.
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Old Oct 5, 2016 | 11:43 AM
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How much water is physically in the aftercooler system on those kits?
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Old Oct 5, 2016 | 11:57 AM
  #16  
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Originally Posted by michaelnyden
Originally Posted by s2000Junky' timestamp='1475695688' post='24077515
[quote name='michaelnyden' timestamp='1475695258' post='24077507']
[quote name='s2000Junky' timestamp='1475693026' post='24077478']
[quote name='michaelnyden' timestamp='1475691981' post='24077461']
get a 6 psi SC kit and add a restrictor plate or vent some of the boost to atmosphere. Honestly though, it might be better to just max our your NA endeavors first.
This is not a common set up, the OP would be virtually on his own to construct the system to employ this approach and IF he was successful at it, the power band would be really thin, plus the added weight would negate a sizable portion of the gains made along with the detriment to the handling and breaking of the car which is just as important on the track as power. With a standard base 6psi supercharger kit, the system starts to produce positive pressure ( 1psi) at about 4000rpm and progressively doubles that pressure every 2k rpm or so, until it reaches 6psi at redline, so with a base kit there is little power produced bellow normal vtec range (ie 10whp 6trq) until about 6k rpm, at which point you are starting the need to cap it off to not exceed 235whp because the kit if left alone would make close to 300whp in that upper range, all wile adding 80lb to the car to carry throughout. Its an extremely inefficient way to go about adding 30-40whp and wont be cheap I might add. Basically what I'm saying is it will have much the same power curve as a bolt on NA car but add 80lb.
I was more advocating for a roots/positive displacement supercharger and restrictor plate if he goes above a certain power level (but realized I used the word kit, there aren't any kits out there right now), it's custom. Most supercharger kits are in the 50-60 lb range, not 80 lbs to be honest.
[/quote]

The standard aftercooled SOS, Comptech or Vortech centrifugal kits with proper up sized racing heat exchanger are closer to adding 80lb to the car I believe.
[/quote]

Might be but I can't say for sure, my intercooled Kraftwerks c38-91 kit was 70lbs shipping weight on the box and the scale, then minus all the boxes, some miscellaneous stuff and TONS of packaging material, ~60lbs all said and done.
[/quote]

The rotrex blower is smaller then a Paxtron units, it also uses an fmic in that kit. If you filled your fmic up with water, and then added another half gal or so with the additional aftercooler/intake you have another 15-20lb safe to say.
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Old Oct 6, 2016 | 08:37 PM
  #17  
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Most people can fart more than 3psi.

I agree with junky.
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Old Oct 7, 2016 | 02:51 AM
  #18  
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I have 221bhp at the rear wheels (at 1100 feet ASL) with just buy-anywhere intake an exhaust. I'd think another 15 would be easy with custom work. Perhaps a Gernpipe exhaust? Not sure about 4500 feet ASL though.

-- Chuck
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Old Nov 19, 2016 | 07:25 PM
  #19  
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Originally Posted by s2000Junky
This is not a common set up, the OP would be virtually on his own to construct the system to employ this approach and IF he was successful at it, the power band would be really thin, plus the added weight would negate a sizable portion of the gains made along with the detriment to the handling and breaking of the car which is just as important on the track as power. With a standard base 6psi supercharger kit, the system starts to produce positive pressure ( 1psi) at about 4000rpm and progressively doubles that pressure every 2k rpm or so, until it reaches 6psi at redline, so with a base kit there is little power produced bellow normal vtec range (ie 10whp 6trq) until about 6k rpm, at which point you are starting the need to cap it off to not exceed 235whp because the kit if left alone would make close to 300whp in that upper range, all wile adding 80lb to the car to carry throughout. Its an extremely inefficient way to go about adding 30-40whp and wont be cheap I might add. Basically what I'm saying is it will have much the same power curve as a bolt on NA car but add 80lb.

Actually, this setup could potentially lead to a really nice powerband. Restrictor plates are fairly common in places that need the low end torque where limiting top end power. Using a wastegate on the charge piping isn't a bad option either. In either case, pulley it for more boost and limit it with either option.

Adding the extra weight to make this happen isn't all that big of a deal. He's hp/weight classed, so he can just increase the power for the added weight.


That said, I'm going turbo for NASA.

Originally Posted by Chuck S
I have 221bhp at the rear wheels (at 1100 feet ASL) with just buy-anywhere intake an exhaust. I'd think another 15 would be easy with custom work. Perhaps a Gernpipe exhaust? Not sure about 4500 feet ASL though.

-- Chuck
It's corrected DynoJet numbers; he has to work with what he's actually seeing on the dyno for classing.
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Old Nov 19, 2016 | 09:35 PM
  #20  
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k24 swap, with custom header and intake manifold. Get that VTC for good torque.
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