What would you do
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Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 15,323
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From: Longmont, CO
What would you do
It's getting time to finally do something with this crazy S2000 ownership situation I'm in. (For those that don't know, I have a black MY00 and a yellow MY04.)
For various reasons, I like the '00 better. However, the excellent mechanical and cosmetic condition of the '04 is a definite plus. I have some thoughts on things that can be done to the older car to get it closer to an "as new" condition. I'm looking for some feedback on these ideas (feasibility and cost) as well as suggestions that I have not thought of.
Cosmetically:
- Replace the soft top with a glass window version. The plastic window is in relatively good condition, but there are definite wear spots that will eventually turn into the infamous holes. Possibly a simply patch on the inside of the wear spot is enough for now.
- A complete re-paint. (Monte Carlo Blue, of course.) The car has more than its fair share of rock chips and such in the paint. Bumper, doors, mirrors, fenders and hood are all blemished. I understand a quality job will run in the $5000 to $7000 range, true? At the same time, swapping in '04 front and rear bumpers would be nice.
Mechanically: There's nothing actually wrong with the car at this time, but there are likely places where it can be freshened up. Is the 75,000 mile service good enough, assuming the dealership does it with proper diligence? I've quoted it at the end of this post. Some specific items of concern:
- Get all the frame geometry checked out. (The shop manual has a neat diagram of all the frame reference points and the precise distances and angles between them.) There's a slight crimp apparent in the rear-most mounting bracket of the suspension's right rear lower control arm. Possibly somebody with greater experience than I can take a look a say whether it's a potential issue.
- The left rear wheel bearing and hub have been replaced. (Somewhat common issue, actually.) Should I preemptively do the same for the right? Near the hubs are the CV joints - is it worth while to have the half-shafts taken out, inspected, and the CV joints regreased?
- The transmission exhibits the 2nd gear grind, but only after a couple hours at highway speeds. I don't think there's much I can do about that besides getting a new one or opening this one up, and I don' think the cost is worth it.
Here are some possible improvements I've been thinking of. What else can be done easily/inexpensively to improve the car's character? (I'm not interested in forced induction, by the way.
)
- Replace the suspension with a set of '04 coilovers. I actually rather like the way the '04 handles - using the Honda coilovers seems like a good way to improve the handling without getting into the harshness of many of the aftermarket products.
- Take out the stereo system Earmark installed. It's actually pretty nice, but the amp can be flaky sometimes and it's just dead weight anyway - I hardly use the radio.
Anyway, like I said I'm looking for some general ideas on what to do with an older S2000 that might give it back some of that new car feeling. All thoughts and suggestions are appreciated!
For various reasons, I like the '00 better. However, the excellent mechanical and cosmetic condition of the '04 is a definite plus. I have some thoughts on things that can be done to the older car to get it closer to an "as new" condition. I'm looking for some feedback on these ideas (feasibility and cost) as well as suggestions that I have not thought of.
Cosmetically:
- Replace the soft top with a glass window version. The plastic window is in relatively good condition, but there are definite wear spots that will eventually turn into the infamous holes. Possibly a simply patch on the inside of the wear spot is enough for now.
- A complete re-paint. (Monte Carlo Blue, of course.) The car has more than its fair share of rock chips and such in the paint. Bumper, doors, mirrors, fenders and hood are all blemished. I understand a quality job will run in the $5000 to $7000 range, true? At the same time, swapping in '04 front and rear bumpers would be nice.
Mechanically: There's nothing actually wrong with the car at this time, but there are likely places where it can be freshened up. Is the 75,000 mile service good enough, assuming the dealership does it with proper diligence? I've quoted it at the end of this post. Some specific items of concern:
- Get all the frame geometry checked out. (The shop manual has a neat diagram of all the frame reference points and the precise distances and angles between them.) There's a slight crimp apparent in the rear-most mounting bracket of the suspension's right rear lower control arm. Possibly somebody with greater experience than I can take a look a say whether it's a potential issue.
- The left rear wheel bearing and hub have been replaced. (Somewhat common issue, actually.) Should I preemptively do the same for the right? Near the hubs are the CV joints - is it worth while to have the half-shafts taken out, inspected, and the CV joints regreased?
- The transmission exhibits the 2nd gear grind, but only after a couple hours at highway speeds. I don't think there's much I can do about that besides getting a new one or opening this one up, and I don' think the cost is worth it.
Here are some possible improvements I've been thinking of. What else can be done easily/inexpensively to improve the car's character? (I'm not interested in forced induction, by the way.
)- Replace the suspension with a set of '04 coilovers. I actually rather like the way the '04 handles - using the Honda coilovers seems like a good way to improve the handling without getting into the harshness of many of the aftermarket products.
- Take out the stereo system Earmark installed. It's actually pretty nice, but the amp can be flaky sometimes and it's just dead weight anyway - I hardly use the radio.
Anyway, like I said I'm looking for some general ideas on what to do with an older S2000 that might give it back some of that new car feeling. All thoughts and suggestions are appreciated!
Originally Posted by 75,000 miles Scheduled Maintenance
- Clean air cleaner element.
- Replace coolant; use Genuine Honda Antifreeze/Coolant mixed 50/50 with water.
- Replace engine oil and filter.
- Inspect front and rear brakes.
- Check pads and discs for wear (thickness) and damage.
- Check calipers for leaks and check tightness of mount bolts. - Check tire inflation and condition.
- Inspect tie-rod ends, steering gearbox and rack boots.
- Check steering linkage for looseness.
- Check fluid lines for damage and leaks. - Inspect suspension components.
- Check bolts for tightness.
- Check condition of ball joint boots for deterioration and damage. - Inspect driveshaft for cracks and check boot bands for tightness.
- Check parking brake adjustment. Should be fully applied within 9 to 13 clicks.
- Inspect brake hoses and lines (including ABS). Check the master cylinder, proportioning control valve and ABS modulator for damage and leakage.
- Check all fluid levels, condition of fluids and check for leaks. If needed, add transmission fluid, engine coolant, brake fluid, power steering fluid, and windshield washer fluid.
- Inspect cooling system hoses and connections.
- Check for damage, leaks and deterioration.
- Check for proper fan operation. - Inspect exhaust system. Check catalytic converter heat shield, exhaust pipe, and muffler for damage, leaks, and tightness.
- Inspect fuel lines and connections. Check for leaks.
- Replace air cleaner element.
- Replace differential oil (use SAE90 hypoid gear oil, API classification GL5 or GL6).
- Lubricate all locks, latches, and hinges with multi-purpose grease or Honda White Lithium Grease.
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Joined: Jan 2002
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This is only my opinion you understand, but I would tear out the motor and tranny and put it in an Ultralite.
Then you could part out the rest of the car on the list for much more than you could get selling the complete car so in effect you would have a free engine and tranny for the US2k
Then you could part out the rest of the car on the list for much more than you could get selling the complete car so in effect you would have a free engine and tranny for the US2k
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Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 193
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From: The Colony, TX
I think this is a purely emotional decision so I say let emotion rule!
Sell Ole' Yeller, strip down Darth Vader for a new Monte Carlo Blue coat. Get a new set of '04 springs/sway bars and a couple of new, or newer seats and new top. As for the mechanicals, I'd try to get the TSB done on 1st-2nd gear, and leave everything else until something breaks (other than maintenance items). It's the perfect age to tinker with and not feel guilty if something doesn't turn out perfect...and you know you want to tinker!
Who cares if you have to buy a couple of CV joints or misc. from time to time.
And to add a small element of sanity, I'd only do this if you plan to hang on to it for at least 3 more years. I think the $-per-yr of entertainment will work out with that timeline
Sell Ole' Yeller, strip down Darth Vader for a new Monte Carlo Blue coat. Get a new set of '04 springs/sway bars and a couple of new, or newer seats and new top. As for the mechanicals, I'd try to get the TSB done on 1st-2nd gear, and leave everything else until something breaks (other than maintenance items). It's the perfect age to tinker with and not feel guilty if something doesn't turn out perfect...and you know you want to tinker!
Who cares if you have to buy a couple of CV joints or misc. from time to time.
And to add a small element of sanity, I'd only do this if you plan to hang on to it for at least 3 more years. I think the $-per-yr of entertainment will work out with that timeline
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,775
Likes: 1
From: North Austin, TX
You should give it to me! 75k miles is just getting broken in (my daily driver and autocross car will hit 100k next month), and I'll make sure it gets exercised regularly. 
Seriously, though - if you realistically looked at what it would cast you to repaint the '00, replace the front and rear bumpers, replace the top, and mechanically freshen the car, you're looking at spending over $10k, unless you cut corners on the paint job (which would be a really bad idea).
Here's my take: people don't invest $10k in $14k cars unless they really, really want to... or they're really, really stupid. I know you don't fit the latter condition, but do you fit the former?
You'll never see any of that money again (in fact, the only mod that won't likely decrease the market value of the car will be the new top), so it certainly doesn't make the slightest bit of sense financially. If you really want to and can afford to, then go for it... but if you have to justify it financially, even to yourself, then forget it.
Honestly? If you prefer the '00 that much more, but don't like the fact that your '00 has (relatively) high mileage, I'd suggest you sell 'em both... and then buy a cherry, low mileage '00. Best of both worlds.
Unfortunately, it won't have the '04 front and rear ends, the '04 suspension, or the Monte Carlo paint job. If that's the car you want, you'll have to build it yourself, and then be resigned to the fact that you won't ever see a penny of the build money again. The real question is, how bad do you really want that car?
The further you take a car from stock, the less money you'll get for it - and the harder it will be to find a buyer - when the time comes to sell it. There are exceptions to this, but it's the rule for the most part. The mods you're contemplating aren't easily reversible, so you'd better be damn sure you plan to keep that car for a loooooong time or take be willing to accept that you're pissing a large chunk of money down the toilet if you go through with it.
Seriously, though - if you realistically looked at what it would cast you to repaint the '00, replace the front and rear bumpers, replace the top, and mechanically freshen the car, you're looking at spending over $10k, unless you cut corners on the paint job (which would be a really bad idea).
Here's my take: people don't invest $10k in $14k cars unless they really, really want to... or they're really, really stupid. I know you don't fit the latter condition, but do you fit the former?
You'll never see any of that money again (in fact, the only mod that won't likely decrease the market value of the car will be the new top), so it certainly doesn't make the slightest bit of sense financially. If you really want to and can afford to, then go for it... but if you have to justify it financially, even to yourself, then forget it.
Honestly? If you prefer the '00 that much more, but don't like the fact that your '00 has (relatively) high mileage, I'd suggest you sell 'em both... and then buy a cherry, low mileage '00. Best of both worlds.
Unfortunately, it won't have the '04 front and rear ends, the '04 suspension, or the Monte Carlo paint job. If that's the car you want, you'll have to build it yourself, and then be resigned to the fact that you won't ever see a penny of the build money again. The real question is, how bad do you really want that car?
The further you take a car from stock, the less money you'll get for it - and the harder it will be to find a buyer - when the time comes to sell it. There are exceptions to this, but it's the rule for the most part. The mods you're contemplating aren't easily reversible, so you'd better be damn sure you plan to keep that car for a loooooong time or take be willing to accept that you're pissing a large chunk of money down the toilet if you go through with it.
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 9,510
Likes: 478
From: Dallas
Why do you want to continue owing two S2000's? I know their character is different, but if you're going to have two why not turn the '00 into a pure track car and race the heck out of it and keep the '04 as a nice evening/weekend driver?
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Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 2,325
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From: Rockwall, TEXAS!
Originally Posted by QUIKAG,Apr 14 2005, 12:13 AM
Why do you want to continue owing two S2000's? I know their character is different, but if you're going to have two why not turn the '00 into a pure track car and race the heck out of it and keep the '04 as a nice evening/weekend driver?
This one gets my vote. I wouldn't give it to Altiain...he doesn't need to go any faster 
But I wouldn't paint the Berlina....if you really want Monte Carlo Blue, repaint the Spa 
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Joined: Oct 2000
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From: Pflugerville, Texas
I considered trading up to an '03 model, IMO the best MY to date. Ideally I'd love to have an '03 with the driveline improvements of the '04-'05. However Honda dealerships and even AHM as of late really diminished my desire to own another Honda anytime soon.
My '00 has over 80K and is still going strong with a few improvements over the years. The glass window top was well worth the effort (thanks Clovis). The '02 spec tranny and diff give me a little more peace of mind. I may someday sell the coilovers and get something softer, better suited for Mineral Wells. I'm planning to keep the '00 until something entirely new comes along. For now I'm in hopes of a well sorted Elise in '07 or '08.
My '00 has over 80K and is still going strong with a few improvements over the years. The glass window top was well worth the effort (thanks Clovis). The '02 spec tranny and diff give me a little more peace of mind. I may someday sell the coilovers and get something softer, better suited for Mineral Wells. I'm planning to keep the '00 until something entirely new comes along. For now I'm in hopes of a well sorted Elise in '07 or '08.