Started project of better brakes July 2000. Felt that car had the most advanced engine, transmission, and suspension. Brakes worked great on street but did not have features that rest of car had. Wanted to improve over all braking performance and with open wheel spokes wanted better looking braking system. I went to all the venders that I could find Brembo, AP Racing , Porsche brake kits , Wilwood, Alcon, Project-Mu,Spoon, Movin-it, Nissin, and Baer plus others. I found out that none had system that was ready for S-2000. Companies that started development (Brembo,Spoon, Project-Mu) had problems fitting calipers in existing wheels and spacers were required or special offset wheels. You will find that Honda's (In-wheel) suspension does not leave much room for brakes. I decided to build a brake kit using finest components that I could find.
Goals:
1 Fit stock wheels ( was my # 1 goal)
2 Lighter ( takes out 10 lbs per wheel , this is the same weight saving as the Porsche GT2 ceramic brakes ) June issue European Car "And the 9-lb-per-axle unsprung weight savings surely contributes to the suspension's more athletic feel."
3 Easier to change pads
4 Better selection of pads
5 Improved cooling ( directional curved vane rotors !)
6 Increased rotor dia. ( largest rotor that will in stock wheel is 12.19 )
7 reduce weight of rotor ( - 10lbs !!!!!!! for new rotor and caliper per wheel )
8 increase clamping force ( larger pistons )
9 reduce flexing of caliper assembly ( Stronger than stock , 3 times stronger than cast aluminum big name imitation calipers )
10 make servicing of brakes easier
11 reduce drag on rotor when not braking ( reduced friction in caliper lets pad retract from rotor .

I have chosen:
4 piston " forged" aluminum caliper (racing unit)
Two piece rotor assembly with 12.19 dia. " forged" aluminum center hat , cast iron directional vane racing replaceable rotors ( left and right are different )
Custom milled aircraft aluminum adapter bracket
Earl's Hyperfirm D.O.T. Stainless braided steel brake lines (Earl's is the only company that has successfully passed all D.O.T. tests in a D.O.T. contracted test laboratory. Each line is tested to 4,000 psi before it is shipped . Most fittings are stainless) custom bent stainless steel solid brake line.
There are no problems with ABS . With new system ABS will not come on as often because you can modulate brakes better .
"Stiffer Caliper" This is the secret to better system . I have increased piston size by 36% and I have same petal height with still using stock master cylinder . The only way you can accomplish this is reduce the amount of fluid that is required to overcome flex , and use this to move oversized pistons .
The stock brakes on are car work great not because of braking components , these are the same pieces found on Civic's and Accords . The chassis balance , tires and weight transfer are what makes this car stop. But as most people find out heat and fade are the problems with stock system . But why not give the car more stopping power , easier to proportion pedal , lighter weight "And the 9-lb-per-axle unsprung weight savings surely contributes to the suspension's more athletic feel." and better cooling .


I will do one group buy on this brake kit soon . I am still working on rear rotors and need to get final costs on custom bolts . I am also completing testing of two more types of pads . The pricing on two piece racing rotors and hats to fit stock brake systems will be complete soon also .

It would be nice to have area on site that had brake information on .
How to bleed brakes .
Size and weight of stock calipers and rotors
How to install SS brake lines and single person bleeders
How to service rear brakes
ect>


brad45
6410

 

Brad,

I understand that you haven't completed this yet, but can you give a rough price range? $1000? $1500? $2000?

Thanks,
Tanq

 

Brad,

Does your racing calipers require more lateral clearence as compared to the stock system? If so, how much more? With so many people having replaced their wheels, this may be a problem.

For instance, with my Mugen MF10 wheels, although they are 1 inch wider and have less 3mm offset than stock, the wheel arms ride closer to the caliper than do the stock wheels. I suspect this is common to other brands.

 

Pricing is being completed for Retail and Wholesale . I will make sure that first group buy is just above cost . Will have to limit number . ( Price does not go down for components until 50 pcs don't think that 25 people will buy at one time.) Luis I used stock wheel for fitment if Mugen wheel has same room where caliper mounts no problem . I can make template of caliper mounting so you could check wheels . To get calipers to fit I had to move rotor inward . At the top outward part of new caliper, clears wheel by 3/8" this is 6

 

This package looks like it will be well beyond $2 or $3k, possibly in the $5k. I'll be surprised if not.

The brake components on our cars are not from "Civics and Accords." The master, booster, and modulator may be "parts bin" items, but as you have noted you've kept them. The caliper and rotor to my knowledge are of an entirely new design for the S2k. I'm not sure if the new RSX uses them, but I'm sure the Civic does not. I compared the rotor to my 5g Prelude's, and there is about .1" of additional thickness, plus a different offset, on the S2k. These rotors (and hence, the calipers) should not be interchangeable with any other Honda product (at least right now). The Legend GS (and possibly the new TLs) and the NSX are the only Hondas I know of with bigger brakes (calipers and rotors).

Fade is a definite problem I've noticed. Have you been able to do any 60-0 runs, or anything to "quantitatively" test the system? Barring that, how does it feel?

My experience has been that replacing Honda brake lines doesn't improve pedal feel. Pads and calipers do. Any comments on how the pedal force has changed or feedback is?

 

[QUOTE]Originally posted by marcucci
[B]This package looks like it will be well beyond $2 or $3k, possibly in the $5k. I'll be surprised if not.

 

My experience is that SS lines make a subtle difference in brake feel, maybe a bit firmer. I think it does aid in control at the limit, improving the ability to use heavy breaking and making it easier to push into or stay out of ABS.

 

dwb1-
can i add to your list:
(from http://www.s2000online.com/forums/showthre...?threadid=16972 )

"the problem with the wheel badges is...
that they look better than the stock wheels!!!
and draw attention to the rusted disks...
now i have to paint the brake calipers and replace the disks!
have we concluded a solution to the rust problem?
(one thread says plate the edges, but i noticed that the rust is also near the middle)...
anyone found a light weight solution that does not warp?"
i would add to the list a disk that does not show rust...

 

When I stated that our brakes were the same as civic

 

Hey dwb1,

Not to bust your balls on this or anything but I have a question:

"...Have not had ABS kick in yet..."

Doesn't this indicate a flaw or problem with the design? I assume this also means you have not locked up the brakes? If so, doesn't that indicate problems. You still have the same amount of tire grip to overcome as stock, so either you should hit abs or lock up the brakes under max pedal pressure, correct?