I was in the same boat. Had a deposit on the Elise. The S2000 is just the better car. It's not as wild looking and it doesn't have the name cache of "Lotus", but it's a more reasonable car. On a track, the Elise is going to be a hair better, but the S2000 is a lot better everywhere else. Besides, I bet 90% of S2000 owners can't get 100% out of their cars anyway. A very good driver in an S2000 should be able to handle an unskilled driver in an Elise.

I wanted to enjoy a 2 seat roadster before I got old and fat and had kids. I bought an '04 S2000 and drive it regularly. Any sane person cannot use an Elise for anything more than a weekend drive. Even a weekend drive would have to be limited to smooth backroads and your trip should be free from frequent stops because the Elise top is just a total pain in the ....

I also believe that the heart of any car is the engine and transmission. How can anyone argue that the Toyota engine and the sloppy mid-engined shifter of the Elise is superior to the S2000? It's not even close. Given the choice, wouldn't your girlfriend prefer an S2000 with an Elise body on it? Everyone would choose that if it was offered. The Elise is about the looks and the lack of weight. If you are not putting it on a track, the weight is a non-issue.

I give the Elise the nod in the "wow" department and it is undoubtedly fun ... on the right roads at the right times. If you're not going to track the Elise ... owning one would be pretty pathetic. It is a cool looking car, but any Elise owner who bought the car for the "look-at-me" factor is sad. I believe posing in such a manner is still considered to be tacky and in bad form.

Check out sites like www.elisetalk.com
They praise the car to no end over there, but read between the lines and check out all of the little problems that Lotus throws in "free of charge" with your Elise purchase.

Cars are tools designed to do particular jobs.
The Elise is a tool for the track.
An Elise owner who doesn't go to the track is a different kind of tool altogether.

 

One thing you guys don't seem to have mentioned so far is that Lotus used to be said to stand for "Loads Of Trouble Usually Serious". I think thye are a bit better these days but the build quality and reliability will be nowhere near that of Honda. Also, the S2000 will seem like limo in terms of comfort compaerd to the Elise. That said, if its out and out cornering performance you are after, a well set up Elise will leave an S2000 for dead.

I had a race with an older Elise on a straight road and it couldn't quite match the S for speed though (the new Elise will probably beat it here too).

 

A friend of mine in Lausanne had one and every bump I was looking out the rear view mirror thinking a piece came off the car. You literally touch each other if two sit in the car. Sure a test drive is going to be exciting, but outside of a sandwich bag, not much else can fit in it. At the price we have to pay in the US, a new S2000, Z4, or even a used 996 Cab just seem like better choices unless you are quite decided on the Elise. If that's the case, maybe a Caterham should be an option as well?

My decision to buy the S2000 over the other cars was the build quality and reliability. I want to drive my sports car, but not to the repair shop every weekend. Who cares if it's under warranty if the mechanic is the only one who gets to drive it every weekend?

 

 

>>>I had a race with an older Elise on a straight road and it couldn't quite match the S for speed though (the new Elise will probably beat it here too). <<<

The early cars had ~90 RWHP. Still they were well regarded for their capabilities against cars with 2-4 times the RWHP.

I read an article about an earlier version with less oompth and it still came in 2nd overall in a handling and track test to a Ferrari. The article praised the car's steering and responses. That version had 122 HP at the crank, and was basically power limited. On some of the corners, the Elise had the highest grip...about 1.4 gs on Bridgestone RE040s. The Test included 360, Z06, EVO, M3, Boxter S and 911 Turbo along with a Mazda MP3 baseline.

Here are some of the test results: http://www.sandsmuseum.com/cars/elise/info.../getagrip2.html

Stan

 

Interesting link.

Like I said a well set up Elise will leave the S2000 for dead in the corners (and probably most other cars too). A bit too "raw" for me and if you are going for "raw", like somebody else said, why not consider a Caterham (or a Westfield - I don't know if you can get Westfields in the states but the twin bike engined ones are awesome!).

As a daily driver the Elise is probably not a good bet though. I used to know somebody that worked at the Lotus factory years ago and he told me that the Esprit customers (especially famous/well off ones - he said "enthusiasts put up with it") used to get fed up with the cars being off the road all the time for warranty repairs and used to write some stinking letters in about it. The fact that the repairs were free didn't count for anything with them as they had plenty of money anyway. I was also told (when the Elan mk11 was out) that the dealers said that "PDI" stood for Please Drain Interior! Their roofs used to leak big time. Another story was about when the doors were slammed on the early ones (Elan 11's) the drop glass could shatter. Dealers would then fit a new glass but the bits would work their way into the fibreglass. The first the owner would know about the bits would be when washing the car by hand a few months later when the bits had worked their way through the fiberglass doors and would cut their hands up!

Maybe the Elise is better, and I'm sure things have improved, but I bet they still have some issues (my friend invited me to a tour of the Elise production line when it first started up and, although impressive in parts, my memory of this was of a line worker using a large screwdriver to fit grommets into the body work of the cars coming along the line (free scratches!).

As for my friend he was made redundant a long time back so I'm not in touch with how things are now, so maybe Lotus's are reliable these days?

 

I'm 55 and have the S as my only car, it fits me like a glove and I love every bit of it. I need the cargo space that the S has, and like women, I can barely handle one at a time, but if it were a second car to play with on the weekends, it would have been the Elise. Who cares if it's hard to get in, and it really is for an old guy like me - I tried in/out at a car show a couple of years ago just before I bought my S. But heck, what's another few seconds getting behind the wheel. The Elise has a fascination - it's all by itself out there. If you can afford it, get it.

 

Here is my way at looking at this guy's situation:

He has a girlfriend who wants to buy a car for herself. She says she loves the Elise even though it is a very pure (aka raw) sports car. She says she doesn't mind the low level of comfort associated with it. But she says the S is her 2nd choice.

Sooooooo, wouldn't you guys LOVE to have an elise in your driveway? Why would you not encourage her to get the Elise? She already says she's not commuting in it and its only a fun car. If your gonna get a fun weekend car you might as well go all out ESPECIALLY if your chick wants it too! So tell her to get it!!

 

wooooh I have to chime in on this. I love the new elise !!!!

I thought S2000 was the most barbaric and raw mass produced sports car. But compared to the new lotus, S2000 is like a leather seated town and country minivan!

I think I like funky styling. Most of us here hate how the Z4 looks, but I love it. And I love how the new elise looks too.

thank god s2000 has distinct and timeless classic styling. Otherwise I'd have the lotus fever right now. I think 40k for the new lotus is a bargain. But, it WILL HAVE TO BE a weekend car seriously.

for you, I think you need to buy the elise. It is tight inside out. It is small. And colored bright. And it has AWESOME performance and looks like it took life straight ouf of a sketchbook. And it is fun. Lots of fun. And it can be had for significantly less than the Boxter S or the 3.0 Z4. End of discussion. What more could you ask?

But me personally, I dont think I'd ever buy one becuase interior layout is very important for me. As important as how the car looks from the outside. The new elise doesn't have a cozy interior and it doesn't have the center tunnel that runs along the length of the interior room like our S. I am having hard time having the S as a daily driver already. If I already didn't own the S and if I had 40k to spare, I'd buy the new elise in a heartbeat thinking it can be had as a daily driver and I'd be regretting couple months later. I guess thats why somethings can only be learned through experience.

I used to drive a nissan V6 and now drive a high revving honda 4cylinder. And another thing I learned through the experience of owning the S2000 is that I actually prefer 6 cylinders than a high revving VTEC 2.0. So if I had to do this all over again, I'd opt for a used 3.0 Z4. The Z4 looks almsot as funky as the new elise. hahaha.

but I still love my S2000 and I am 100% happy with it. Remember, we still have the best feeling shifter of all cars, better than the elise or the boxter or the Z4.

But I still think you need to buy the elise. It is one dammmm cool car.

 

I think it's wonderful that such a car even exists for anyone to buy if they can pay for it. It's very hard core and if you truly realize it going in, you'll have a nice experience.

Glass windows do not shatter and work their way through the fiberglass. Corvettes don't do this either. The Elise has been in production about 9 years if you count the S1 version which is basically been updated to the present spec. Many parts of it are very well understood and reliable. I'm sure it's no Honda Accord for reliability but it's no early Lotus either.

I recall one of the Road and Track articles about the early 60s Elan. It was one of those retrospective pieces where the do surveys and such. The Elan had about the worst reliability recorded combined with the highest owner satisfaction. That had never happened before and they felt it was due to the joy of driving overcoming other matters. Most of the flaws are niggly things that are a hassle to deal with but don't affect the driving experience. And there are lots of aftermarket upgrades and enhancements already available since it's a new car here but not elsewhere. Compared to a Seven, an Elise is a Town Car by the way.

Loti are best owned by folks who are true enthusiasts and who tend to fiddle with cars anyway. I drove a 1970 Europa for years. It needed love and care but never stranded me. You needed to look after it and if you did, it was fine. You just can't expect it to behave like mainstream mass production cars. I guess I'm trying to say that a big part of it is your attitude and expectations. If you are presently driving a bug convertible and want a sportier open air car you'll hate the Elise. It's not a true convertible and it's dedicated to the driving experience. Conversely if you too are dedicated to the driving experience you'll love it. Many will buy the Elise for the wrong reasons...eventually they will wind up with the "right" sort of owner but this may take time. Heck lots of S2000s are owned by the clueless - I met a person who never revved hers over 4000 and was astonished to hear from me about the joys of VTEC.