Hey Guys,

So I've searched this topic to death, and am amazed how many drivers complain about the gearbox on the S being notchy / stiff / crunchy. i.e. Crunchy shift to 2nd and 3rd, especially when cold and even on brand new vehicles. There is a similar post in the UK Forum that I just replied to, but wanted to get this on the main board. Unclefester seemed to verify that the clutch freeplay was the culprit and after an adjustment noticed a night and day difference in how smooth the gearbox was. Seems like a lot of us could benefit from trying this fix, yet we don't have a sticky on this topic?? (or did I miss it?)

I have an 08 with under 5K on it with same symptoms, and would like to try the freeplay adjustment. Was just hoping somebody had posted pics of how to do it, and what to specifically watch out for with respect to nearing zero play (bearing wear) etc. I know I should probably pick up a Helms manual, but can anyone direct me to a post with pictures or copy of the Helms page describing this? Thought I saw this at one point some time back, but can't put my hands on it now.

I've changed my own oil etc... so I'm mechanically inclined, and in looking at the pedal it seems like it's as simple as backing off the lock nut, and spining the threaded shaft toward the engine a bit to take up some slack? Any cautions / potential problems that can bite you? Please let me know.

Thanks in advance for your help.

 

I don't have the post handy, but I've done it. And yes it is that simple. Loosen the lock nut and turn the shaft to take up the free play. Make sure you back it off a little bit though, you don't want the master cylinder to be applying pressure with the pedal all the way up. this will change your clutch engagement point since the pedal won't have to travel as far.

Your new car shouldn't be having this issue, but if you have a sticky issue with the clutch pedal, make sure the slave cylinder "ball" that goes into the transmission has grease on it.

But really.. when it's cold out the transmission will be clunky. The trans fluid needs to warm up, and in this car it should shift like butter in the high RPMs, not necessarily when you're puttering around town.

 

I don't call it a pedal freeplay adjustment, what I do works on the clutch rod at the bottom of the pedal rather than the freeplay at the top of the pedal. What I did was lengthened the clutch rod, and this is what worked for me.

Keep in mind that what I'm talking about raises the disengagement point and the engagement point of the clutch, some people may not care but some people may not totaly like it. On my car the engagement point was too low to the floor so I liked the end result after the adjustment.

Under dash there is a lock nut on the clutch rod which is behind the clutch pedal and extends through the firewall. Use the open side of a 12 mm box end wrench to loosen the locknut. Once it is loose the clutch rod is lengthened but turning the rod clockwise, and it is shortened by turning counter clockwise. I turned it about 2 full turns clockwise which lengthened it. You do have to be careful not to lengthen it too much where you would get full contact with the clutch all the time. Do small adjustments and see if things improve then readjust if necessary.

This engages the clutch sooner as you push down the clutch pedal and gives you a bit more time as your hand goes to move the shifter. It's been reported to get a smoother shift on these cars that you need to shift slower, by lengthening the clutch rod you are doing just that without really knowing it.

At 55k my transmission shifts flawlessly on my MY02, feels brand new. What helped me was using Honda MTF2 fluid with regular changes, Clutch rod adjustment, swapping new clutch fluid regularly, and lubricating the shifter as per the TSB from Honda. I have no complaints with my tranny now, whereas it had a slight grind/crunch when I first got the car.

 

Good info... thanks for the replies.

Is there any reason to have any more than just a hair of freeplay? i.e. just a millimeter or two? I think the spec is 1/2" or an inch or so... is that for any specific reason or is it fine as long as we have SOME freeplay? Any risk of pushing the clutch actuator arm more than it likes and bending or wearing anything?

 

I think the 1/2 inch of free play in the clutch pedal refers to the measurement at the top of the pedal behind the clutch switch. There isn't that much play in the bottom of the pedal at the clutch rod adjuster area. On the clutch rod you do need to maintain some play, not a huge amount but enough to keep it from touching all the time.

With the clutch rod you will find small adjustments work best. Keep in mind that the use of the clutch pedal will feel different with each adjustment. I know if you lengthen it too much it won't feel right, and if it is too short it won't feel right either. I think no more than two full turns of the rod during adjustment is plenty to start with. It is easy to do, so try 1-2 turns and go for a test drive. Then adjust as necessary from there. Keep track of your adjustments in case you wish to return the settings back to where they started. I like to use full turns as they are easier to keep track.

 

I've done this and it has made a huge difference. Much more than changing the tranny fluid and clutch fluid. I've suggested this to other members and the response is usually "that doesn't make sense" and "I guess I better change the master cylinder since most people say that should be the problem!" The latter response usually goes with fluid dripping onto the carpet.

 

Thanks again guys... great feedback.

I finally found the thread I've been searching for. See below. Now I'm not advocating that owners do this, as there is quite a bit going on between the two switches and pushrod, and if you aren't careful I'm sure you can screw something up and cause real damage. But for those of us that have some experience and want to adjust the freeplay of the pedal... the post below is a great write up with pictures. We should get someone to put this on the FAQ Sticky, unless it's there and I just missed it. (Not sure I did the hyperlink right).

Thanks to Ronblanford for the original post with pictures and page out of the manual. Very nice! I'm going to try this tomorrow if I can get this old body upside down in the footwell of my S! Hoping it smooths out the gear latch I feel when shifting.

https://www.s2ki.com/forums/index.php?showt...0&#entry3608715

 

Okay... so new problem. I went ousite today to do what I thought would be a quick adjust of the freeplay via the pushrod per my original post. Before doing so, though, I thought I'd check the stock pedal height just to make sure it was within specs. (Don't know why I didn't check this sooner!)

... The stock clutch pedal height is 6.1" off the floor. This is nowhere near the spec shown in the manual page reprint from the thread I referenced. The spec it shows is 7.44" from the floor. Granted it depends on how much you depress the carpet with the measuring tape... but there isn't an inch and a half of carpet there.

So I need a little more help. Can anyone confirm 7.44" is the correct clutch pedal height on an '08 AP2? Want to make sure this didn't change and maybe the manual page reprint was old perhaps. I know there weren't many material changes in the AP2 year models, but wasn't sure if the clutch delay switch or anything else may have caused an update in the pedal assy etc. Also, can anyone with a stock '08 or similar year S confirm that their clutch pedal is indeed around that 7.44" spec in real life?

If that's the case, this would certainly account for the partial grind / gear latch feeling I get from the gearbox. I'd have to make a significant adjustment in the pedal height just to reach the spec. Seems like pedal would be too far out visually though.

Anyway, please let me know and thanks again for your help.

 

I know it's 7.44 on my 2003 shop manual, doubt it would have changed any over the years, but see if anyone with an 08 can confirm their measurements. It calls to alter the clutch rod to arrive at the proper setting, stroke of the pedal is supposed to be about 4.5 to 4.9 inches, that would be hard to achieve with your measurement starting in the 6 inch range. Could be the reason why your shifting is out of whack.

 

Great information in here! I adjusted the freeplay on the rod that connects to the MC today - the car feels brand f'n new.

Cannot thank you guys enough for the good, accurate info in here.