Evasive Spec Tein SRC
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Joined: Nov 2004
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From: Los Angeles
hey guys, we really don't want this thread to turn into a this shock vs that shock thread. We are simply trying to offer the community a suspension that has worked well for us. We understand where Billy is coming from and I respect his opinions but we obviously have proven this setup both on track and the streets. From smooth tracks like laguna seca to rougher tracks like Button, SOW.. few of the cars we setup on Evs SRC are being daily driven with superb ride quality. We hope to release more shock data and comparisons in the coming days.
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,683
Likes: 25
From: SoFlo
Its great to see you guys continue to develop new products to the community and show what US-tuners can do!
I hope anything I said didn't come across as discrediting Evasive because your results speak for themselves as a leader in S2K performance. I agree this thread should stay on topic about the new Evasive SRC and as I said before, the OT comments should be directed to another thread or better yet, a personal call to not take away from your thread.
Keep up the good work!
Billy
I hope anything I said didn't come across as discrediting Evasive because your results speak for themselves as a leader in S2K performance. I agree this thread should stay on topic about the new Evasive SRC and as I said before, the OT comments should be directed to another thread or better yet, a personal call to not take away from your thread.
Keep up the good work!
Billy
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 1,508
Likes: 0
From: Bay Area, CA
Being one of the drivers for testing the Evasive Spec. SRC, here are my thoughts.
Note: I am not a professional engineer, I studied mech. engineering in school but never perused a career in it. I am not assciated with Tein in any way or receive payment from them. I purchased the standard SRC and Evasive SRC with my own money.
Together with Evasive, we tested and dyno'ed various of suspension system for S2000s.
List Includes:
H&R
JRZ 2 Way
Moton CS
KW V3, CS
Standard SRC
HKS Hypermax 3 Sport
In search for a custom setup that worked for us, we even ordered 3 sets of custom Motorsport Bilestine (Fixed Valved) for testing.
We also tested various springs manufactuere (Swift, Tein, Hyperco, etc) to understand the difference in spring behavior from diffrent material/manufacturing process.
We did not want to modify current suspension kits out there with a spring rate increase that may void the warranty from the manufacture.
Working closely with Tein, Evasive Motorsport was able to revise the current Tein SRC to better match the our track conditions. We were lucky enough to received on-track support from Tein.
The Evasive Spec. SRC has different basevalve. Gas Pressure and Main valve stack has been adjust slightly to better match the base-valve but the biggest difference is in the basevalve.
Not an actual diagram for SRC...
The basevalve is a physical valve which regulates the fluid displacement between the two chamber. The Evasive Spec. SRC uses a CNC'ed basevalve which are more complex / intricate in design for motorsport use then the standard off the shelf SRC. The valve changes the responsiveness of the fluid which is dispensed in both rebound and compression and also changes the main shim-stack behavior as well. The added dampening modification was better suited for rougher tracks that we have in the state side and improved the damper behavior in the low (not ultra low) to mid shaft speed.
My car was used as a test car to represent a typical street S2000 with Wing and Non-Staggered wheels. Ken's Evasive S2000 was also used to see how well the suspension performs on a time attack car which pushes the limit a bit more. Various tires ranging from street tires to slicks where used during those testing. Evasive provided data-logger information and videos of the suspension / tire movements from our test cars. Tein USA provided techinical support and gave us recommendations on how to achieve our desired results.
In the end, suspension is about the overall balance of the car. One needs to take into consideration on the types of tires, aero, weight modifications the owner has planned for his/her car. The Evasive SRC will be best used when the owner has plans to develop the car in terms of wheels/aero package. Each driver will have different driving habits and style. Our goal was to provide solid base to a track enthusiast who will be able to chose their own sways, LSD and alignment setting to match their own driving style. With the new Voltex Aero kit in the works, Evasive will be able to offer a great starting point for anyone to develop a really fast track S2000.
Unfortunately, with the weak dollar, my recommendation of 3-way JRZ/Motons are pretty much out of reach for most of us. I went though 7+ sets of suspension system myself and it would have been great to have a coil-overs from a company who has spent its own time to optimize the coilovers for our domestic market. The spring rate on the Evasive SRC is geared toward high end street tires and R-Compounds. Due to the recent tire wars, street tires are offering lap time and grip level similar to a typical R compounds (NT01, R888s).
Here are my thoughts on using the spring rate on the Evasive S2000. (not Tein's or Evasive's comments so its very basic. Please PM me to correct me.. I would like to learn from an expert as well! Esp if your a damper engineer!)
I think its hard for suspension manufacture to develop a damper which uses a high spring rate (16kg +) for the street while maintaining street driveability. For example, the HKS Hypermax 3 Sport with lower spring rates rides noticeably harsher on the street then the Evasive SRC. Each manufacture has different construction (mono/twin/blow off) and uses different shaft diameter and gas pressure. For this reason, we can't directly compare spring rates from one coil-overs to an another.
The benefits of having a higher spring rate is to reduce the overall pitch and roll on the car. This reduces the overall changes in the dynamics of the vehicle. Smaller change in the dynamics of the car, the more stable the overall grip balance from all 4 wheels. Also, this reduction in the vehicle dynamics helps in returning the car to its original state. This results in the car being able to respond to braking, cornering and traction at the limit. The combination of shock and spring (rate/length) will ultimately decide the travel but the focus for the Evasive Spec. SRC was to create a damper which are responsive while in motion (oscillating up&down) while using the rates that Tein offers in the market.
Its my opinion that Evasive SRC was able to improve the characteristics of the standard SRC while maintaining overall balance at a reasonable price. There are plenty of suspension kits in the market that are designed really well. (KW, HKS, JRZ, Motons) Evasive went out to improve the current SRC on the market for track enthusiast in the states.
Note: I am not a professional engineer, I studied mech. engineering in school but never perused a career in it. I am not assciated with Tein in any way or receive payment from them. I purchased the standard SRC and Evasive SRC with my own money.
Together with Evasive, we tested and dyno'ed various of suspension system for S2000s.
List Includes:
H&R
JRZ 2 Way
Moton CS
KW V3, CS
Standard SRC
HKS Hypermax 3 Sport
In search for a custom setup that worked for us, we even ordered 3 sets of custom Motorsport Bilestine (Fixed Valved) for testing.
We also tested various springs manufactuere (Swift, Tein, Hyperco, etc) to understand the difference in spring behavior from diffrent material/manufacturing process.
We did not want to modify current suspension kits out there with a spring rate increase that may void the warranty from the manufacture.
Working closely with Tein, Evasive Motorsport was able to revise the current Tein SRC to better match the our track conditions. We were lucky enough to received on-track support from Tein.
The Evasive Spec. SRC has different basevalve. Gas Pressure and Main valve stack has been adjust slightly to better match the base-valve but the biggest difference is in the basevalve.
Not an actual diagram for SRC...
The basevalve is a physical valve which regulates the fluid displacement between the two chamber. The Evasive Spec. SRC uses a CNC'ed basevalve which are more complex / intricate in design for motorsport use then the standard off the shelf SRC. The valve changes the responsiveness of the fluid which is dispensed in both rebound and compression and also changes the main shim-stack behavior as well. The added dampening modification was better suited for rougher tracks that we have in the state side and improved the damper behavior in the low (not ultra low) to mid shaft speed.
My car was used as a test car to represent a typical street S2000 with Wing and Non-Staggered wheels. Ken's Evasive S2000 was also used to see how well the suspension performs on a time attack car which pushes the limit a bit more. Various tires ranging from street tires to slicks where used during those testing. Evasive provided data-logger information and videos of the suspension / tire movements from our test cars. Tein USA provided techinical support and gave us recommendations on how to achieve our desired results.
In the end, suspension is about the overall balance of the car. One needs to take into consideration on the types of tires, aero, weight modifications the owner has planned for his/her car. The Evasive SRC will be best used when the owner has plans to develop the car in terms of wheels/aero package. Each driver will have different driving habits and style. Our goal was to provide solid base to a track enthusiast who will be able to chose their own sways, LSD and alignment setting to match their own driving style. With the new Voltex Aero kit in the works, Evasive will be able to offer a great starting point for anyone to develop a really fast track S2000.
Unfortunately, with the weak dollar, my recommendation of 3-way JRZ/Motons are pretty much out of reach for most of us. I went though 7+ sets of suspension system myself and it would have been great to have a coil-overs from a company who has spent its own time to optimize the coilovers for our domestic market. The spring rate on the Evasive SRC is geared toward high end street tires and R-Compounds. Due to the recent tire wars, street tires are offering lap time and grip level similar to a typical R compounds (NT01, R888s).
Here are my thoughts on using the spring rate on the Evasive S2000. (not Tein's or Evasive's comments so its very basic. Please PM me to correct me.. I would like to learn from an expert as well! Esp if your a damper engineer!)
I think its hard for suspension manufacture to develop a damper which uses a high spring rate (16kg +) for the street while maintaining street driveability. For example, the HKS Hypermax 3 Sport with lower spring rates rides noticeably harsher on the street then the Evasive SRC. Each manufacture has different construction (mono/twin/blow off) and uses different shaft diameter and gas pressure. For this reason, we can't directly compare spring rates from one coil-overs to an another.
The benefits of having a higher spring rate is to reduce the overall pitch and roll on the car. This reduces the overall changes in the dynamics of the vehicle. Smaller change in the dynamics of the car, the more stable the overall grip balance from all 4 wheels. Also, this reduction in the vehicle dynamics helps in returning the car to its original state. This results in the car being able to respond to braking, cornering and traction at the limit. The combination of shock and spring (rate/length) will ultimately decide the travel but the focus for the Evasive Spec. SRC was to create a damper which are responsive while in motion (oscillating up&down) while using the rates that Tein offers in the market.
Its my opinion that Evasive SRC was able to improve the characteristics of the standard SRC while maintaining overall balance at a reasonable price. There are plenty of suspension kits in the market that are designed really well. (KW, HKS, JRZ, Motons) Evasive went out to improve the current SRC on the market for track enthusiast in the states.
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