I brought this topic up in the temporary offline forums but wasn't able to view the response in time since the temp forums were taken down.

I've recently installed the Mugen t-stat, f-switch, rad cap and Hondata insulator and liked how it seems to control heat, however a friend of mine (a mechanic of over 25 years) said to me that we may want to try a mixture of some kind of special coolant/additive that's mixed with demineralized/distilled water instead of the Honda premixed stuff that I've been successfully using with no problems at all.

Naturally I asked him how is the new method more effective than what I'm using now and he replied that it's often used on cars that develop more internal heat. Of course that explanation wasn't good enough for me, so he said something like how the coolant/additive reduces the surface tension of water, allowing it to be more effective at carrying away heat.

By some miracle, I managed to pass chemistry in high school (way back when) even though I slept through most of it... but can anyone explain what my friend is referring to in a way that a low IQ bum like me can understand?

 

First, you need to be reminded about what happens when water boils. It bubbles like crazy. You don't want these bubbles forming inside an engine's cooling system. Bubbles don't transfer or carry heat very well. In fact, very poorly, thus your engine overheats badly if there are a lot of air pockets forming.
You can do a couple of things to prevent boiling in a car. You can prevent the pressure from escaping (that's what the rad cap does) till it gets a bit higher. You can add something to the water to bring the boiling point up a bit before boiling starts. The most common example of this is to add salt to water, like when you boil vegetables. Obviously, you don't want to put salt into your car's cooling system (rust). So, most antifreezes will have both boiling point raising chemicals and anti-corrosion elements in them. Ethylene Glycol is one such chemical.
Another is what is found in things like Water Wetter. WW is a kind of "surfactant", that changes the surface tension of water. This is partly responsible for increasing the boiling point of water. I believe WW also has anti-corrosion elements in it. How much more it can raise the boiling point of water, I'm not certain. Another property of this is that is can hold and carry a bit more heat than just water/anti-freeze. Now, you have to ask yourself if your car really needs these extra properties.
Water normally boils at 212*F. Inside our engines, the coolant temp can get up to well above 220* (maybe even 230*) before boiling starts. Regular coolant is fine for that. I'm not sure how much more margin WW will get you. It may keep the temps from ever getting that high simply because it can carry the heat away more efficiently. How much more? You'd have to wait for someone who has taken measurements in a real life scenario.

 

Here's a link to the Water Wetter info @ Redline's site. http://www.redlineoil.com/redlineoil/wwti.htm

I'm running this in my car but don't have empirical data to share.

 

I read a good debate a long time ago, that while it is safe it will accelerate corrosion, I will dig up a link.

 

Ok, I can't find the link but I kept some info.

Water Wetter contains borates and silicates, which is abrasive and Honda does not recommend using coolants containing these type of surficants.

Thats why we have to be safe and use Honda coolant or equiv.
So if you are using the proper coolant adding water wetter adds the surficants.

The reason water wetter uses borates and silicates is to control PH.
after 15k miles the borates and silicates wear out which makes the mixture acidic, which will corode the cooling system.

I have never recommended using it unless you are in very very hot climates or in race conditions, it reduces cavitation or air bubbles in the coolant which reduce cooling.

But you have to change coolant after 15k miles or you will see the cooling system fail over time, this is what they don't really tell you.

It works, but with a price to pay.

Hope that is a good addition to an already good post

 

Thanks XViper. I think you may've jogged my memory into remembering a few things. Could this also be along the same lines as...

how adding salt in a pot of heated water will raise the boiling point, reduce its heat capacity but will allow the salted water to reach the boiling point faster than it would normal (unsalted) water?

I recall reading something like when something is heated, the molecules are more active than they are when cool. Perhaps using something like WW allows the molecules to be more active and therefore be more effective at moving heat around... kind of like how gold is more effective at moving electrons (electricity) than lead.

 

That sounds about right.

Since I live in Vegas (hotter than Hades right now) and primarily drive the car on the track (about the only street driving the car sees is back and forth to the track) I use it with a mix of coolant and water.

 

WW does NOT change the boiling point, but your Mugen radiator cap will.

 

I'm not sure about some of these points. My memory is a bit dim on this as well. I think you may have some of the principles involved slightly confused but I'm not the one to give the correct answer, either.
Salt and WW raise the boiling of water by different chemical means. One changes the ionic strength of the solution while the other changes the surface tension (in part) and "detergency".

 

The silicates in WW are there to reduce corrosion, and also to reduce foaming. The borates are their as pH buffers.

I would be very careful running no Type2 or similar non-abrasive coolant (like G-5 glysantin base in BASF/Zerex, or Ford Premium Gold). While Red Line may claim their WW does the job, it is a very small volume, and all-aluminum engines are sensitive to corrosion - once it starts, it is hard to stop.

A few HP is not worth the risk, in my book.

The other thing is - will WW even work as suggested? Let's assume it does all it says, and allows more transfer of heat from the head to the coolant - that is only an advantage if it allows more spark, which in the old days could be dialed-up by either resetting the base timing on the distributor, or changing the weights/springs in the advance mechanism. On a modern, CC'd car, the ECM may only see an increased coolant temperature, and dial-back the spark advance, since it is working under assumed operating conditions (50/50 water/coolant mix) that have been displaced by water and some magic elixir. It might actually be counter-productive. Something to chew on.