Spark plug came loose, threads went with it
01-14-2015, 07:59 AM
#21
How about if he would have worded it this way (which is probably what he meant):
Be careful and never trust the dealer. They don't know what they are doing, especially with this car. You are much better off doing things like this yourself. So going forward buy yourself a proper torque wrench for those plugs =) happy motoring. If you aren't comfortable with DIY, find a good Independent mechanic. Avoid the dealer.
Be careful and never trust the dealer. They don't know what they are doing, especially with this car. You are much better off doing things like this yourself. So going forward buy yourself a proper torque wrench for those plugs =) happy motoring. If you aren't comfortable with DIY, find a good Independent mechanic. Avoid the dealer.
04-22-2015, 09:06 PM
#23
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I finally got to this job and completed it. I wanted to post the process and results here for others.
I called Time-Sert and talked to a tech there and he gave me the part number for that kit as the proper tool to do the job in my S2000 application. They sell them direct and also on Amazon with Prime. He said that insert number 44111 was the correct insert, also available on Amazon prime. I ordered up and had the items next day.
To do the job, you need:
The wine is for when you are done.
First I removed all the spark plugs and turned the engine to the compression stroke on the cylinder I was working on. You need to do that to make sure the valves are closed so that they are not sticking out in the way. I put my hand over the spark plug tube and felt for air coming up, then visually checked that the piston and valves were clear.
Then apply grease to the thread cutter to catch as many aluminum shavings/cuttings as possible.
The cutting was pretty smooth, and you can feel when you have made it all the way through. You have to screw the cutter in so that the top of it is in the sparkplug hole about 1/4", I used a piece of wire to gauge the depth and make sure I had gone far enough.
Next you slide the seat cutter over the thread cutter's shaft and down into the hole. The driver that your 1/2" wrench goes onto now drives the seat cutter and you manually give it a couple of turns with medium/light downpressure. Then you check to see if the seat is cut all the way around visually. The toolset does not provide a mechanism for extracting the seat cutter, I used long pliers in reverse to grab onto the seat cutter and remove it. I did this a couple of times because I cut the seat very gently.
Once the seat is cut, you unscrew the thread cutter. The grease caught 98% of the chips.
I then zip tied a rag to a stick (very securely) and used it to wipe the top of the piston and the threads. This removed extra grease as well as the remaining chips. I also blew it out with compressed air after I did that. It looked completely clean inside after that.
The final step is to install the threaded insert. It comes with a driver tool, so you screw the insert onto the tool and (although the instructions did not say to) I applied red loctite. I talked to a couple of mechanics that advised using red loctite on it.
The driver screws the insert in, but it also completes the inside threading operation. The last 10% or so of the insert's interior threads are not cut, the tool compresses them in (No metal chips, no cutting) and this also expands the insert into the cylinder head fora very tight installation that won't back out. Once you drive the installation tool all the way into the threaded insert, you just back it out. You can feel when the threads are complete by the pressure required and it backs out easily.
The result is difficult to get a photo of, but here it is:
Overall, this was a very simple job with these tools and the instructions that came with them. I was worried for nothing. It could easily be done in a couple of hours from start to finish. I installed the plug and the car drives and runs like nothing ever happened. I actually did this over three short after work sessions, first night cut the threads, second night installed the insert, third night re-assembed things and fired it up. I did want to give the loctite an overnight to cure. And I did use a calibrated torque wrench to install the plugs. The same wrench I used when I rebuilt my airplane's Lycoming O-320.
It's nice to be enjoying the S2000 again. It had lapsed on it's smog inspection while it was out of service so that was the first thing I had to do, it passed just fine.
I called Time-Sert and talked to a tech there and he gave me the part number for that kit as the proper tool to do the job in my S2000 application. They sell them direct and also on Amazon with Prime. He said that insert number 44111 was the correct insert, also available on Amazon prime. I ordered up and had the items next day.
To do the job, you need:
- 4412E TimeSert kit
- 44111 Insert
- Axle Grease
- 30 Wt Oil
- Red loctite
- A 1/2" Wrench or rachet/socket
- Long nose pliers
- A wrench or socket that can turn the crank pulley on the engine
- Nerves of steel
The wine is for when you are done.
First I removed all the spark plugs and turned the engine to the compression stroke on the cylinder I was working on. You need to do that to make sure the valves are closed so that they are not sticking out in the way. I put my hand over the spark plug tube and felt for air coming up, then visually checked that the piston and valves were clear.
Then apply grease to the thread cutter to catch as many aluminum shavings/cuttings as possible.
The cutting was pretty smooth, and you can feel when you have made it all the way through. You have to screw the cutter in so that the top of it is in the sparkplug hole about 1/4", I used a piece of wire to gauge the depth and make sure I had gone far enough.
Next you slide the seat cutter over the thread cutter's shaft and down into the hole. The driver that your 1/2" wrench goes onto now drives the seat cutter and you manually give it a couple of turns with medium/light downpressure. Then you check to see if the seat is cut all the way around visually. The toolset does not provide a mechanism for extracting the seat cutter, I used long pliers in reverse to grab onto the seat cutter and remove it. I did this a couple of times because I cut the seat very gently.
Once the seat is cut, you unscrew the thread cutter. The grease caught 98% of the chips.
I then zip tied a rag to a stick (very securely) and used it to wipe the top of the piston and the threads. This removed extra grease as well as the remaining chips. I also blew it out with compressed air after I did that. It looked completely clean inside after that.
The final step is to install the threaded insert. It comes with a driver tool, so you screw the insert onto the tool and (although the instructions did not say to) I applied red loctite. I talked to a couple of mechanics that advised using red loctite on it.
The driver screws the insert in, but it also completes the inside threading operation. The last 10% or so of the insert's interior threads are not cut, the tool compresses them in (No metal chips, no cutting) and this also expands the insert into the cylinder head fora very tight installation that won't back out. Once you drive the installation tool all the way into the threaded insert, you just back it out. You can feel when the threads are complete by the pressure required and it backs out easily.
The result is difficult to get a photo of, but here it is:
Overall, this was a very simple job with these tools and the instructions that came with them. I was worried for nothing. It could easily be done in a couple of hours from start to finish. I installed the plug and the car drives and runs like nothing ever happened. I actually did this over three short after work sessions, first night cut the threads, second night installed the insert, third night re-assembed things and fired it up. I did want to give the loctite an overnight to cure. And I did use a calibrated torque wrench to install the plugs. The same wrench I used when I rebuilt my airplane's Lycoming O-320.
It's nice to be enjoying the S2000 again. It had lapsed on it's smog inspection while it was out of service so that was the first thing I had to do, it passed just fine.
04-23-2015, 04:24 AM
#26
Community Organizer
Perfect write-up from what I remember doing myself.......almost to a T. I should have done the red loctite but I think mine had to much grease on the threads inside the head.....so when I pulled the spark plug out later the timecert came with it. So the red is a GOOD choice!
04-23-2015, 04:27 AM
#27
Moderator
Anyone have a junk cylinder head sitting around? I always wanted to crank up the torque wrench in 5lb increments to see what the threads can handle before they strip. Ill bet it's over 40.
04-23-2015, 05:19 AM
#29
IDK if I would be as concerned with catostrphic failure as much as how bad you would stretch the threads in the head and potentially weaken them, maybe I am wrong though. If we are talking stripping while tightening my money is north of 80lbs