S2000 Talk Discussions related to the S2000, its ownership and enthusiasm for it.

Mastering Control

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Old May 5, 2005 | 03:36 AM
  #11  
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I just drive it to the limit as much as possible in some nice turns and everyday I push the S more and more. Practise makes perfect. But if you want to do it safe get into the track and enjoy.
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Old May 5, 2005 | 04:39 AM
  #12  
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Parking lots are fine to a degree, but you will not really learn to save a car in the type of situation that causes wrecks. Here's the problem - you will learn the basics of turning into a spin, and hopefully what to do with your feet (and what not to do); BUT, just doing slides in a parking lot will NOT teach you where to look while sliding/spinning (well it's too late if you're spinning - just go both feet in). The key to actually getting out of a bad situation, and not ending up like many of the stories you read here "I saved the first slide, but it snapped and I spun - thank god I didn't hit anything (or) I totaled the car" - is to learn to look where you want to go AND apply the proper slide recovery techniques.

Either set up a handling course with cones in the parking lot and learn to induce, then come out of a slide on that - or better yet, get to an autocross as mentioned - but one ax will not do much. Commit to doing about 4 or 5 whether you like it or not. By the way, the problem with just learning how to catch spins you induce yourself - is you are absolutely ready for them. They are going to catch you by surprise on the street - you need to recognize the conditions that lead to oversteer in the first place - not just wet roads, and know when to avoid them and/or use them when desired.

I'd say do a track day, but I really believe an autocross novice school is one of the best places to learn basic car control FIRST. Especially in novice run groups, you're not likely to experience much oversteer anyway. You will be taught to be smooth and better recognise the limit so you don't slide in the first place.

FWIW - I know two advanced HPDE devotees who badly damaged their cars on moderate speed wet turns on the street - one an E36M3 one an S2000 (yes I own both, no it wasn't me - yet - or ever I hope).
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Old May 5, 2005 | 05:20 AM
  #13  
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If you have never had any spin and recovery instruction or practice, you would do well to seek some out.

That said, learning and practicing in some instruction car will only get you half the distance that you need to cover. The S has three things that are very different from many cars with rear wheel drive: 1. Quick steering, and the rack on your 02 is faster than what I have in my 04. This means that when you go to steer into a skid under pressure, you will tend to over-correct and throw yourself into a skid going the other way; 2. Big, sticky rubber. When you "hook up" upon coming out of the skid, it can be violent unless you practice feathering that hookup. You can do this in an instruction car, but it's not the same; 3. A short wheelbase. I don't know about others, but with the S and cars like a Miata, I find that your butt can get in front of you in an instant.

To me, this all adds up to needing practice in the S itself. I love to play with the car on a wet parking lot, or one that has leaves or pine needles on it. Like many things physical, if you don't have lots of practice, you won't have the instincts you'll need under pressure.
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Old May 5, 2005 | 08:33 AM
  #14  
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Like most of the guy here have said. Go to a couple of Autocrosses. You will get the most out of it. Plus you are in a safe, controlled enviroment. I had my car not even 2 weeks before I was out autocrossing the car. I have now about 6-7 autocrosses under my butt now. It has really helped me to learn the car and when and how I can push it. Just go to a couple autocrosses and if your lucky there will be some guys driving S's. Which if they are good can really help you out. If not go look up either some miata's or vette drivers. They can be some great help. Good luck and have fun.
Bryan
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Old May 5, 2005 | 08:40 AM
  #15  
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Thank you for all the wonderful and informative replies.
I'll definitely be checking out some local auto crossing soon, and while it's raining here in the bay, I may just spend some time in a big empty lot too.

I know it's going to take practice and lots of it, but that exactly what I expected. I'm looking forward to staying safe, safe, and being able to sell this car after I drive it to my heart's content.

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Old May 5, 2005 | 11:18 AM
  #16  
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Originally Posted by Sbeall,May 5 2005, 04:23 AM
I've never slipped on wet asphalt.
I've been slipping on wet asphalt my whole life
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Old May 5, 2005 | 12:02 PM
  #17  
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The S will also exhibit lift throttle oversteer which catches many first time RWD owners off guard.

To find out what this feels like, find a nice sweeper curve on a road with no traffic, take the curve at the speed limit and lift your foot off the gas in the middle of the curve.

Repeat the maneuver increasing the speed in 5mph increments. You will know when you are experiencing lift throttle oversteer, you will have to correct your steering input to compensate.

DO NOT try this if you are pushing the car hard though the curve.

The reason one should experience this is because if you are faced with a situation where you need to unexpectedly slow down in a curve because of traffic, you want to be able to control the car, not end up sideways or backwards.
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Old May 5, 2005 | 05:08 PM
  #18  
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Originally Posted by Sbeall,May 5 2005, 03:23 AM
Not when it's wet. I've never slipped on wet asphalt.
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Old May 5, 2005 | 09:36 PM
  #19  
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Originally Posted by Sbeall,May 5 2005, 04:23 AM
Not when it's wet. I've never slipped on wet asphalt.
Really


I must have been sideways 3,643,792,553 times on wet asphalt
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Old May 5, 2005 | 09:54 PM
  #20  
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Take your time.

But yeah best way to learn S is by participaing in Autocross events.
It is cheap, legal and fun!

Then move to HPDEs. Soon you will drive your S like it is extension of your body.
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